Octopus Estimating readings for Smart Meter

TheMaverick000000

MultiFuelBurner said:

Good morning Maverick, been following this from a distance as the more.experienced on the forum have already chipped in but the following leaps out at me.

1) have you done what was previously asked and added yourself on the priority service with Octopus as you cannot see to read your meter?

2) can you pickup your in home display (as asked as well) and have a play with it. Your meter readings can be obtained from there and are most likely easier to read. Let us know what it says.

3) you appear to be on the wrong tariff unless you have storage heaters and have decided not to use them. Economy 7 for all electric properties is generally used for those with storage heaters to charge up when the rate is cheaper and discharge during the day/evening.

1 Yes

2 "Used so far today 2.51 kw

3Yes, someone posted this earlier. I will re contact Octopus again when they get round to talking to me.

TheMaverick000000

wild666 said:

I take daily readings for my electric usage most days it's around 3.9 kWh to 4.5 kWh with the odd day at 7 or 8 kWh, this is the day I do washing and drying in a heated airer. If you're on an SVR tariff then you should be able to work out the daily usage, I'm on the tracker tariff so my usage can vary each day even if I use exactly the same amount of electric as the previous day.
I do give Octopus monthly readings for electric and gas so my bills are accurate. I have on a couple of occasions wondered why my daily usage is up from around 4.5 kWh to 6 kWh but the next day I seem to use less electric even though I've done nothing different to the previous day when the usage was higher. 

My usage, according to the little device in my flat, shows that my usage is around £80 per month. I can think of no reason as to why they should estimate Summer usage as being far, far higher than that.

MultiFuelBurner

TheMaverick000000 said:

MultiFuelBurner said:

Good morning Maverick, been following this from a distance as the more.experienced on the forum have already chipped in but the following leaps out at me.

1) have you done what was previously asked and added yourself on the priority service with Octopus as you cannot see to read your meter?

2) can you pickup your in home display (as asked as well) and have a play with it. Your meter readings can be obtained from there and are most likely easier to read. Let us know what it says.

3) you appear to be on the wrong tariff unless you have storage heaters and have decided not to use them. Economy 7 for all electric properties is generally used for those with storage heaters to charge up when the rate is cheaper and discharge during the day/evening.

1 Yes

2 "Used so far today 2.51 kw

3Yes, someone posted this earlier. I will re contact Octopus again when they get round to talking to me.

Excellent have more of a play with the IHD and you should be able to find your meter reading not just your daily or instant usage.

It may be one figure that combines your day and night use but it may help you prove the estimates are way out.

TheMaverick000000

MultiFuelBurner said:

TheMaverick000000 said:

MultiFuelBurner said:

Good morning Maverick, been following this from a distance as the more.experienced on the forum have already chipped in but the following leaps out at me.

1) have you done what was previously asked and added yourself on the priority service with Octopus as you cannot see to read your meter?

2) can you pickup your in home display (as asked as well) and have a play with it. Your meter readings can be obtained from there and are most likely easier to read. Let us know what it says.

3) you appear to be on the wrong tariff unless you have storage heaters and have decided not to use them. Economy 7 for all electric properties is generally used for those with storage heaters to charge up when the rate is cheaper and discharge during the day/evening.

1 Yes

2 "Used so far today 2.51 kw

3Yes, someone posted this earlier. I will re contact Octopus again when they get round to talking to me.

Excellent have more of a play with the IHD and you should be able to find your meter reading not just your daily or instant usage.

It may be one figure that combines your day and night use but it may help you prove the estimates are way out.

Er, this meter is not the one in question, I'm afraid. It is the old faulty one which they have estimated. And I do not have any access to that meter. My current meter is also 'smart', and appears to be working OK.

Spoonie_Turtle

TheMaverick000000 said:

wild666 said:

I take daily readings for my electric usage most days it's around 3.9 kWh to 4.5 kWh with the odd day at 7 or 8 kWh, this is the day I do washing and drying in a heated airer. If you're on an SVR tariff then you should be able to work out the daily usage, I'm on the tracker tariff so my usage can vary each day even if I use exactly the same amount of electric as the previous day.
I do give Octopus monthly readings for electric and gas so my bills are accurate. I have on a couple of occasions wondered why my daily usage is up from around 4.5 kWh to 6 kWh but the next day I seem to use less electric even though I've done nothing different to the previous day when the usage was higher. 

My usage, according to the little device in my flat, shows that my usage is around £80 per month. I can think of no reason as to why they should estimate Summer usage as being far, far higher than that.

The tariff information could very well be wrong which is why talking in £ is not of any use. 

