Buy a EV battery car or not?

WellKnownSid

Bigwheels1111 said:

165 miles.

165 miles each way should be easy for most EVs with a single charge on the way home - not 3-4 as you mentioned.

On average it is around 10k more for an EV  compared to an ice vehicle.

We bought an 11 month old EV for less than the base model equivalent ICE

I can’t charge at home, no local chargers that suit.
The closest one is expensive and I need to pay to park in the car park while charging.

That situation should change quickly.  I can't believe how many are going up here and we're rural Scotland.

Diesel is £1.38L where I filled up today £6.25 a gallon.
I get 40 - 54 mpg. At 40 mpg it is 15.6p a mile.
At 54 mpg it’s 11.5p a mile.
Looking at figures online, from EV owners and my friends MG ZS EV.
3 miles per kWh to 4 or 5 miles per kWh is common.
Local charger is 75p kWh.
My ice car still wins.

Can't argue with that.  We're getting around 2p a mile - actually less because we still have odd free charging points - our local hospital, council buildings.  Our local garden centres charge £1 per hour for 7kW - first hour is free if you buy a coffee.  That's a free trip to the hospital or garden centre.

Euro 6 the cleanest engine ever.

Stick a pipe from the exhaust into your bedroom and let me know how that goes...

All the manufacturing co2 etc has already been used up.
I am to keep it 15 - 20 years.
No way does changing make any sense.
As I only do 3k a year, changing to an EV, all the pollution co2 etc to make the new car is complete madness.
Let alone price.

Low mileage is a good use-case for a nearly new car.

I suspect sooner or later - within the next year or so - you may find a big increase in local charging options.  This and diesel at £5.79 a litre which is only a matter of time...

Bigwheels1111

WellKnownSid said:

Bigwheels1111 said:

165 miles.

165 miles each way should be easy for most EVs with a single charge on the way home - not 3-4 as you mentioned.

On average it is around 10k more for an EV  compared to an ice vehicle.

We bought an 11 month old EV for less than the base model equivalent ICE

I can’t charge at home, no local chargers that suit.
The closest one is expensive and I need to pay to park in the car park while charging.

That situation should change quickly.  I can't believe how many are going up here and we're rural Scotland.

Diesel is £1.38L where I filled up today £6.25 a gallon.
I get 40 - 54 mpg. At 40 mpg it is 15.6p a mile.
At 54 mpg it’s 11.5p a mile.
Looking at figures online, from EV owners and my friends MG ZS EV.
3 miles per kWh to 4 or 5 miles per kWh is common.
Local charger is 75p kWh.
My ice car still wins.

Can't argue with that.  We're getting around 2p a mile - actually less because we still have odd free charging points - our local hospital, council buildings.  Our local garden centres charge £1 per hour for 7kW - first hour is free if you buy a coffee.  That's a free trip to the hospital or garden centre.

Euro 6 the cleanest engine ever.

Stick a pipe from the exhaust into your bedroom and let me know how that goes...

All the manufacturing co2 etc has already been used up.
I am to keep it 15 - 20 years.
No way does changing make any sense.
As I only do 3k a year, changing to an EV, all the pollution co2 etc to make the new car is complete madness.
Let alone price.

Low mileage is a good use-case for a nearly new car.

I suspect sooner or later - within the next year or so - you may find a big increase in local charging options.  This and diesel at £5.79 a litre which is only a matter of time...

Even if I could charge for 1p a mile an EV is still not an option.
Nor is a new ice car.
My car was £14,350 new.
I spend £600 a year in fuel.
A new EV or ICE car is a ridiculous option.
If diesel cost £25 a gallon I would still keep my car.
At £3000 a year for fuel I would keep it for 10 more years.
Because that’s what a new vehicle would cost.

WellKnownSid

Bigwheels1111 said:

My car was £14,350 new.
I spend £600 a year in fuel.

Yes, it's all about the charging.
We swapped a euro 6 diesel costing £1650 a year in fuel for a £13k EV costing £200 a year in electricity.
Selling whilst diesels were still high and second hand EVs had reached a lull meant the cost to change from a 7 year old high mileage weasel - well technically it's actually paying us.

Herzlos

WellKnownSid said:

I can't believe how many are going up here and we're rural Scotland.

We're the same; for a nowhere town in rural scotland we've got about 24 chargers, almost all unused.

But I get the impression that whilst Scotland is pushing the infrastructure hard, England and Wales aren't doing the same so they often don't have the same provisions or motivation.


@Bigwheels1111 if you're only spending £600/year, you're only doing about 5k miles a year? In that case yeah you're not going to save money going to an EV, and your lack of infrastructure means it's not viable from a convenience perspective.  I'm in a similar boat in that it doesn't make sense to sell my diesel for an EV, when I'm changing car anyway an EV will be a big consideration.

It's also worth noting that really low mileage is terrible for a diesel engine, so you may find that an EV will last a lot longer (assuming you get over the infrastructure hurdles).

Car_54

Herzlos said:

WellKnownSid said:

I can't believe how many are going up here and we're rural Scotland.

We're the same; for a nowhere town in rural scotland we've got about 24 chargers, almost all unused.

