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Help QDR solicitor claim on behalf of euro car parks limited

124

Comments

  • Le_Kirk
    Le_Kirk Posts: 26,472 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Photogenic Name Dropper
    Sure, how do I upload it without having to take multiple photographs? 
    Do you have  a scanner?  Maybe the local library has one you could use?
  • Harbmeister
    Harbmeister Posts: 109 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 100 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    If you can't get to a scanner just photograph all relevant pages - I did.
    Then email/load from your phone to a laptop. If it has Windows 10/11 you can easily edit each image and use the 'erase' facility to anonymise them.
  • Neverafine
    Neverafine Posts: 16 Forumite
    10 Posts First Anniversary
    So an update on this, I now have a new hearing date. 23rd May upon consideration of the claimants application. It is set as only a 30 minute hearing where the last was set for 2 hours. I'm not really sure what this means but I plan to attend this one and take the response provided by coupon-mad with me. 

    Any tips for attending court would be appreciated. 
  • Umkomaas
    Umkomaas Posts: 44,473 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    So an update on this, I now have a new hearing date. 23rd May upon consideration of the claimants application. It is set as only a 30 minute hearing where the last was set for 2 hours. I'm not really sure what this means but I plan to attend this one and take the response provided by coupon-mad with me. 

    Any tips for attending court would be appreciated. 
    Get there at least half an hour before the hearing, book in with the court clerk. You may be approached by a rep for the claimant, who may ask you to consider a pre-hearing settlement figure. Be polite, but say (if this is what you wish to happen) that you would prefer the judge to make any decision. Go smartly dressed, not necessarily suit and tie, but definitely not in a Rab C Nesbit string vest, joggers and unmatched shoes!

    In terms of the actual hearing itself ... have a look at this if you've not previously seen it - originally posted by forum regular @KeithP.

    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .

    I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.

    #Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street
  • Neverafine
    Neverafine Posts: 16 Forumite
    10 Posts First Anniversary
    A further update. Yesterday afternoon I received a N279- notice of discontinuation. Which was also emailed to the court. It also asked the court to vacate both hearing dates. 

    Is there anything more I am now expected to do? This very much looks like a victory. Thank you all for your advice and guidance very much appreciated. 
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 162,305 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited 21 May 2024 at 9:40AM
    A further update. Yesterday afternoon I received a N279- notice of discontinuation. Which was also emailed to the court. It also asked the court to vacate both hearing dates. 

    Is there anything more I am now expected to do? This very much looks like a victory. Thank you all for your advice and guidance very much appreciated. 
    Hahahahahahahahaha!!!!  Knew they would.

    ANOTHER ONE BITES THE DUST!

    QDR missed hearing deadlines, paid £119 for an application to try get away with it and poor POC, then when you fired back, they gave up!

    The only disappointment in this victory is that you didn't get to see them shouted at by a Manchester Judge.

     :D 
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
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    Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • Neverafine
    Neverafine Posts: 16 Forumite
    10 Posts First Anniversary
    I was really set on the hearing. It is a shame. That said what a win! Do I need to receive confirmation from the court or attend anything at this stage?
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 162,305 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited 21 May 2024 at 8:03PM
    No.  You won!  It is over.

    For others, here's what was emailed to the court and QDR to oppose their last-minute application that begged to delay the hearing and let them re-write their POC:

    Email header was:

    URGENT - Defendant's response to N244 - Claim number xxxxxxxx

    In the body of the email, the OP briefly stated that the Claimant's N244 is extremely late and there is no good reason reason to disrupt the conclusion of the case.  Skeleton argument from the Defendant is attached to assist the court.


    IN THE COUNTY COURT AT xxxxxx

    Claim No.: xxxxxxx

    Between


    EURO CAR PARKS LIMITED 

    (Claimant)

    -and-

     Xxxxxxxx Xxxxxxxxx

    (Defendant)

     ________________________________

    SKELETON ARGUMENT FROM THE DEFENDANT:

    CONTESTING THE EXTREME LATENESS OF THE CLAIMANT'S APPLICATION AND PROVIDING AUTHORITIES FOR THE CLAIM TO INSTEAD BE STRUCK OUT

