Section 75 is a washout. What on earth can I do now??

[Deleted User]

I've leant my lesson. I'll just be buying this sort of stuff from Amazon in the future as I can simply send it back within 30 days if it doesn't work. I just can't handle the hassle of buying from other places.

[Deleted User]

dumpster_fire2025 said:

Ergates said:

[Deleted User] said:

Ergates said:

[Deleted User] said:

eskbanker said:

[Deleted User] said:

But when I got a response from Capital One, I just stared at the email in disbelief. The individual said:

"After reviewing the information you have provided to date, we need some further information to help us progress our investigation and establish whether we can help you with your claim.
As per visa terms and conditions goods should be return to the merchant. so please return the goods to the merchant". 

That response indicates that they're treating it as a chargeback claim rather than a s75 one, which is common practice among card providers, as it's to their advantage to do so, even though the customer has the statutory right to claim under section 75.

I can understand why you're frustrated at what you consider to be "outrageous delays", but realistically escalation to card provider or FOS or CAB, or anybody else, is highly unlikely to expedite matters so concentrating on the retailer will be more productive IMHO - the Consumer Rights Act (20(15)) does require a retailer to refund within 14 days of agreeing that the consumer is entitled to one.

The problem with accepting a replacement from Chillblast is the fact that the PC effectively became dysfunctional after just 11 days suggests their quality control is not ideal. Also, perhaps it is the combination of hardware that precipitated the fault.

Not really, that would depend entirely on what the fault is.

If the problem is caused by a fault in the build, then yes.

If it is caused by a failing component, then no.  Chillblast don't make the components, and any part that worked for 11 days after purchase would have passed any testing performed on it.

Well, you probably know more than I do. I thought there might be an incompatibility between something like the motherboard on the one hand, and RAM, CPU or whatever on the other?  But if the fault is related to my specific PC and not to that model, then getting a replacement would be OK. But that wouldn't stop my nervousness when I get my replacement! 

Whilst specific motherboards are only compatible with certain CPU, it isn't possible to fit an incompatible one - it won't physically fit (i.e. you simply cannot fit a Ryzen CPU into a motherboard designed for an Intel CPU).

Similarly with RAM - you physically can't put DDR3 RAM into a DDR4 slot (etc).

Other than that - if if fits, it should be OK.  I'd say it's most likely a failed component.

Motherboards may only support certain brands of RAM in certain configurations to get certain speeds, but it's important to note that that won't cause them to fail, they will just run a stock speeds (which will be a lot slower than they should run at.)

But yeah, as others have said, if it booted for a week and a half and then failed, it's a hardware failure, not a configuration issue.

You seem to know about this sort of stuff, so do you mind if I ask a question? My PC was simply crashing every 5 minutes or so. However, when I eventually managed to do a "reset this PC" (difficult with it constantly crashing!) my PC was working for a few hours without crashing at all. I don't know much about computers, but that made me think perhaps it might be a software problem after all?

In fact, according to that Google AI, my specific motherboard (ASUS Prime B650M-A WIFI II AMD B650 Chipset) has undergone quite a few BIOS updates in the previous year as people were experiencing crashing and other issues. But whether the AI is making stuff up, I don't know. Anyway, when I spoke to the Chillblast/Mendit engineer he was instantly dismissive that it was the BIOS saying it's highly likely to be hardware. You reckon he's definitely right?

It does make me leery about getting the exact same model of PC with the possibility of the various components not playing nicely with each other and possible BIOS issues. This is the main reason why I was wanting to get a refund so I could just simply buy a different PC. 

GDB2222

visidigi said:

I think you need to just take a step back a moment. While you might feel aggrieved at how long its taking to get it returned, you are trying to use a courier service at its most busy time of year and they have attended twice in the 9 days since the fault was determined. 

Whilst the laws say it should be done without delay, there are certain elements that go into that calculation, attempts, whether they fail or not, show resolution is being attempted by the seller.

Timeline:
Ordered 29th (which is a Saturday, not a Friday)
Presumably delivered either Monday the 1st or Tuesday the 2nd of December. 
Fault Develops on 10th of December.
Engineer visits 11th December confirms it needs to be RTB.
2 collection attempts are made in the 9 working days since. 
Due to the failures Chillblast say they will use a different courier - but it will take time to arrange.

