Octopus Estimating readings for Smart Meter

TheMaverick000000

1 Oct 2022 - 31 Oct 2022

Last account balance £31.31 Credit

You paid us £110.31

Energy Bill Support Scheme on 02/11/22 £66.00

Opening balance £212.70 credit

Cost of energy this month:

Electricity £154.86

Subtotal £154.86

Your new account balance £57.84 in credit

Statement date: 03 November 2022
About your electricity tariff
Tariff name: Pay Monthly Variable 2 rate
Payment method: Monthly direct debit
Unit rate (Day): 33.13p/kWh
Unit rate (Night): 23.08p/kWh
Standing charge: 47.27p/day (£172.54/year)
Estimated annual usage: 5714 kWh
Termination fee: None
How much electricity did you use?
For this period, your average usage was 14 kWh/day or £ 5.00/day
Last year, in the same period, your average usage was 19 kWh/day
(1) We increased our prices from 1 October
Electricity use in detail
Meter readings (Day)
1 October 2022 2807 Read
1 November 2022 3132 Read
Meter readings (Night)
1 October 2022 1127 Read
1 November 2022 1236 Read
Energy (day)(1) 325.0 kWh @ 33.1310 p/kWh £107.68
Energy (night)(1) 109.0 kWh @ 23.0800 p/kWh £25.16
Standing charge(1) 31 days @ 47.2710 p/day £14.65
Cost of electricity used £147.49
VAT @ 5% £7.37
Total electricity costs for this bill £154.86

For the period 01 November 2022 to 30 November2022
Last account balance £ 57.84 in credit
You paid us on 03/11/22 - thank you £110.39
Opening balance £168.23 in credit
Cost of your energy this month
Electricity - £235.70
Subtotal - £235.70
Your new account balance £67.47 in debit

Meter readings (Day)
1 November 2022 3132 Read
1 December 2022 3672 Read
Meter readings (Night)
1 November 2022 1236 Read
1 December 2022 1372 Read
Energy (day) 540.0 kWh @ 33.1310 p/kWh £178.91
Energy (night) 136.0 kWh @ 23.0800 p/kWh £31.39
Standing charge 30 days @ 47.2710 p/day £14.18
Cost of electricity used £224.48 VAT @ 5% £11.22
Total electricity costs for this bill £235.70

For the period 01 December 2022 to 31 December2022
Last account balance £67.47 in debit
Energy Bills Support Scheme on 02/12/22 £67.00
You paid us on 02/12/22 - thank you £103.12
Opening balance £102.65 in credit
Cost of your energy this month
Electricity - £299.61
Subtotal - £299.61
Your new account balance £ 196.96 in debit

Meter readings (Day)
1 December 2022 3672 Read
1 January 2023 4372 Read
Meter readings (Night)
1 December 2022 1372 Read
1 January 2023 1540 Read
Energy (day) 700.0 kWh @ 33.1310 p/kWh £231.92
Energy (night) 168.0 kWh @ 23.0800 p/kWh £38.77
Standing charge 31 days @ 47.2710 p/day £14.65
Cost of electricity used £285.34 VAT @ 5% £14.27
Total electricity costs for this bill £299.61

For the period 01 January 2023 to 31 January 2023
Last account balance £196.96 in debit
Energy Bills Support Scheme on 05/01/23 £67.00
You paid us on 05/01/23 - thank you £103.12
Energy Bills Support Scheme on 03/02/23 £67.00
You paid us on 03/02/23 - thank you £103.12
Opening balance £143.28 in credit
Cost of your energy this month
Electricity - £258.06
Subtotal - £258.06
Your new account balance £114.78 in debit

Meter readings (Day)
1 January 2023 4372 Read
3 January 2023 4413 Read
1 February 2023 4872 Estimate
Meter readings (Night)
1 January 2023 1540 Read
3 January 2023 1557 Read
1 February 2023 1749 Estimate
Energy (day)(1) 500.0 kWh @ 35.7990 p/kWh £179.00
Energy (night)(1) 209.0 kWh @ 24.9390 p/kWh £52.12
Standing charge 31 days @ 47.2710 p/day £14.65
Cost of electricity used £245.77
VAT @ 5% £12.29
Total electricity costs for this bill £258.06

