Parking Charge Notice: Parkingeye, Sainsburys Eltham

busymerchbee73

will do and thankyou couponmad.... do you think the rest seems to be okay and I might have a chance?  They've already tried to settle for £60.

busymerchbee73

ok, so I need to add Excel v Wilkinson transcript into exhibit..... looks like i have to apply for it from court and pay a fee? Is there any other way you can advise how to get it?

Gr1pr

Is it not free to download in the judgments post by Le_Kirk  ?

busymerchbee73

found it thank you. 

busymerchbee73

Please can I ask - should I send it all as one large document altogether  - witness statement and exhibits and costs, or send separate files?    I've pasted in the Wilkinson transcript as exhibit, should I also paste in open consultation code of practice document as I refer to that too?

Also, I have previously emailed to Bromley Court, but more recently had comms to say the case will be at Royal Courts of Justice.... so who should I email the WS to?

Coupon-mad

Send it by email to the place where the hearing will take place (cc in the Claimant's legal team).

Email it as two attached PDFs: one is the signed & dated WS and one is a merged PDF of all your exhibits... surely you have more than just Excel v Wilkinson? There's a whole recommended exhibits list in the Newbies thread!

should I also paste in open consultation code of practice document as I refer to that too?

No, link that.

busymerchbee73

Thanks @Coupon-mad.  I might be confused and I need help.

My WS refers to Hudson v Excel, Jolley v Carmel, ParkingEye v Beavis, Taylor v Caldwell, National Carriers v Panalpina, Excel v Wilkinson, ParkingEye v Somerfield.

I have very few exhibits - just screenshots of my app payment processing, letter from carpark operator and I have added the transcripts for Excel v Wilkinson.  Do I need to add transcripts for the other cases?

I am trying my best to follow the NEWBIE advice and other examples, but I don't have many exhibits because I have ruled out the following as inappropriate:-

(a) a copy of the Beavis case sign as a comparison to show how awful the small print sign was in yours case (see Google images - it's yellow and black)

(b) photos proving the scarce/illegible small print signs & a view showing the lack of entrance signs, etc. and maybe a video of how it looks from a car? Get a passenger to hold a camera or phone to prove the lack of signs in similar light conditions.

(c). If the Claim form did not specify the term breached, include the strike out orders shown here in a link to CEL v Chan and similar case 'strike out' Judgments from all over the English courts:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/80812842/#Comment_80812842

...and use wording like this to refer to those exhibits - note that the lead cases is CEL v Chan and CPMS v Akande as both were heard in Appeal and are persuasive::
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/80516020#Comment_80516020

(d) if you are relying on a 'no keeper liability' argument, include a URL to Schedule 4 of the POFA and also exhibit the transcripts of Excel v Smith and VCS v Edward (search the forum!).

(e) a copy of your lease or tenancy agreement if this is an 'own space' dispute where YOU have primacy of contract.

(f) other case transcripts that support your defence, e.g. if arguing that this is a residential space where the tenant/leaseholder has already been granted the right to park or unload, you need Jopson v HomeGuard (appeal) and PACE v Mr N, etc.
(g) the IPC or BPA Code of practice, where it supports your case (e.g. grace periods);

(h) Pay & Display ticket, if the driver paid. DON'T argue 'no loss'!

(i) paras 98, 193 and 198 from Parking Eye v Beavis copied & pasted onto a single sheet.


What am I doing wrong?  This WS has taken me ages to write and it's obviously still not good....   paying the £60 charge vs losing and paying over £200 is becoming appealing!

Coupon-mad

Coupon-mad said:

Claim form for context:

In your para 14, add a link to (and quote from) the current (open!) MHCLG Public Consultation - we have a whole ongoing thread about it.

The bit to quote is the Government's clear stated intention to add another circumstance where PCNs must be cancelled (they should not get issued at all) which specifically lists 'app failure'.

Also you've mentioned Excel v Wilkinson twice but not put the transcript as an exhibit! It's an unreported case so the Judge won't have access to it like he/she does to higher authorities like Beavis that you don't have to exhibit. 

I already answered that, above.

You are right to exclude those other exhibits in your case. So you are ready I think?!

busymerchbee73

Thank you @Coupon-mad

Sorry, but I had thought when you said "surely you have more than just Excel v Wilkinson? There's a whole recommended exhibits list in the Newbies thread!"..... that I was needing to add a lot more cases in exhibits.

As I am not a litigious person, how can I decipher if the judge will need a transcript of the case?  i.e. what is the difference between Excel v Wilkinson and ParkingEye v Beavis and how would I know which case has a "higher authority"? 

** does Hudson v Excel need to be included in exhibit if I'm using it?  and Somerfield too?

Coupon-mad

Never heard of Hudson. There probably isn't a transcript and I don't know where you got it?

As I said, with 'reported' cases, the judge can find it on their system or by Googling.

I assumed all the other ones were cases you'd found by Googling?

We know about Beavis, Somerfield and Jolley v Carmel.  They are easy to find. Reported cases. No need to exhibit them.