You need to lay out what you want from Chillblast, succinctly, without words like 'outrageous', sticking to either your desire to collect and repair/replace the PC or to refund you - one requires you to enforce your statutory right to a refund, the other will require you to wait for the diagnosis/repair.

When you categorically decide which you would prefer then you should draft the required communications, including an LBA if applicable.

And no, I don't work for chillblast.

The OP said: "Another time the DPD driver said he hadn’t got either a label or a receipt to give me, so obviously I couldn’t relinquish my PC."

Out of interest, is that obvious? If the OP had handed his PC over, he could have taken pictures of the courier loading it into his van, etc. It was being collected by Chillblast, and I assume that it became their responsibility as soon as their agent (DPD) picked it up. 

I'm not sure that I have much sympathy for the OP. 

PHK

[Deleted User] said:

Alderbank said:

[Deleted User] said:

born_again said:

[Deleted User] said:

I'm unable to proceed with the section 75 claim as Chillblast has still not collected my PC. So I think my next step is to contact the financial ombudsmen service? (can't link unfortunately) 

1st you would need to go through Capital one complaints, before you can go to FOS one they have either issued a deadlock letter or 8 weeks have passed.

I can see Cap One point, you have had a PC less than a month & have not given the retailer chance to fix it.

S75 is never a quick process. 

Why do you think a retailer should refund before they have the item back & checked if it is faulty?

I'm just going by what I understand the legal position to be; namely if a newly bought product becomes dysfunctional within 30 days then the person who purchased it has the right for it be repaired/replaced/refunded without undue delay and within 14 days.  And that hasn't happened in my case. I do not recollect an exception to this rule being made for the Christmas period. 

I don't think the person at Capital One can have read anything I've said, or if he has he has not comprehended it. 

If that's what you understand then you don't understand the legal position.

When and why the goods become 'dysfunctional' is key.

The legal position is that if the goods do not conform to contract at the point of sale then you have the right under section 20 of the CRA (short term right to reject) to reject the goods and treat the contract as at an end.

You must indicate to the trader that the contract is at an end. That can be something you say or do, but it must be clear enough to be understood by the trader.

Did you do that?

The consumer right to cancel the contract only exists if the goods do not conform at the point of sale; the right does not exist if the goods became dysfunctional after the point of sale, for example such as because the unit was dropped on the floor or the ventilation was impaired causing the chips to overheat, .

A refund under section 20 must be given without undue delay, and in any event within 14 days beginning with the day on which the trader agrees that the consumer is entitled to a refund.

Has the trader agreed that? Since the unit was not DOA it is reasonable that they will need to inspect it first.

'Undue delay' is subject to a reasonableness test. That test will take the Christmas period into account both for the trader's engineering staff and any couriers they use.

I have no idea why you think this.  Even if a fault develops with 6 months (vastly longer than 30 days) it is presumed that the fault was always there since purchasing, or at least latently there at the time of purchase. And regardless of the law, the word reasonable here is not appropriate. 

This isn't right. It's always the case that the goods must be inherently faulty (at the time of contract) such that they later fail or don't last as long as they should have. The only thing that happens at six months is that the burden of proof shifts. 

Within six months the seller must prove that the goods complied with the contract. In other words that something happened to them. As Alderbank mentions: accident, abuse or misuse. 

After six months the burden switches to the consumer. The consumer must prove the goods didn't comply with the contract. 

I'd disagree about reasonableness. A court would certainly apply a reasonableness test. 

[Deleted User]

GDB2222 said:

visidigi said:

I think you need to just take a step back a moment. While you might feel aggrieved at how long its taking to get it returned, you are trying to use a courier service at its most busy time of year and they have attended twice in the 9 days since the fault was determined. 

Whilst the laws say it should be done without delay, there are certain elements that go into that calculation, attempts, whether they fail or not, show resolution is being attempted by the seller.

Timeline:
Ordered 29th (which is a Saturday, not a Friday)
Presumably delivered either Monday the 1st or Tuesday the 2nd of December. 
Fault Develops on 10th of December.
Engineer visits 11th December confirms it needs to be RTB.
2 collection attempts are made in the 9 working days since. 
Due to the failures Chillblast say they will use a different courier - but it will take time to arrange.