For the period 01 February 2023 to 28 February 2023
Last account balance £114.78 in debit
Energy Bills Support Scheme on 02/03/23 £67.00
You paid us on 03/03/23 - thank you £103.12
Opening balance £55.34 in credit
Cost of your energy this month
Electricity - £214.38
Subtotal - £214.38
Your new account balance £159.04 in debit

Meter readings (Day)
1 February 2023 4872 Estimate
1 March 2023 5289 Estimate
Meter readings (Night)
1 February 2023 1749 Estimate
1 March 2023 1916 Estimate
Energy (day) 417.0 kWh @ 35.7990 p/kWh £149.28
Energy (night) 167.0 kWh @ 24.9390 p/kWh £41.65
Standing charge 28 days @ 47.2710 p/day £13.24
Cost of electricity used £204.17
VAT @ 5% £10.21
Total electricity costs for this bill £214.38

7th March 2023 - 6th June 2023
On 7th March 2023 your previous balance was -£159.04
1. We have charged you
VAT included.
Electricity (estimated) 1st March 2023 - 31st March 2023 - £240.61
Electricity (estimated) 1st April 2023 - 4th June 2023 - £412.45
2. You have paid
Direct Debit collection - 3rd April 2023 + £170.12
Direct Debit collection - 2nd May 2023 + £170.12
Direct Debit collection - 1st June 2023 + £170.12
On 6th June 2023 your new balance is -£301.7

Pay Monthly Variable (1st March 2023 - 31st March 2023)
1st Mar 2023 5289.0 Estimated reading
1st Apr 2023 5749.3 Estimated reading
Energy Used (Day) 460.3 kWh @ 72.29p/kWh £332.78
Energy Price Guarantee 460.3 kWh @ 36.49p/kWh -£167.98
1st Mar 2023 1916.0 Estimated reading
1st Apr 2023 2115.3 Estimated reading
Energy Used (Night) 199.3 kWh @ 50.36p/kWh £100.35
Energy Price Guarantee 199.3 kWh @ 25.42p/kWh -£50.65
Standing Charge 31 days @ 47.27p/day £14.65
Subtotal of charges before VAT £229.15VAT @ 5.00% £11.46
Total Electricity Charges £240.61
Flexible Octopus (1st April 2023 - 4th June 2023)
1st Apr 2023 5749.3 Estimated reading
5th Jun 2023 6535.3 Estimated reading
Energy Used (Day) 785.9 kWh @ 56.29p/kWh £442.44
Energy Price Guarantee 785.9 kWh @ 16.57p/kWh -£130.23
1st Apr 2023 2115.3 Estimated reading
5th Jun 2023 2394.0 Estimated reading
Energy Used (Night) 278.8 kWh @ 33.48p/kWh £93.33
Energy Price Guarantee 278.8 kWh @ 16.57p/kWh -£46.19
Standing Charge 65 days @ 51.48p/day £33.46
Subtotal of charges before VAT £392.81 VAT @ 5.00% £19.64
Total Electricity Charges £412.45
Total charges for bill £653.06

7th June 2023 - 25th Aug. 2023
On 7th June 2023 your previous balance was -£301.74
1. We have charged you
Based on your meter readings.[Actualy, read by Octopus agent at my request]
VAT included.
Electricity 31st July 2023 - 23rd Aug. 2023 - £68.50
2. You have paid
Direct Debit collection - 3rd July 2023 + £140.12
Direct Debit collection - 1st Aug. 2023 + £140.12
On 25th Aug. 2023 your new balance is -£90.00

Flexible Octopus (31st July 2023 - 23rd August 2023)
31st Jul 2023 0.0 Smart meter reading
24th Aug 2023 135.6 Smart meter reading
Energy Used (Day) 135.6 kWh @ 34.52p/kWh £46.81
31st Jul 2023 0.0 Smart meter reading
24th Aug 2023 38.1 Smart meter reading
Energy Used (Night) 38.1 kWh @ 15.94p/kWh £6.08
Standing Charge 24 days @ 51.48p/day £12.35
Subtotal of charges before VAT £65.24
VAT @ 5.00% £3.26
Total Electricity Charges £68.50
Total charges for bill £68.50

26th Aug. 2023 - 28th Aug. 2023
On 26th Aug. 2023 your previous balance was -£90.00
1. We have charged you
VAT included.
Electricity (estimated) 5th June 2023 - 30th June 2023 - £424.95
Electricity 1st July 2023 - 30th July 2023 - £442.02
Electricity 24th Aug. 2023 - 27th Aug. 2023 - £9.84
On 28th Aug. 2023 your new balance is -£966.81

