Openreach cannot install Fibre Broadband as neighbour refusing to give permission to work

hughrobertson

I'm in a similar situation. 
You should get compensation - I got over £100 from BT for the delay and hassle, then I switched to Sky and they tried to get Openreach to do it, finally Openreach cancelled as the couldnt get permission and then SKy credited me over £500!!
Both compensations came out of the blue.
Not exactly the help you wanted but perhaps use that info to get something from Vodaphone.

Chrissieh27

Reaching out here , hope someone can advise - we have similar situation , ZZoomm are the company offering FF Broadband  and since December we have had their surveyor who said all ok, engineers who said nope there was a blockage in neighbours driveway ( we are also head of cul de sac) , then Openreach who only came two weeks ago and wanted to dig up neighbours beautifully block paved drive - even though ZZoomm say is not where Openreach say it is !!!!!!  Had ZZoomm engineers again today who are going to try again to get Openreach to try another way. We didn’t renew with Sky so are hugely out of pocket paying full price to them , nobody has mentioned any compensation to us - can you enlighten me please ? We have been told Openreach are obliged to provide us with connection but we are friends with neighbours and dont want any hassle there as we are the newbies .
thanks for any advice 

iniltous

Something doesn’t add up , ZZoomm are an Alt Net , and although they can and do leech off Openreach ducts and jointboxes (as well as poles ) your ZZoomm installation has absolutely nothing to do with Openreach , if the Openreach duct that  ZZoomm want to use us blocked or in some way unusable, that’s for ZZoomm to deal with , not Openreach , so why are Openreach even mentioned by the Alt Net ?

Chrissieh27

Alt Net ? Alternative network ?  Thanks for replying ,  ZZoomm appeared all over our postcode area last year . When another near neighbour signed up they also had a blockage and it was Openreach who came out and dig a new hole ,  cleared blockage and tarmaced over.   After their visit to us  Openreach apparently told ZZoomm they were dine with us they could send their Wayleave team in , as we understood it it’s Openreach infrastructure so ZZoomm have to defer to them ? 

iniltous

That’s not really how PIA (physical infrastructure access ) the mandate that gives Alternative Networks access to Openreach infrastructure works , if an Alt Net encounters a problem in an Openreach duct etc , they generally arrange to ‘fix’ the issue themselves at their own expense , after all Openreach are not wanting to use this duct so it’s current condition is irrelevant to OR , the Alt Net is free to build some infrastructure of their own to get around the OR blockage , but they realise fixing the OR duct is cheaper so the Alt Net does that .

FYI , Alt Nets pay a few pennies per meter for accessing OR ducts , it would be beyond belief that the could say to Openreach ( for example) we want to use this 10 meters of your duct and will pay 50p a year to rent space in it , but it’s blocked and so you need to pay for the ‘repair’ ( that isn’t needed by OR but the Alt Net ) and then that repair costs Openreach hundreds of £££’s , an Alt Net could basically bankrupt Openreach simply by going around finding blocked ducts and insisting they are repaired (if it were at OR’s cost ) , putting up OR’s costs makes the Alt Net cheaper in comparison.

Chrissieh27

Thanks for the info , as I said only going by what happened to other neighbour .  So now thinking ZZoomm maybe giving us the run around ? Hope it’s ok to quote you ?  Our current contract is with SKY , would it be the same with them ?  Thanks again .
We signed up in November last year so if anyone has advice re possible compensation please ?

littleboo

Zoom are not part of the Ofcom Automatic Compensation scheme. Most of the ALtNets choose not to be. So there is no pre-agreed mechanism and rate for compensation, unless there is something that Zoom offer outside of that scheme.
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/phones-and-broadband/service-quality/automatic-compensation-need-know

Chrissieh27

Just a quick update !  ZZoomm insisted that Openreach were responsible for sorting out the blockage issue , everyone agreed digging up the neighbours newly paved  drive wasn’t an option ( oh and then OR found a second blockage) but nobody wants to provide a solution.ZZoomm apologetic but no compensation , my beef is that Zzoomm surveyor gave this installation the go ahead beach in December , we wouldn’t have gone ahead if we hadn’t been given the all clear .Openreach have been awful, engineers repeatedly turning up  announced , not speaking to us but bothering neighbours . They refused to engage with us and shut down the order twice without notifying ZZoomm which caused long delays .     Be aware folks.