You need to lay out what you want from Chillblast, succinctly, without words like 'outrageous', sticking to either your desire to collect and repair/replace the PC or to refund you - one requires you to enforce your statutory right to a refund, the other will require you to wait for the diagnosis/repair.

When you categorically decide which you would prefer then you should draft the required communications, including an LBA if applicable.

And no, I don't work for chillblast.

The OP said: "Another time the DPD driver said he hadn’t got either a label or a receipt to give me, so obviously I couldn’t relinquish my PC."

Out of interest, is that obvious? If the OP had handed his PC over, he could have taken pictures of the courier loading it into his van, etc. It was being collected by Chillblast, and I assume that it became their responsibility as soon as their agent (DPD) picked it up. 

I'm not sure that I have much sympathy for the OP. 

Not according to Chillblast/Mendit who said to me:  

//"Please note that any loss or damage in transit is not MendIT’s responsibility".// (MendIT being the repair arm of Chillblast).

DPD's fault perhaps, therefore? But it's Chillblast who are using the DPD, so why inform me? It seems to me that they are implying they will hold me liable for any damage, especially if the PC is lost.

This doesn't seem right since it's completely outside my control once it's been collected! However, it will be my responsibility to have evidence that they did actually collect it. Photos are good, but also a receipt. And Mendit said it needs a label putting on. 

GDB2222

[Deleted User] said:

GDB2222 said:

visidigi said:

I think you need to just take a step back a moment. While you might feel aggrieved at how long its taking to get it returned, you are trying to use a courier service at its most busy time of year and they have attended twice in the 9 days since the fault was determined. 

Whilst the laws say it should be done without delay, there are certain elements that go into that calculation, attempts, whether they fail or not, show resolution is being attempted by the seller.

Timeline:
Ordered 29th (which is a Saturday, not a Friday)
Presumably delivered either Monday the 1st or Tuesday the 2nd of December. 
Fault Develops on 10th of December.
Engineer visits 11th December confirms it needs to be RTB.
2 collection attempts are made in the 9 working days since. 
Due to the failures Chillblast say they will use a different courier - but it will take time to arrange.

You need to lay out what you want from Chillblast, succinctly, without words like 'outrageous', sticking to either your desire to collect and repair/replace the PC or to refund you - one requires you to enforce your statutory right to a refund, the other will require you to wait for the diagnosis/repair.

When you categorically decide which you would prefer then you should draft the required communications, including an LBA if applicable.

And no, I don't work for chillblast.

The OP said: "Another time the DPD driver said he hadn’t got either a label or a receipt to give me, so obviously I couldn’t relinquish my PC."

Out of interest, is that obvious? If the OP had handed his PC over, he could have taken pictures of the courier loading it into his van, etc. It was being collected by Chillblast, and I assume that it became their responsibility as soon as their agent (DPD) picked it up. 

I'm not sure that I have much sympathy for the OP. 

Not according to Chillblast/Mendit who said to me:  

//"Please note that any loss or damage in transit is not MendIT’s responsibility".// (MendIT being the repair arm of Chillblast).

DPD's fault perhaps, therefore? But it's Chillblast who are using the DPD, so why inform me? It seems to me that they are implying they will hold me liable for any damage, especially if the PC is lost.

This doesn't seem right since it's completely outside my control once it's been collected! However, it will be my responsibility to have evidence that they did actually collect it. Photos are good, but also a receipt. And Mendit said it needs a label putting on. 

Clearly, whatever they say, if they organise the courier, it's their responsibility. Besides that, having a receipt would not alter the position unless DPD denied that they had ever picked it up. 

In practice, as you have found out, being awkward slows things down.  It's normal practice for them to want the old one back to check it over, before they send out a replacement. For all they know, you dropped it down the staircase! So, I don't agree with your assertion that they should have sent you out a replacement as soon as you were told there's a hardware issue.

By the way, the obvious thing to do is to let Chillblast repair the PC. That way, you won't lose out through rising prices. Nobody does board level repairs these days, so they'll swap out the faulty components, and you'll get new replacement parts. 

[Deleted User]

GDB2222 said:

[Deleted User] said:

GDB2222 said:

visidigi said:

I think you need to just take a step back a moment. While you might feel aggrieved at how long its taking to get it returned, you are trying to use a courier service at its most busy time of year and they have attended twice in the 9 days since the fault was determined. 