    ________________________________

    Introduction

    1. At the eleventh hour, the Claimants' N244 (served late, arriving after the 9th May date/time deadline for witness statements for the hearing set for this month) asks the court - out of the blue - for permission to fundamentally amend the 2023 Particulars. The Defendant has not consented to that.
    2. The court has had no explanation for the seven month period of delay. No credible reason to suddenly halt the natural process towards deciding the case this month is given, merely that the Claimants - well over half a year later - want to amend the pleaded case "to comply with CPR 16"
    3. The N244, draft consent order and wholesale attempt to amend the pleaded case was signed/dated by the Claimant's legal team on the very date that Witness Statements were due to be exchanged.  It was sent to the Defendant only by post so it cannot have been served before the expiry of the date when the Defendant was entitled to expect a Witness Statement and evidence. 
    4. It was always in the Claimant's solicitor's gift to plead the case properly at the outset.  They also had a further 4 months to file and serve more detailed POC and did not do so.
    5. The Claimant's failure to comply with CPR16 was known by them and QDR some seven months ago. The Defendant raised the significant issues regarding understanding the nature of the allegation (and that the Defendant was not the driver) which was all central to the 2023 defence: see paragraphs 3-8 inclusive.
    6. The Claimants have asked if the Defendant will consent. Due to the extreme delay in making this application and the detriment that would inevitably be caused by delaying the hearing and expecting the Defendant to have to re-work and repeat submissions they had already completed, the Defendant cannot agree.
    7. So, the matter of this contested application and whether it is right to now strike out the claim, rather than permit the application, is for the court to decide.
    8. This skeleton argument is provided to assist the court to understand why the Defendant believes the claim should be struck out.
    9. Matters and authorities that the Defendant asks the court to consider:

      Defective Particulars of Claim ('POC')


    10. It is submitted that the claim should be struck out because the 2023 POC fail to comply with CPR 16.4(1)(e) and 16PD3 and 16PD7.
    11. This will be common ground, otherwise the Claimant's Solicitors would not be begging for an extension and permission to effectively start again.  By applying to amend the POC to comply, they are admitting that the first POC did not comply with the CPRs.
    12. The Claim form failed to "state all facts necessary for the purpose of formulating a complete cause of action".  So inadequate were the 2023 POC that the Defendant was unable to understand the allegations, heads of cost or basis of claim, as stated in paras 3-8 of the defence.
    13. In Civil Enforcement Limited v Chan (Ref. E7GM9W44) heard on 15th August 2023, HHJ Murch, sitting at Luton County Court, held that 'the particulars of the claim as filed and served did not set out the conduct which amounted to the breach in reliance upon which the claimant would be able to bring a claim for breach of contract'.
    14. Courts up and down the country agree.  As it seems, does Her Honour Judge Evans in a persuasive (unreported but very recent) Appeal decision in Car Park Management Services Ltd v Mr A, which mirrors CEL v Chan.  It is understood by the Defendant that HHJ Evans was sitting at the Manchester County Court (summary of the case by the barrister involved)  https://www.contestorlegal.co.uk/blog-3/parking-company-loses-8668-over-100-ticket-after-bw-legal-services-poor-pleading
    15. The Defendant does not have the benefit of a transcript for that case but Manchester Court circuit will.  This is link: Judgments collates several written parking claim judgments including 'CEL v Chan'. These were referred to by the Defendant at the start, in the 2023 defence and 'Chan' is well known to the parking industry, so the Claimant was on early notice of its failure.
    16. The Claimant was on notice when reading the defence paragraphs 3 - 8 inclusive, that the Defendant would rely on the recent appeal judgment in Civil Enforcement v Chan. No steps were taken to address or acknowledge these failures within the 4 months deadline.
    17. The 'amended POC' also fail to narrow the issues raised in defence.
    18. Even after reading the amended POC, the Defendant (and indeed the Court) still does not know:
    19. (i) what the sign and/or terms & conditions (the 'consumer notice' relied upon as the contract) looked like on the material date 4 years ago, or 
    20. (ii) whether any pay & display machine was prominent and sufficiently visible to persons parking in any/all areas of the car park (a requirement of the BPA Code, and subject to scrutiny under the 'test of prominence' and 'fairness of consumer notices' requirements in the Consumer Rights Act 2015); or 
    21. (iii) where the vehicle was parked in relation to a sign and a payment machine, if any, given that the Defendant has no knowledge or evidence of that, as they have pleaded that they were not driving and the Claimant has no evidence as they presumably only relied upon ANPR cameras at the far entry/exit, or
    22. (iv) given this was July 2020, during the peak time of the COVID pandemic and the effects of lockdown, whether any pay & display machine was in fact working and whether 'pay & display' was even required on that date, given the fact most car parks suspended the need for the public and their own staff to use/touch machines that required coins, pressing keys and handling printed tickets etc. in 2020; or - as raised nine months ago in the defence:
    23. (v) whether the allegation is about a 'keying error' (a mere typo in the numberplate when paying and pressing keys) or not paying at all, or not displaying what the woeful POC call a 'permit', or
    24. (vi) whether the Claimant has indeed paid out or otherwise (genuinely?) incurred any damages or fees - newly described for the first time in the new POC as 'administrative costs' - of £70, which was denied (and clearly argued as disproportionate and 'extorting money from motorists' by DLUHC Ministers) as set out in the Defendant's statements of case; or 
    25. (vii) whether or not the Claimant's Notice to Keeper was worded to comply with Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, given that not all parking operators use that legislation properly (or at all) and Euro Car Parks has two versions. The Defendant having attested to having no knowledge of the incident and was at work, as a matter of fact and law they cannot be held liable outwith that Act.

    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
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    Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • Harbmeister
    Harbmeister Posts: 109 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 100 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    Excellent news @Neverafine.
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