But I get the impression that whilst Scotland is pushing the infrastructure hard, England and Wales aren't doing the same so they often don't have the same provisions or motivation.

I am a Scot, living in a part of London where the infrastructure is dismal.

Still, I can console myself with the thought that the Scottish government are spending my taxes wisely

Bigwheels1111

Herzlos said:

WellKnownSid said:

I can't believe how many are going up here and we're rural Scotland.

We're the same; for a nowhere town in rural scotland we've got about 24 chargers, almost all unused.

But I get the impression that whilst Scotland is pushing the infrastructure hard, England and Wales aren't doing the same so they often don't have the same provisions or motivation.


@Bigwheels1111 if you're only spending £600/year, you're only doing about 5k miles a year? In that case yeah you're not going to save money going to an EV, and your lack of infrastructure means it's not viable from a convenience perspective.  I'm in a similar boat in that it doesn't make sense to sell my diesel for an EV, when I'm changing car anyway an EV will be a big consideration.

It's also worth noting that really low mileage is terrible for a diesel engine, so you may find that an EV will last a lot longer (assuming you get over the infrastructure hurdles).

The low mileage worries me, for sure.
7 year old and 23k on the clock.
I do 4, 7 hour drives a year. Seems ok with that.
But who knows.
This week, 10 miles in total.
Hospital and back twice.
Would give up the car, but wife is disabled and the car is the perfect size and height for entry and exit for her.
Plus massive storage for Wheelchair and associated things.

I’m not anti EV.

I don’t think they are as green as everyone thinks that’s for sure.
Zero emissions kind of is true.
No tailpipe emissions for sure, particulates now that’s a totally different question.
Production emissions are higher from all I’ve seen but who knows how is telling the truth.
The government, 😝 
Will they last 20 years like an ice car, Will batteries get recycled and will they last 20 years etc.
All beyond me.

My fiend has an MG ZS EV, it’s lovely and costs next to nothing to run.
Local Sainsburys has a free charging point, he leaves the car on charge at 06.00am.
And gets on the train to work, his wife walks the kids to school, gets some shopping and drives home at 09.45am.
Twice a week and the car has a full charge for free.
He has a home charger on Octopus night rate but only used it twice in 25 months.
I think he has done 16k miles so far and only spent around £200 on charging while on holiday.
The car was 11 months old with 1k on the clock and 10k cheaper than new price.
Sweet spot the week lockdown ended.
I urged him to go EV as would suit his family. Was planning to get a Nissan Qashqai
Free road tax covered service cost and free juice from Sainsburys.
Not only did I urge him, I found the car haggled the price with the dealer and drove him 5 hours to a small
village above hull to collect it.

Barkin

Herzlos said:

WellKnownSid said:

I can't believe how many are going up here and we're rural Scotland.

It's also worth noting that really low mileage is terrible for a diesel engine

No, it's not low mileage per se.

It's lots of short journeys that modern diesels don't like. 

RogerPensionGuy

I have done more and more research.

Looks like 70% battery capacity at 5 or 6 years or 70K miles is only what most makers guarantee.

Looks like EVs spend more time in garages being fixed than typical ICE cars, that's time and cost.

Looks like insurance is normally more than ICE cars.

Looks like on average tyres get replaced at 20% less mileage than ICE cars.

Currently using public chargers will cost me 30% extra in cash than running a like 4 like ICE car, plus my time, one article I read says these EV charging stations do not easily display cost of charging, they said driver just hooks up and pays the rate available, I guess a keen person will just research costs and use cheaper charging points.

I have currently put off looking to buy an EV anytime soon, currently looking at the latest PHEVs and Mild Hybrids, as I don't have home charging, looking very much like these new very efficient Mild Hybrids would suit me best.

Or just keep my very reliable ICE car running and probably cause less environmental impact by not buying any new car and use the money for sum think different.   

Bigphil1474

I think the simple truth is that buying an EV is more about the infrastructure available to you and what suits your lifestyle. They suit some people perfectly, others not. I think it's a big hurdle if you can't charge at home. 

If your current ice car is is reliable, then the MSE thing is to keep with it, and change it when you have to/when the £ make sense.

WellKnownSid

RogerPensionGuy said:

I have currently put off looking to buy an EV anytime soon, currently looking at the latest PHEVs and Mild Hybrids, as I don't have home charging, looking very much like these new very efficient Mild Hybrids would suit me best.

Mild hybrids are not that efficient - from what I can tell it's just a marketing gimmick for manufacturers to get their CO2 emissions down a bit, they need the engine running every time you pull away.  By "hybrid" they mean that they strapped on a big alternator...

For context - our diesel 7 seater used to average 44mpg - and 36mpg around town.

Our strong petrol hybrid 7 seater is a foot longer than the diesel it replaced but averages 58mpg - and gets over 80mpg around town because you can drive around most of the day in electric mode.  It also zips silently from 0-30 much faster than many ICE cars, so great off the lights.

A PHEV gives you even more options - you always have the option to get to the shops on electric only.

That said I still much prefer our EV in terms of NVH and practicality