Whilst the laws say it should be done without delay, there are certain elements that go into that calculation, attempts, whether they fail or not, show resolution is being attempted by the seller.

Timeline:
Ordered 29th (which is a Saturday, not a Friday)
Presumably delivered either Monday the 1st or Tuesday the 2nd of December. 
Fault Develops on 10th of December.
Engineer visits 11th December confirms it needs to be RTB.
2 collection attempts are made in the 9 working days since. 
Due to the failures Chillblast say they will use a different courier - but it will take time to arrange.

You need to lay out what you want from Chillblast, succinctly, without words like 'outrageous', sticking to either your desire to collect and repair/replace the PC or to refund you - one requires you to enforce your statutory right to a refund, the other will require you to wait for the diagnosis/repair.

When you categorically decide which you would prefer then you should draft the required communications, including an LBA if applicable.

And no, I don't work for chillblast.

The OP said: "Another time the DPD driver said he hadn’t got either a label or a receipt to give me, so obviously I couldn’t relinquish my PC."

Out of interest, is that obvious? If the OP had handed his PC over, he could have taken pictures of the courier loading it into his van, etc. It was being collected by Chillblast, and I assume that it became their responsibility as soon as their agent (DPD) picked it up. 

I'm not sure that I have much sympathy for the OP. 

Not according to Chillblast/Mendit who said to me:  

//"Please note that any loss or damage in transit is not MendIT’s responsibility".// (MendIT being the repair arm of Chillblast).

DPD's fault perhaps, therefore? But it's Chillblast who are using the DPD, so why inform me? It seems to me that they are implying they will hold me liable for any damage, especially if the PC is lost.

This doesn't seem right since it's completely outside my control once it's been collected! However, it will be my responsibility to have evidence that they did actually collect it. Photos are good, but also a receipt. And Mendit said it needs a label putting on. 

Clearly, whatever they say, if they organise the courier, it's their responsibility. Besides that, having a receipt would not alter the position unless DPD denied that they had ever picked it up. 

In practice, as you have found out, being awkward slows things down.  It's normal practice for them to want the old one back to check it over, before they send out a replacement. For all they know, you dropped it down the staircase! So, I don't agree with your assertion that they should have sent you out a replacement as soon as you were told there's a hardware issue.

By the way, the obvious thing to do is to let Chillblast repair the PC. That way, you won't lose out through rising prices. Nobody does board level repairs these days, so they'll swap out the faulty components, and you'll get new replacement parts. 

I made no such assertion. I have no idea why people have this desire to simply make up what I say (here and everywhere else on all topics).  My implicit expectation was that they would take a couple of days to collect it, inspect it when they receive it, then send out a replacement. It's now been 2 weeks to the day since a hardware fault was suspected by the engineer and I imagine it'll be January before it is even collected. When I bought a new prebuilt PC it was because I wanted one more or less immediately. I specifically wanted one over the Christmas period, not in a month's time or however long it'll take.

GDB2222

My apologies if I misunderstood you. It’s a long thread!  

[Deleted User]

Anyway, I'm happy to get a replacement rather than a refund if my BIOS concerns are addressed that I mention above.  I'm hoping that now at least Christmas day is behind us that my PC will be picked up soon. Once that happens things might go smoothly (fingers crossed). Although I will of course need to obtain a receipt, I don't want to be held responsible if whoever collects it loses it! 

MattMattMattUK

[Deleted User] said:

I've leant my lesson. I'll just be buying this sort of stuff from Amazon in the future as I can simply send it back within 30 days if it doesn't work. I just can't handle the hassle of buying from other places.

You might have equal problems there with getting something like a large pre-built PC returned to them, especially around Christmas.

[Deleted User] said:

dumpster_fire2025 said:

Ergates said:

[Deleted User] said:

Ergates said:

[Deleted User] said:

eskbanker said:

[Deleted User] said:

But when I got a response from Capital One, I just stared at the email in disbelief. The individual said:

"After reviewing the information you have provided to date, we need some further information to help us progress our investigation and establish whether we can help you with your claim.
As per visa terms and conditions goods should be return to the merchant. so please return the goods to the merchant". 

That response indicates that they're treating it as a chargeback claim rather than a s75 one, which is common practice among card providers, as it's to their advantage to do so, even though the customer has the statutory right to claim under section 75.

