Section 13 rent increase

user1977

Halabala9 said:

BarelySentientAI said:

Asking for an S21 is a very strange idea.  If you want to leave, you give notice and leave, you don't ask to be evicted.

And as mentioned above, neither cancels out a rent increase.

Your protection against a 50% increase is the tribunal, at which the argument would be that 50% increase puts it way above market rent.

How much are we arguing about here? What is one month's worth of the tent increase (you say you're only paying it for a month), £50 in total? £100?

Asking for S21 in my case isn't a strange idea. As I mentioned, I'm 4 months into purchasing a flat, I've got most likely 4-6 weeks left before I can move in, so I can't give 30 days notice now. S21 gives me 2 months, so that would most likely work for me.

You could give longer than 30 days notice - that's a minimum, you don't need to hit the exact date.

BarelySentientAI

Halabala9 said:

BarelySentientAI said:

Asking for an S21 is a very strange idea.  If you want to leave, you give notice and leave, you don't ask to be evicted.

And as mentioned above, neither cancels out a rent increase.

Your protection against a 50% increase is the tribunal, at which the argument would be that 50% increase puts it way above market rent.

How much are we arguing about here? What is one month's worth of the tent increase (you say you're only paying it for a month), £50 in total? £100?

Asking for S21 in my case isn't a strange idea. As I mentioned, I'm 4 months into purchasing a flat, I've got most likely 4-6 weeks left before I can move in, so I can't give 30 days notice now. S21 gives me 2 months, so that would most likely work for me. And when I'm saying "tricks", I'm not talking about anything illegal. It's more about "tricks" people use for S21 like when gas certificate (or EPC certificate) isn't up to date, the S21 then isn't valid etc. Hence my question about serving S13 notice method. I need to check the tenancy agreement.

We are talking about £200 here but as I mentioned, it's not about money it that case. It is one of those "Enough is enough" situations. For that money, there are flats available in the nicest parts of the city (and trust me, that building isn't nice and isn't in a nice area...), on top of that raising it right at the end, when she is about to finish her sale and I am about to finish my purchase makes that absurd situation even worse. Call me a weirdo, but she is taking the !!!!!! here and I don't like when people are playing with me like that. When she was organizing viewings, I was never making it difficult, even when I was getting 30min notice. I was going for a walk, so they can show the flat. When I was away I was always letting them in the flat with their keys no problem and those viewings were very painful, because she couldn't find a buyer for a long time due to high price she wanted. I was always paying on time and had a really good relationship with that couple, so I can't understand the level of absurd of that situtation. 

Does sound like a pretty poor way she's dealt with things - I"d still be on the side of "screw it, what's £200 in the big picture and I'm getting rid of her anyway" though.

Jemma01

Halabala9 said:

BarelySentientAI said:

Asking for an S21 is a very strange idea.  If you want to leave, you give notice and leave, you don't ask to be evicted.

And as mentioned above, neither cancels out a rent increase.

Your protection against a 50% increase is the tribunal, at which the argument would be that 50% increase puts it way above market rent.

How much are we arguing about here? What is one month's worth of the tent increase (you say you're only paying it for a month), £50 in total? £100?

Asking for S21 in my case isn't a strange idea. As I mentioned, I'm 4 months into purchasing a flat, I've got most likely 4-6 weeks left before I can move in, so I can't give 30 days notice now. S21 gives me 2 months, so that would most likely work for me. And when I'm saying "tricks", I'm not talking about anything illegal. It's more about "tricks" people use for S21 like when gas certificate (or EPC certificate) isn't up to date, the S21 then isn't valid etc. Hence my question about serving S13 notice method. I need to check the tenancy agreement.

We are talking about £200 here but as I mentioned, it's not about money it that case. It is one of those "Enough is enough" situations. For that money, there are flats available in the nicest parts of the city (and trust me, that building isn't nice and isn't in a nice area...), on top of that raising it right at the end, when she is about to finish her sale and I am about to finish my purchase makes that absurd situation even worse. Call me a weirdo, but she is taking the !!!!!! here and I don't like when people are playing with me like that. When she was organizing viewings, I was never making it difficult, even when I was getting 30min notice. I was going for a walk, so they can show the flat. When I was away I was always letting them in the flat with their keys no problem and those viewings were very painful, because she couldn't find a buyer for a long time due to high price she wanted. I was always paying on time and had a really good relationship with that couple, so I can't understand the level of absurd of that situtation. 