iniltous

https://zzoomm.com/help/installation/what-happens-during-my-installation

Openreach have absolutely no relationship with you , you are not an Openreach customer , ZZoomm are a direct competitor to Openreach so why would OR be bending over backwards to assist a competitor ? Openreach  have a certain responsibility to Zzoomm (not you) that’s forced up on them by the regulator Ofcom , in other words OR can’t stop Zzoomm  or anyone else putting their own cables in Openreach ducts , but I’m sure what Zzoomm are saying as far as OR responsibility to ZZoomm about duct repair is wrong or hugely exaggerated ……I’m sceptical about what the say in that OR are responsible for unblocking the duct , they are not , that isn’t really the way PIA physical infrastructure access works , the ‘law’ that gives ZZoomm  the right to use OR infrastructure, where Zzoomm  pay a few pennys per metre per  year to use the Openreach duct to your home , OR are not expected to pay hundreds or possibly thousands of ££’s to fix a duct to get a few quid back in ‘rent’  , if the OR duct is damaged , ALT Nets usually either put in their own duct alongside, or they fix the OR duct themselves, after all it’s Zzoomm that want to use it , not Openreach , that Openreach duct being damaged isn’t affecting OR business at all , the Ofcom policy is unfair but not to the extent that OR have to pay a fortune to fix ducts that then enable competitors to get cables to their customers, there is a limit to the advantage Alt Nets are given by Ofcom , and duct repairs are one of those limits.

Have you asked Zzoomm , if the OR duct isn’t going to be fixed by OR ,( and you can’t really blame OR for that , as you are not a customer of an Openreach based provider ,  if ZZoomm are confident its Openreach responsibility to fix and they are not doing what is required of them , why haven’t Zzoomm reported the breach to Ofcom , surely if Zzoomm are correctly, they will be complaining to Ofcom to make OR ‘do the work ‘ , the reason why they haven’t is because they know it nonsense.


Why are  ZZoomm are not fixing the duct themselves ( they can do that it’s allowed under PIA regulations ) or why aren’t they providing a new ZZoomm duct of their own to your house  , after all they are a network provider , digging up the roads and footpaths is something they do every day , isn’t that an obvious solution ?, isn’t it easier for them to simply not bother with the OR duct , and instead of the long delay and ZZoomm blaming others  , just put in their own duct  in , wouldn’t that have  solved the problem  ? , did  you ask them why they didn’t consider doing that ?.

 If things have now moved on , and your neighbours won’t allow a new duct as it would have to cross their property, and they don’t want excavation (something duct repair would also need ) there is not much can be done by anyone about that, if ZZoomm didn’t spot the blockages when you first ordered service with ZZoomm , isn’t that clearly Zzoomms fault ?, if your complaint is about the length of time it took to tell you you can’t have Zzoomm , and the lack of compensation, again that’s between you and Zzoomm , nothing to do with Openreach , if Openreach have failed Zzoomm in any way , Zzoomm can always claim compo from Openreach if there has been a breach in the contract between Zzoomm and OR , OR would never owe you a penny because you never were their customer.

To be a little blunt , the fact is you are a ZZoomm customer , your contract is was only ever with them , if they can’t provide your service you can blame whoever you like , but you only ever had a contractual relationship with ZZoomm , Openreach owe you absolutely nothing , you are not and never were an Openreach customer, OR  have no need to tell you anything because you are not a customer , in fact the rules stipulate that all and every communication about this , from your point of view , is via ZZoomm as they are your provider   , if you have no ZZoomm  service after ordering with them , that’s entirely Zzoomms fault , no one else’s , regardless of what they are telling you ,of course if you chose to believe the nonsense they are feeding you ,  that’s your prerogative 

Chrissieh27

Well that’s blunt for sure , i dont appreciate the tone of your reply but your initial response was helpful.
the fact remains Openreach were awful. They arrived unannounced hammering on the door 0830 , parked in our drive and said we just need to speak to neighbour , we will have you connected today .   We stayed in all day and they never came back . Turns out they got the neighbour to come home from work , said they needed to dig up his drive  ( in the wrong place again as indicated by video) and shrugged and drove off when he declined. You can only complain about OR engineers via a chat line , not responsive and they didn’t respond to Zzoomm either they just shut down the order which had to be reinstated by ZZoomm .    Another engineer came and did the same thing but told neighbour there were now two blockages found, one of which will affect another neighbour .   

Thanks to littleboo for reminder re Ofcom compensation scheme.