Which Energy Suppliers (if any) Will Supply to Customer Using Own Meters

Bernard_Nurse

lohr500 said:

Presumably if you don't have a smart electricity meter, then won't a smart gas meter be dumb anyway?
Except in a very few cases, isn't it the case that the smart gas meter communicates data via the comms hub fitted on the electricity meter?

I wasn't aware of that but given current tariff is dual fuel, can now (having assumed they'd want to replace both regardless given the electric meter is past its certification date if they're already doing the gas), see where this road is likely to lead.

The potential new supplier is also happy to replace the electric meter with a new traditional one if I pay the cost of that too.  Just waiting on email confirmation before initiating the switch over.

Gerry1

CouldntResist said:

You are free to fit your own meter somewhere (presumably leaving theirs alone as not your property to tamper with), suppliers are free to refuse you as a customer with that meter.

Nope.  If your own private meter is downstream of their meter then it's none of their concern.  They will simply ignore it (unless it prevents their meter being read or they consider it dangerous).

However, the OP wants to replace the existing defective meter, so fitting an additional private meter would not achieve the desired result.

victor2

Bernard_Nurse said:

...

The potential new supplier is also happy to replace the electric meter with a new traditional one if I pay the cost of that too.  Just waiting on email confirmation before initiating the switch over.

If the supplier will actually do that, it will get you what you want, but you won't "own" the meter.

Ofgem do actually state:

Unless there is a good reason not to, suppliers must install a smart meter if they are:

• replacing a meter
• installing a meter for the first time, such as in a new property.
  

bagand96

Bernard_Nurse said:

SAC2334 said:

Just get smart meters fitted and stop a needless complaint .You will learn to love them especially if you join Octopus and go on their smart meter tariffs.My last electric bill on a variable direct debit I was billed at 11.58 p a kwh for 30 days on Octopus Agile   and my gas bill on Octopus Tracker was billed at only 3.60 p a kwh ,  and even the daily standing charge was much lower than the capped rate in my area which is now 65 p a day whereas my Octopus Agile tariff was 51 p .

This is a money saving forum so my advice to save the most money is to get smart meters and move to Octopus Energy using a customer referrel code to collect £50 at the same time .

OK , you can certainly buy a new old stock G4 gas meter  (£50 ) and a very unreliable cheap basic digital electric meter (£40 ) and pay through the nose costing £100 s for a qualified gas safe and a qualified  electrician to fit them but the suppliers will not adopt them into their systems for billing .

I did see a Youtube of this woman claiming to make it work but its a scam and its her husband who actually charges £400 to fit them , then they  have the same problem of suppliers refusing to accept them.  

Thank you for your opinion, and I'm very glad you're happy with your choices, although I did open the thread with 'Before I begin, I can see there have been plenty of opinions on here for and against smart meters.  Not looking for a debate along those lines, just advice on the following:'

I may have found a supplier that will take me on with the defective meter and allow me to pay for it to be replaced with another traditional one once on their books.  I will report back in due course...

Sounds like that will work, keep us updated. 

What happens at the point in the future when smart meters are mandated though? 

Bernard_Nurse

victor2 said:

Bernard_Nurse said:

...

The potential new supplier is also happy to replace the electric meter with a new traditional one if I pay the cost of that too.  Just waiting on email confirmation before initiating the switch over.

If the supplier will actually do that, it will get you what you want, but you won't "own" the meter.

Ofgem do actually state:

Unless there is a good reason not to, suppliers must install a smart meter if they are:

• replacing a meter
• installing a meter for the first time, such as in a new property.
  

At this moment in time, I don't really care whether I or the supplier owns a meter.  For me to do the latter means more expense etc and is only being considered as a last resort.

What I do care about is continuing to have traditional meters until such time as smart meters are (as they surely will be in due course) mandatory. 

What you have quoted Ofgem wise are 'guidelines' not legislation.

As an aside, this is from their website: 
'Our enforcement powers and action

The legal requirements that we can enforce, include:

Enforcing licence conditions and other relevant requirements

We can impose financial penalties of up to 10% of a regulated person’s turnover, make consumer redress orders and issue provisional/final orders, where appropriate, for breaches of relevant licence conditions and other relevant requirements (and certain other provisions) under the Gas Act 1986 and the Electricity Act 1989.'

So there is a question here as to how the guidelines relate to supplier licencing conditions etc.

Bernard_Nurse

bagand96 said:
.

Sounds like that will work, keep us updated. 

What happens at the point in the future when smart meters are mandated though? 

Then we are all screwed but at least I will have made room for one more tin foil hat in the cupboard I'm currently keeping them all in - space is becoming increasingly limited. ;-)

Spoonie_Turtle

Bernard_Nurse said:

victor2 said:

Bernard_Nurse said:

...

The potential new supplier is also happy to replace the electric meter with a new traditional one if I pay the cost of that too.  Just waiting on email confirmation before initiating the switch over.

If the supplier will actually do that, it will get you what you want, but you won't "own" the meter.

Ofgem do actually state:

Unless there is a good reason not to, suppliers must install a smart meter if they are:

• replacing a meter
• installing a meter for the first time, such as in a new property.
  

As an aside, this is from their website: 
'Our enforcement powers and action

The legal requirements that we can enforce, include:

Enforcing licence conditions and other relevant requirements

We can impose financial penalties of up to 10% of a regulated person’s turnover, make consumer redress orders and issue provisional/final orders, where appropriate, for breaches of relevant licence conditions and other relevant requirements (and certain other provisions) under the Gas Act 1986 and the Electricity Act 1989.'

So there is a question here as to how the guidelines relate to supplier licencing conditions etc.

All the information is in the documents linked on this page https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/licence-guide-smart-metering

But that wording of needing to take all reasonable steps to install smart meters is actually in the licensing conditions.  Condition 33 for gas and condition 39 for electricity.

EssexHebridean

So presumably your current electricity meter is an old-style one, yes? If that is the case, then you can kick the problem down the road for now - as a new gas meter supplied now will not be working as "smart" anyway - it is the comms hub that makes it so, and that as a general rule comes along with the electric meter. The gas meter is defective and needs changing, yes, but I see no reason why they would also insist on changing the electric meter at the same time, or indeed decide to install a stand-alone comms hub. So the effect would be that the new meter will be capable of being smart, but at the current time, will not be able to be as it will not have the means of communication. 

As for it not being "about the money" - this IS a moneysaving forum, and so on here generally people want cost-effective solutions to problems. For the majority, these days that includes having the flexibility to pay the least possible for their energy costs, and that of course comes hand-in-hand with smart metering. The general view is that this will only become more notable as time moves on - indeed, there are some countries already charging a premium for customers who refuse to have smart meters. (Not venturing into, or indeed inviting, any debate, just an explanation in relation to the reasons why as a rule when these threads happen along, people will venture the view that smart metering is the "best" way forwards - as for the stated purpose of this website, they realistically are!) 

Reed_Richards

You are at liberty to install your own meter "downstream" of the regular meter but you don't own the regular meter so the decision on what sort of meter it should be is not really yours.  Therefore I would be interested to know exactly what the Energy Ombudsman said about this. 

TheElectricCow

One point that has come up before in similar threads is that once the supplier “takes on” the new meter they also take ownership of it, even if you arrange and pay for the installation yourself.

Now my only source for this is from the posts of more knowledgeable forum users so I can’t vouch for its accuracy, but it’s something to be aware of that you may well lose ownership of your new traditional meter after installation. Of course it will already be installed by then so that should resolve your immediate concern, but any potential future supplier could start looking to replace that newly installed meter sooner than you might appreciate anyway.