The highlighted part gives the impression that you think S21 cancels out S13. It doesn't. Even if you get S21 (which again makes no sense, as you can give your notice without eviction), the rent will still be increased over those 2 months. So why bother with S21 if you still need to pay the increase? The landlord is still within their right to increase the rent, your situation is understood, it's just not the landlord's problem.

_Penny_Dreadful

Halabala9 said:

BarelySentientAI said:

Asking for an S21 is a very strange idea.  If you want to leave, you give notice and leave, you don't ask to be evicted.

And as mentioned above, neither cancels out a rent increase.

Your protection against a 50% increase is the tribunal, at which the argument would be that 50% increase puts it way above market rent.

How much are we arguing about here? What is one month's worth of the tent increase (you say you're only paying it for a month), £50 in total? £100?

Asking for S21 in my case isn't a strange idea. As I mentioned, I'm 4 months into purchasing a flat, I've got most likely 4-6 weeks left before I can move in, so I can't give 30 days notice now. S21 gives me 2 months, so that would most likely work for me. And when I'm saying "tricks", I'm not talking about anything illegal. It's more about "tricks" people use for S21 like when gas certificate (or EPC certificate) isn't up to date, the S21 then isn't valid etc. Hence my question about serving S13 notice method. I need to check the tenancy agreement.

We are talking about £200 here but as I mentioned, it's not about money it that case. It is one of those "Enough is enough" situations. For that money, there are flats available in the nicest parts of the city (and trust me, that building isn't nice and isn't in a nice area...), on top of that raising it right at the end, when she is about to finish her sale and I am about to finish my purchase makes that absurd situation even worse. Call me a weirdo, but she is taking the !!!!!! here and I don't like when people are playing with me like that. When she was organizing viewings, I was never making it difficult, even when I was getting 30min notice. I was going for a walk, so they can show the flat. When I was away I was always letting them in the flat with their keys no problem and those viewings were very painful, because she couldn't find a buyer for a long time due to high price she wanted. I was always paying on time and had a really good relationship with that couple, so I can't understand the level of absurd of that situtation. 

Asking for a Section 21 is nonsensical.  A Section 21 does not that end the tenancy as that can only be done by you (the tenant) or a court.  Why do you think it is 30 days notice that is required rather than a full tenancy period?  Do you have a contractual periodic tenancy rather than a statutory periodic tenancy? 

Post 4: Ending/renewing an AST: what happens when a fixed term ends? How can a LL or tenant end a tenancy? What is a periodic tenancy?

The are few defences against a correctly issued Section 13 notice.  One is to go to tribunal if the new rent being proposed is way above market rents for similar properties in the area.  Should you be unsuccessful at tribunal the rent increase will be back-dated to when it should have started.  Another would be if you did not receive sufficient notice of the increase.  If you pay your rent monthly then one month's notice is required with the increased rent being due on the first day of the tenancy period following the notice.

Post 5: Rent increases: when & how can rent be increased?

You've had enough of your landlord and you think the increase is too high so take it to tribunal if/when you receive the Section 13 notice in the post.

PRAISETHESUN

Asking your LL to issue a section 21 notice doesn't really do anything helpful in your circumstances. S21 is just a notice that the LL intends to start legal proceedings, it doesn't require you to move out of the property. The tenancy only ends when you serve your notice to vacate, or a court orders you to leave. If you want to move out before a court has issued an eviction order, then you still need to serve your notice. S21 or not you will still need to serve notice, so there's no benefit here.

You can serve notice to be effective at any point in the future, as long as it takes effect at the correct time (typically 1 tenancy period in the future, but again check your TA for the specifics). I wouldn't recommend serving notice until you've exchanged on your house purchase, but otherwise you could serve notice now if you wanted to take effect in 4-6 weeks time (or however long a gap you need).

As for the "legality" of the WhatsApp message, I'd suggest you check in your TA how notices can be served. I'd imagine it's not allowed, and it might just be an unofficial "heads up" before an official notice comes in the post or another allowed method.