Flexible Octopus (5th June 2023 - 30th June 2023)
Energy Charges for Meter 21E6008001
5th Jun 2023 6535.3 Estimated reading
1st Jul 2023 7231.6 Estimated reading
Energy Used (Day) 696.3 kWh @ 56.29p/kWh £391.99
Energy Price Guarantee 696.3 kWh @ 16.57p/kWh -£115.38
5th Jun 2023 2394.0 Estimated reading
1st Jul 2023 3072.5 Estimated reading
Energy Used (Night) 678.5 kWh @ 33.48p/kWh £227.14
Energy Price Guarantee 678.5 kWh @ 16.57p/kWh -£112.42
Standing Charge 26 days @ 51.48p/day £13.38
Subtotal of charges before VAT £404.71
VAT @ 5.00% £20.24
Total Electricity Charges £424.95

Please note: This is a copy and paste job, but I think I have done a reasonable job of the edit.

Hope it is everything you need.

Again, many thanks to you and all on this forum!

QrizB

I'll get into the details later, but one thing leaps out at me.

You have a dual-rate tariff (Economy 7 or similar) but are using far more daytime electricity than nighttime.

How do you heat your flat? Storage heaters, or something else?

TheMaverick000000

QrizB said:

I'll get into the details later, but one thing leaps out at me.

You have a dual-rate tariff (Economy 7 or similar) but are using far more daytime electricity than nighttime.

How do you heat your flat? Storage heaters, or something else?

I do not have any central heating, only a boiler which I turn on once a week to heat up for a bath. It is turned off for the rest of the week to save money.

For normal washing, I just boil sufficient in a kettle.

Spoonie_Turtle

Is there any particular reason you're on Economy 7 then?

What form of heating is in your flat, whether you use it or not?  Is the 'boiler' an actual gas boiler or a hot water cylinder?

QrizB

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Is there any particular reason you're on Economy 7 then?

Yes, that was going to be my next question.

TheMaverick000000 said:

I do not have any central heating, only a boiler which I turn on once a week to heat up for a bath. It is turned off for the rest of the week to save money.

Do you not heat your flat at all? If not, your energy use seems quite high.

If you have no heating, there's no benefit (and quite a bit of additional cost) from having an electricity tariff with a cheap off-peak period (intended for charging storage heaters) and a higher daytime rate.

TheMaverick000000

I have lived here since 1985. It already had economy 7. I used to have warm air central heating, but it broke down years ago, and I could not afford to replace it. Only the hot water cylinder is on the e7 now.

For general heating during the winter, I have on oil heater which runs off the mains, hence my high usage during the cold winters.

QrizB

OK, crunching the numbers:

• Oct 2022 - metered - 325kWh day, 109kWh night - £154.86
• Nov 2022 - metered - 540kWh day, 136kWh night - £235.70
• Dec 2022 - metered - 700kWh day, 168kWh night - £299.81
• Jan 2023 - estimated - 500kWh day, 209kWh night - £258.06
• Feb 2023 - estimated - 417kWh day, 167kWh night - £214.38
• Mar 2023 - estimated - 460.3kWh day, 199.3kWh night - £240.61
• 1st Apr to 4th Jun - estimated - 785.9kWh day, 278.8kWh night - £412.45
• 5th Jun to 1st Jul - estimated - 696.3kWh day, 678.5kWh night - £424.95
• July 2022 - estimated - energy use details missing - £442.02
• 31st Jul to 24th Aug - metered - 153.6 day, 38.1 night - £68.50

Looking at all that, I think their estimates are about right until you get to the 5th of June (I've emboldened the ones that look suspicious). Somehow they think you used more electricity in June than you did in December. While the consumption figures are missing (you might have missed them in your copy-and-paste?) it looks like they have done the same for July too.

I would have expected your consumption for June and July to have been more like August, with maybe 200kWh day and 50kWh night rather than almost 700kWh of each. If I'm correct, you might be able to get £500 knocked off your bill.

There's still the issue of you being on an E7 tariff but not using very much night electricity. Back in December you used four times as much daytime electricity as you did night-time; I would have expected those numbers to be reversed for  an E7 property with storage heaters.

But in December you still used 868kWh of electricity, which is 28kWh a day. A huge amount if you don't have any heating!