I can understand why you're frustrated at what you consider to be "outrageous delays", but realistically escalation to card provider or FOS or CAB, or anybody else, is highly unlikely to expedite matters so concentrating on the retailer will be more productive IMHO - the Consumer Rights Act (20(15)) does require a retailer to refund within 14 days of agreeing that the consumer is entitled to one.

The problem with accepting a replacement from Chillblast is the fact that the PC effectively became dysfunctional after just 11 days suggests their quality control is not ideal. Also, perhaps it is the combination of hardware that precipitated the fault.

Not really, that would depend entirely on what the fault is.

If the problem is caused by a fault in the build, then yes.

If it is caused by a failing component, then no.  Chillblast don't make the components, and any part that worked for 11 days after purchase would have passed any testing performed on it.

Well, you probably know more than I do. I thought there might be an incompatibility between something like the motherboard on the one hand, and RAM, CPU or whatever on the other?  But if the fault is related to my specific PC and not to that model, then getting a replacement would be OK. But that wouldn't stop my nervousness when I get my replacement! 

Whilst specific motherboards are only compatible with certain CPU, it isn't possible to fit an incompatible one - it won't physically fit (i.e. you simply cannot fit a Ryzen CPU into a motherboard designed for an Intel CPU).

Similarly with RAM - you physically can't put DDR3 RAM into a DDR4 slot (etc).

Other than that - if if fits, it should be OK.  I'd say it's most likely a failed component.

Motherboards may only support certain brands of RAM in certain configurations to get certain speeds, but it's important to note that that won't cause them to fail, they will just run a stock speeds (which will be a lot slower than they should run at.)

But yeah, as others have said, if it booted for a week and a half and then failed, it's a hardware failure, not a configuration issue.

You seem to know about this sort of stuff, so do you mind if I ask a question? My PC was simply crashing every 5 minutes or so. However, when I eventually managed to do a "reset this PC" (difficult with it constantly crashing!) my PC was working for a few hours without crashing at all. I don't know much about computers, but that made me think perhaps it might be a software problem after all?

It could be software, it could be hardware, without more info that unfortunately does not tell us anything. When you say crash, was it a BSOD, was it just going blank, something else?

[Deleted User] said:

In fact, according to that Google AI, my specific motherboard (ASUS Prime B650M-A WIFI II AMD B650 Chipset) has undergone quite a few BIOS updates in the previous year as people were experiencing crashing and other issues. But whether the AI is making stuff up, I don't know. 

It is a lower end mATX board, but nothing bad about it, it just will not handle overclocking or higher end CPUs, but as you are not using either of those it should be perfectly fine. In terms of what the Google AI is saying, it is just skimming Reddit and getting a bunch of false positives. 

[Deleted User] said:
Anyway, when I spoke to the Chillblast/Mendit engineer he was instantly dismissive that it was the BIOS saying it's highly likely to be hardware. You reckon he's definitely right?

BIOS issues are rare, they cause specific problems and the BIOS on that chipset is now mature, very very unlikely it is causing an issue, even more so if they reset the BIOS. A hardware fault is the most likely depending on the specific "crash" scenario and I would expect that they have more data on that as they can see the error message and log reports. I would not bet my life on it, but it is the most likely probable cause if they have done some diagnosis. To be slightly blunt it seems like you have very little understanding of PC hardware and you are suggesting to someone who fixes it for a living that their diagnosis of the fault is wrong, I think I might be slightly dismissive in that situation. 

[Deleted User] said:

It does make me leery about getting the exact same model of PC with the possibility of the various components not playing nicely with each other and possible BIOS issues. This is the main reason why I was wanting to get a refund so I could just simply buy a different PC. 

[Deleted User] said:

Anyway, I'm happy to get a replacement rather than a refund if my BIOS concerns are addressed that I mention above.  I'm hoping that now at least Christmas day is behind us that my PC will be picked up soon. Once that happens things might go smoothly (fingers crossed). Although I will of course need to obtain a receipt, I don't want to be held responsible if whoever collects it loses it! 

The components will be fine, Chillblast will not sell incompatible components because it would just not work at all, not work intermittently and there is almost certainly no BIOS issue. You can ignore your BIOS concerns entirely, as well as any concerns about components being incompatible.

If you want a full refund and to buy something different then that is up to you, but it is not a logical choice.