However if the tariff information is up-to-date but they've overestimated your usage for a few months previously then that would be why the DD is higher than it needs to be (if that is the case - day rate heating on Economy 7 in winter will be extremely expensive, far more so than your summer use).

TheMaverick000000

Spoonie_Turtle said:

TheMaverick000000 said:

wild666 said:

I take daily readings for my electric usage most days it's around 3.9 kWh to 4.5 kWh with the odd day at 7 or 8 kWh, this is the day I do washing and drying in a heated airer. If you're on an SVR tariff then you should be able to work out the daily usage, I'm on the tracker tariff so my usage can vary each day even if I use exactly the same amount of electric as the previous day.
I do give Octopus monthly readings for electric and gas so my bills are accurate. I have on a couple of occasions wondered why my daily usage is up from around 4.5 kWh to 6 kWh but the next day I seem to use less electric even though I've done nothing different to the previous day when the usage was higher. 

My usage, according to the little device in my flat, shows that my usage is around £80 per month. I can think of no reason as to why they should estimate Summer usage as being far, far higher than that.

The tariff information could very well be wrong which is why talking in £ is not of any use. 

However if the tariff information is up-to-date but they've overestimated your usage for a few months previously then that would be why the DD is higher than it needs to be (if that is the case - day rate heating on Economy 7 in winter will be extremely expensive, far more so than your summer use).

Just to reiterate. It is the latest bill. Dated 29 August, that has put me, according to them, £876.81 in debt!

The following is the full breakdown from them:

Octopus Energy Operations
Limited
W octopus.energy
E hello@octopus.energy
P 0333 344 2268
Registered Office
UK House, 5th floor, 164-182 Oxford Street,
London, W1D 1NN
Registered in England & Wales No. 14415312
VAT Number: 358672751
Your Charges In Detail
Electricity Supply number
Supply Address:
Postcode area alpha identifier: M
Flexible Octopus (5th June 2023 - 30th June 2023)
Energy Charges for Meter (Removed by Forum Team)
5th Jun 2023 6535.3 Estimated reading
1st Jul 2023 7231.6 Estimated reading
Energy Used (Day) 696.3 kWh @ 56.29p/kWh £391.99
Energy Price Guarantee 696.3 kWh @ 16.57p/kWh -£115.38
5th Jun 2023 2394.0 Estimated reading
1st Jul 2023 3072.5 Estimated reading
Energy Used (Night) 678.5 kWh @ 33.48p/kWh £227.14
Energy Price Guarantee 678.5 kWh @ 16.57p/kWh -£112.42
Standing Charge 26 days @ 51.48p/day £13.38
Subtotal of charges before VAT £404.71
VAT @ 5.00% £20.24
Total Electricity Charges £424.95
Electricity Supply number S 2 811 120
2314814322613
Supply Address:
Postcode area alpha identifier: M
Flexible Octopus (1st July 2023 - 30th July 2023)
Energy Charges for Meter (Removed by Forum Team)
1st Jul 2023 7231.6 Estimated reading
31st Jul 2023 8042.3 Data collector reading
Energy Used (Day) 810.7 kWh @ 34.52p/kWh £279.88
1st Jul 2023 3072.5 Estimated reading
31st Jul 2023 3860.6 Data collector reading
Energy Used (Night) 788.1 kWh @ 15.94p/kWh £125.65
Standing Charge 30 days @ 51.48p/day £15.44
Subtotal of charges before VAT £420.97
VAT @ 5.00% £21.05
Total Electricity Charges £442.02
Total charges for bill £876.81
About Your Tariff
Prices do not include VAT unless otherwise noted.
Electricity
Tariff Name Flexible Octopus April
2023 v1
Product Type Variable
Payment Method Direct Debit
Unit Rate (Day) 39.72p per kW/h
Unit Rate (Night) 16.91p per kW/h
Standing Charge 51.48p/day (£187.90/year)
Price Guaranteed Until Not applicable
Early Exit Fee None
Estimated Annual
Usage (Day) 4660.5 kWh
Estimated Annual
Usage (Night) 1691.1 kWh
About Your Tariff
Prices do not include VAT unless otherwise noted.
Electricity
Tariff Name Flexible Octopus April
2023 v1
Product Type Variable
Payment Method Direct Debit
Unit Rate (Day) 34.52p per kW/h
Unit Rate (Night) 15.94p per kW/h
Standing Charge 51.48p/day (£187.90/year)
Price Guaranteed Until Not applicable
Early Exit Fee None
Estimated Annual
Usage (Day) 4660.5 kWh
Estimated Annual
Usage (Night) 1691.1 kWh