Halabala9

Thanks guys for all your responses, that is very helpful. 

One more question about my 30 days notice. Is it 30 days from any day I serve the notice or does it have to be full rental period?

What I mean, if the contract is on 1 month rolling from let's say 14th of every month, if I give 30 days notice on 5th, do I need to wait 5th-13th + full rental period till 14th next month or is it going to be 5th - 5th?

I hope it makes sense.

_Penny_Dreadful

Halabala9 said:

Thanks guys for all your responses, that is very helpful. 

One more question about my 30 days notice. Is it 30 days from any day I serve the notice or does it have to be full rental period?

What I mean, if the contract is on 1 month rolling from let's say 14th of every month, if I give 30 days notice on 5th, do I need to wait 5th-13th + full rental period till 14th next month or is it going to be 5th - 5th?

I hope it makes sense.

What kind of tenancy do you have? Contractual periodic tenancy or a statutory periodic tenancy? 

Halabala9

 A_Penny_Dreadful said:

Halabala9 said:

Thanks guys for all your responses, that is very helpful. 

One more question about my 30 days notice. Is it 30 days from any day I serve the notice or does it have to be full rental period?

What I mean, if the contract is on 1 month rolling from let's say 14th of every month, if I give 30 days notice on 5th, do I need to wait 5th-13th + full rental period till 14th next month or is it going to be 5th - 5th?

I hope it makes sense.

What kind of tenancy do you have? Contractual periodic tenancy or a statutory periodic tenancy? 

Statutory. It was 12 months AST, and when it ended, I stayed in, so it became 1 month rolling.

propertyrental

Halabala9 said:

 A_Penny_Dreadful said:

Halabala9 said:

Thanks guys for all your responses, that is very helpful. 

One more question about my 30 days notice. Is it 30 days from any day I serve the notice or does it have to be full rental period?

What I mean, if the contract is on 1 month rolling from let's say 14th of every month, if I give 30 days notice on 5th, do I need to wait 5th-13th + full rental period till 14th next month or is it going to be 5th - 5th?

I hope it makes sense.

What kind of tenancy do you have? Contractual periodic tenancy or a statutory periodic tenancy? 

Statutory. It was 12 months AST, and when it ended, I stayed in, so it became 1 month rolling.

Does not answer the question. Did the original 12 month contract have a clause specifying what happens at the end, particularly regarding Notice (which could 2 months if it's a CPT, not SPT)

If it IS SPT then notice is one full tenancy period, ending on the last day of the period (usually day before your next rent payment/period)

Halabala9

propertyrental said:

Halabala9 said:

 A_Penny_Dreadful said:

Halabala9 said:

Thanks guys for all your responses, that is very helpful. 

One more question about my 30 days notice. Is it 30 days from any day I serve the notice or does it have to be full rental period?

What I mean, if the contract is on 1 month rolling from let's say 14th of every month, if I give 30 days notice on 5th, do I need to wait 5th-13th + full rental period till 14th next month or is it going to be 5th - 5th?

I hope it makes sense.

What kind of tenancy do you have? Contractual periodic tenancy or a statutory periodic tenancy? 

Statutory. It was 12 months AST, and when it ended, I stayed in, so it became 1 month rolling.

Does not answer the question. Did the original 12 month contract have a clause specifying what happens at the end, particularly regarding Notice (which could 2 months if it's a CPT, not SPT)

If it IS SPT then notice is one full tenancy period, ending on the last day of the period (usually day before your next rent payment/period)

Sorry, it actually says CPT now 1 month rolling since AST ended.

- The Landlord must give notice of no less than two months, such notice to expire any time on or after the

final day of the Initial Term. A notice served by the Landlord under section 21 of the Housing Act 1988 shall be sufficient notice under this clause.

- The Tenant must give notice of no less than one month, such notice to expire the day before a Rent Payment Day or on the final day of the Initial Term.

Not sure how to understand that. Such notice to expire the day before a Rent Payment Day? However the landlords notice "to expire anytime", so she doesn't have to wait till the rent date but I do?

Then it says:

If neither party serves a valid notice to terminate the tenancy at the end of the Initial Term, the parties agree that at the end of the Initial Term the tenancy will continue as a contractual periodic tenancy on a monthly basis.