Landis GYR+ E470 Type 5394

NiceDogMan

BarelySentientAI said:

You don't have the same problem at all.

They had an actually impossible - physically impossible - set of readings, that they could pinpoint when they occurred and prove that they could only have been caused by an error in the meter.

You have some readings that you think are a bit higher than they should be, and are alleging deliberate fraud and meter tampering on behalf of the supplier because of it.

Unless you have much better information that you have chosen not to tell us, I would keep the (barely veiled) claims of illegal behaviour to a minimum.

WOW!!  That's all a bit harsh ... and maybe shows you have not read all of my previous replies in depth ...

I think if you read further back, and in my last, you will see that I don't claim to have "the same problem" ... I clearly say I feel I have a similar problem of inexplicably high charging.

You will also see that I have mentioned that charges applied for 7hrs of overnight usage at a cheaper rate have at times been TWICE the value of those made for 17hrs daytime usage at a higher rate ... and over a ten month period, with no change in usage patterns outside that period ... which I think qualifies those charges as being more than "a bit higher than they should be".

I also haven't alleged deliberate fraud and meter tampering ... I do not have evidence that this has occurred ... I have merely suggested an option that has possibilities that are as yet unclarified ... and until I have an unquestionably correct explanation for the anomaly that has occurred with my energy consumption/charges, I reserve the very reasonable right to consider all possibilities and invite fair and balanced comment from well-intentioned contributors.

I have stated before that I will post my own thread on this issue to avoid hijacking whaticallmother's thread ... and that is why I have only given a limited overview here of the issues I have had.  Perhaps you missed that I had said that ... but my own thread, when uploaded, will give all of the detail I can provide, and I will be pleased to receive further helpful comment there .... in due course ...

BarelySentientAI

NiceDogMan said:

I have stated before that I will post my own thread on this issue to avoid hijacking whaticallmother's thread ... and that is why I have only given a limited overview here of the issues I have had.  Perhaps you missed that I had said that ... but my own thread, when uploaded, will give all of the detail I can provide, and I will be pleased to receive further helpful comment there .... in due course ...

If you want help and advice on that thread, leaning very heavily towards conspiracy theories as your "keeping options open" is not useful. 

Approaching it with "has my meter had an error", or "how can I tell whether this was a one-off glitch or an inaccurate meter", or even "what evidence is best to approach the supplier/ombusdsman/court with a complaint", will get you balanced and useful comment.

Your supplier has not deliberately modified the readings on your meter in the hopes of gaining what to them is minimal additional income and even more minimal additional profit.

NiceDogMan

BarelySentientAI said:

NiceDogMan said:

I have stated before that I will post my own thread on this issue to avoid hijacking whaticallmother's thread ... and that is why I have only given a limited overview here of the issues I have had.  Perhaps you missed that I had said that ... but my own thread, when uploaded, will give all of the detail I can provide, and I will be pleased to receive further helpful comment there .... in due course ...

If you want help and advice on that thread, leaning very heavily towards conspiracy theories as your "keeping options open" is not useful. 

Approaching it with "has my meter had an error", or "how can I tell whether this was a one-off glitch or an inaccurate meter", or even "what evidence is best to approach the supplier/ombusdsman/court with a complaint", will get you balanced and useful comment.

Your supplier has not deliberately modified the readings on your meter in the hopes of gaining what to them is minimal additional income and even more minimal additional profit.

I note that you have quickly modified your initial response to my last ... I have therefore been unable to respond to the points you raised there, although I appreciate that what you have now given a far more reasonable than your original post.

 I have no desire to be controversial or adversarial, but I will always state my concerns and raise challenges that I feel are reasonable and deserve a fair hearing ... and undoubtedly that will not be in accord with everyone's likes, beliefs or opinions, but that is the nature of open debate and discussion.

Such is life ...

FreeBear

BarelySentientAI said: Approaching it with "has my meter had an error", or "how can I tell whether this was a one-off glitch or an inaccurate meter", or even "what evidence is best to approach the supplier/ombusdsman/court with a complaint", will get you balanced and useful comment.

About the only low cost answer I can come up with for evidencing glitches is to install your own meter and logging equipment. This could be done with an emonPi2 (for £256), or for less than £50 if you are willing to mess with computers. But neither option will be MID certified, so I don't know how much weight the ombudsman would attach to the data. Certified measuring & logging equipment comes with a hefty price tag.
Another option is to purchase your own electricity meter and get an electrician to wire it up along side your existing meter. Again, a supplier or the ombudsman may not accept the data. But if you took readings on a daily basis, you'd know pretty quick if there had been a glitch.

BarelySentientAI

FreeBear said:

BarelySentientAI said: Approaching it with "has my meter had an error", or "how can I tell whether this was a one-off glitch or an inaccurate meter", or even "what evidence is best to approach the supplier/ombusdsman/court with a complaint", will get you balanced and useful comment.

About the only low cost answer I can come up with for evidencing glitches is to install your own meter and logging equipment. This could be done with an emonPi2 (for £256), or for less than £50 if you are willing to mess with computers. But neither option will be MID certified, so I don't know how much weight the ombudsman would attach to the data. Certified measuring & logging equipment comes with a hefty price tag.
Another option is to purchase your own electricity meter and get an electrician to wire it up along side your existing meter. Again, a supplier or the ombudsman may not accept the data. But if you took readings on a daily basis, you'd know pretty quick if there had been a glitch.

That's probably the simplest way - and/or getting hold of the 30 minute data.  Then where there is a situation like the impossible usage earlier in the thread, there is good evidence for it.

The next step would be exclusion of general problems - creep test to rule out general inaccuracy, checking for corrupted comms data, fitting a check meter etc.

Then the final step, which I've done a few times before on claims, is to try and replicate the unusual behaviour of the meter through experiments and theorising how the internal components could react to particular disturbing signals.  Academically, certain sensing methods are prone to saturation, others susceptible to aliasing, some have peak lopping issues....