Which leads me to ask - do you have an oil-filled heater, a fan heater, panel heaters or those "magic clay" heaters with German-sounding names?

Edit: ah, you posted while I was typing. It's that oil-filled heater that's the culprit!

Spoonie_Turtle

QrizB said:

OK, crunching the numbers:

• Oct 2022 - metered - 325kWh day, 109kWh night - £154.86
• Nov 2022 - metered - 540kWh day, 136kWh night - £235.70
• Dec 2022 - metered - 700kWh day, 168kWh night - £299.81
• Jan 2023 - estimated - 500kWh day, 209kWh night - £258.06
• Feb 2023 - estimated - 417kWh day, 167kWh night - £214.38
• Mar 2023 - estimated - 460.3kWh day, 199.3kWh night - £240.61
• 1st Apr to 4th Jun - estimated - 785.9kWh day, 278.8kWh night - £412.45
• 5th Jun to 1st Jul - estimated - 696.3kWh day, 678.5kWh night - £424.95
• July 2022 - estimated - energy use details missing - £442.02
• 31st Jul to 24th Aug - metered - 153.6 day, 38.1 night - £68.50

I would add maybe the Apr-Jun estimate is high too, particularly the day.

OP, other people are better placed to advise but my gut instinct is you will need to get off Economy 7 onto single-rate tariff, because the higher daytime rate is costing you much more than your energy use needs to.  Perhaps not too bad in the summer at the current rates (I don't have the brainpower to do the maths), but definitely over winter you need to not be paying peak time rate for your heating.  It really is the most expensive way to heat, other than burning ££ notes.

TheMaverick000000

Many thanks QrizB, I will have to research the best portable heating radiator until I can get a reasonable and affordable quote for some, at least, basic central heating system.

As for the June/July suspicious estimate, I will challenge them on that when they come back to me, which, as I said previously, should be within 5 days.

Regards.

Scot_39

OK - took me a while - to echo the calcs, but

1) The most critical piece of information missing is the actual closing reading on the original smart meter - that Octopus said they had recieved the final reading.  So I assume that was on the latest big deficit billing.  Or to follow in 5 days time ?

Unless the OP can find a reading to challange the months of non smart estimated readings - or a longer time profile to suggest the old meter in dumb mode was faulty itself - not just the comms hub.  The daily kWh rate in June - nearly double the rate in Dec based on Jan 1st smart "read"

2) Billing

The billing got out of step - with the final July reading  - for now until can show otherwise - might have wait to see what Octopus come back with - but the £424.95 and £442 are I expect fault or back adjustments

No actual smart readings for billing applied since 1.1.23 - all others - apart from parhaps the missing final for meter 1 Jul 30th estimates.

Oops - this time with the right jpeg for readings to bills etc

The -£90 came from a  interm bill issued purely off the new smart meter.  I assume whilst Octopus waited for the final meter reading to be forwarded (how long normal

The reissued bills include a very high over 50kWh per day estimate - for Jun 5th to I assume July 30s - given both over £400.

3) The daily averages - timewise are a little strange

But unfortunately it took Octopus / OP - several months to spot using estimated readings (last July)

The OPs usage starts to roll off essentially from Jan 1 - i.e. once estimates start - Jan was actually my highest use month - but not be much cf Dec - and everyone is different.

And the corrected bill uses an almost 50:50 split day night 696/678 for the pre cap change Jun 30th reading - which if they stick with totals - at least means the OP's paying low night rates.   But again a curious anomally - suggesting perhaps Octopus might be guestimating - perhaps delibreately in OP's favour right now.

Either suggesting a severe underestimation in Jan / Feb / Mar etc - or something very strange in the final meter reading used for the late Auguest bill from smart meter 1.

Taking the billing amount for Jul into account as well - that suggests another c1400kWh of use.

Which would make the OP's total - for the total period - c 10 months Oct 1st to Aug 28 - of near 7800 kWh and a daily average of c26 kWh

Impossibly no - but pretty high - given Ofgem TDCV for all electric is 4200 kWh per annum - and the OP is in a small 1 bed property.

Guess have to wait to see what Octopus / CA and OP get to at next review.

4) From the real data - its pretty clear E7 isn't the right tariff.

And the OP may need to look around at other options - possibly before next winter.

But if cannot afford a real upgrade - or dare I say it renting - so not in control - a switch to SR appears justified.

Unless the mix estimate corrections are more real than the Oct / Nov/ Dec real billing cycle.