Octopus Energy Operations
Limited
W octopus.energy
E hello@octopus.energy
P 0333 344 2268
Registered Office
UK House, 5th floor, 164-182 Oxford Street,
London, W1D 1NN
Registered in England & Wales No. 14415312
VAT Number: 358672751
Your Charges In Detail
Electricity Supply number (Removed by Forum Team)
(Removed by Forum Team)
Supply Address:
Postcode area alpha identifier: M
Flexible Octopus (24th August 2023 - 27th August 2023)
Energy Charges for Meter 22E6000037
24th Aug 2023 135.6 Smart meter reading
28th Aug 2023 155.3 Smart meter reading
Energy Used (Day) 19.7 kWh @ 34.52p/kWh £6.80
24th Aug 2023 38.1 Smart meter reading
28th Aug 2023 41.3 Smart meter reading
Energy Used (Night) 3.2 kWh @ 15.94p/kWh £0.51
Standing Charge 4 days @ 51.48p/day £2.06
Subtotal of charges before VAT £9.37
VAT @ 5.00% £0.47
Total Electricity Charges £9.84
Total charges for bill £876.81

Spoonie_Turtle

TheMaverick000000 said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

TheMaverick000000 said:

wild666 said:

I take daily readings for my electric usage most days it's around 3.9 kWh to 4.5 kWh with the odd day at 7 or 8 kWh, this is the day I do washing and drying in a heated airer. If you're on an SVR tariff then you should be able to work out the daily usage, I'm on the tracker tariff so my usage can vary each day even if I use exactly the same amount of electric as the previous day.
I do give Octopus monthly readings for electric and gas so my bills are accurate. I have on a couple of occasions wondered why my daily usage is up from around 4.5 kWh to 6 kWh but the next day I seem to use less electric even though I've done nothing different to the previous day when the usage was higher. 

My usage, according to the little device in my flat, shows that my usage is around £80 per month. I can think of no reason as to why they should estimate Summer usage as being far, far higher than that.

The tariff information could very well be wrong which is why talking in £ is not of any use. 

However if the tariff information is up-to-date but they've overestimated your usage for a few months previously then that would be why the DD is higher than it needs to be (if that is the case - day rate heating on Economy 7 in winter will be extremely expensive, far more so than your summer use).

Just to reiterate. It is the latest bill. Dated 29 August, that has put me, according to them, £876.81 in debt!

Yes, I understand that, but I'm saying your IHD telling you your usage is costing £80 might not be correct and could be misleading you.

We know they've messed up the estimates with previous meters, but you need to focus on the bills and how many kWh you actually use - ignore the ££ the IHD says.

Gerry1

Many of the readings are probably legitimately classed as Estimated.

* The Annual figures are merely a guide as to what you might expect.  All sorts of things go into the mix.  Think of them like weather forecasts and whether to take a brolly, that's all they are so don't fret about them.

* The Price Cap now changes every three months so many suppliers use an Estimated value calculated at midnight on the last day of December, March, June, September just as the rates change.

Gerry1

TheMaverick000000 said:

The meter is in a very small communal room, with no lights or windows. They are well aware of this.

That could be one big clue.  Turn absolutely everything on especially high power items such as the tumbled dryer, a full electric kettle, the iron (upright of course) and any fan heaters, convectors, oil filled radiators etc.

Look at the meter on the wall and its flashing round red light near the LCD display.  Ignore any tiny red rectangular ref orange or green indicators at the top of the meter.

The light should be flahing like crazy.

Go back to the flat and close down and unplug all sensitive electronic equipment such as TVs, computers, boiler, anything at all clever.  Switch off all circuits at the consumer unit and then look again at red light on the meter on the wall.  It shouldn't flash any more.

It may help if you can get someone with a mobile phone to help you, one in the flat and one in the meter room.  Ask them to take a photo of 'your' meter showing its serial number and make sure it's the same as on the bill.

This is what can happen !

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/78808660/#Comment_78808660

TheMaverick000000

Gerry1 said:

Many of the readings are probably legitimately classed as Estimated.

* The Annual figures are merely a guide as to what you might expect.  All sorts of things go into the mix.  Think of them like weather forecasts and whether to take a brolly, that's all they are so don't fret about them.

* The Price Cap now changes every three months so many suppliers use an Estimated value calculated at midnight on the last day of December, March, June, September just as the rates change.

'A guide'? Estimated 'readings' have no bases in fact! It appears to me that they charge what the heck they like.

This cannot be acceptable. These 'estimations' are beyond a joke. It is like going into a Supermarket and buying £10 of food, and they decide to 'estimate' the cost rather than put it through the till. Accept that their 'estimation comes to £40!