How to check whether mum and dad are actually married

theonlywayisup

Flugelhorn said:

ah yes @theonlywayisup - forgotten about the 2 signatures! Yes that does make it clearer.

My two had one signature and parents with different surnames - registrar was pointing this out to a trainee at the time as it was a variant she hadn't seen

A child (with two parents at the registration) can be the child or Ms Brown and Mr Black but be called child Orange.  The surname can be any surname the parent(s) agree on. 

A child can have any surname the registering parent decides. 

Flugelhorn

theonlywayisup said:

Flugelhorn said:

ah yes @theonlywayisup - forgotten about the 2 signatures! Yes that does make it clearer.

My two had one signature and parents with different surnames - registrar was pointing this out to a trainee at the time as it was a variant she hadn't seen

A child (with two parents at the registration) can be the child or Ms Brown and Mr Black but be called child Orange.  The surname can be any surname the parent(s) agree on. 

But if the father is not there, the baby can only be given his name if they are married - or can the mother now give any name she likes?

theonlywayisup

Flugelhorn said:

theonlywayisup said:

Flugelhorn said:

ah yes @theonlywayisup - forgotten about the 2 signatures! Yes that does make it clearer.

My two had one signature and parents with different surnames - registrar was pointing this out to a trainee at the time as it was a variant she hadn't seen

A child (with two parents at the registration) can be the child or Ms Brown and Mr Black but be called child Orange.  The surname can be any surname the parent(s) agree on. 

But if the father is not there, the baby can only be given his name if they are married - or can the mother now give any name she likes?

A baby can be given any surname on registration regardless.  

Mr Smith (absent and unnamed) has a baby and Ms Bloggs registers on her own.  She can register the baby as Baby Bloggs-Smith, Baby Smith or even Baby Random.  She cannot add the name of father on the registration/certificate unless she is married/cp to him. 

Edit to be clear - the names of the child are incidental - both forenames and surnames.   What the mother cannot do is  cite the name of the 'father' as the father without him being there (or without court order/paperwork). 

RAS

Yep, there was a court case decades ago when Mrs Smith left Mr Smith to live with Mr Jones. She agreed that the baby born a few months later was legally the child of Mr Smith (child of the marriage) because they were still married but registered it a Baby Jones.

Mr Smith objected and lost the case.

theonlywayisup

RAS said:

Yep, there was a court case decades ago when Mrs Smith left Mr Smith to live with Mr Jones. She agreed that the baby born a few months later was legally the child of Mr Smith (child of the marriage) because they were still married but registered it a Baby Jones.

Mr Smith objected and lost the case.

Mr Smith would be legally regarded as the parent (as he was married) but if Mr Jones or Ms Smith could disprove his paternity then a court case could have the register amended.   I guess Mr Smith lost because he wasn't the father proven by paternity and someone else was?

RAS

theonlywayisup said:

RAS said:

Yep, there was a court case decades ago when Mrs Smith left Mr Smith to live with Mr Jones. She agreed that the baby born a few months later was legally the child of Mr Smith (child of the marriage) because they were still married but registered it a Baby Jones.

Mr Smith objected and lost the case.

Mr Smith would be legally regarded as the parent (as he was married) but if Mr Jones or Ms Smith could disprove his paternity then a court case could have the register amended.   I guess Mr Smith lost because he wasn't the father proven by paternity and someone else was?

Given the state of paternity testing that long ago, getting any definitive answer to paternity would have been hard.

Spendless

theonlywayisup said:

Spendless said:

Dad can register a birth on his own is he is married (and nowadays that would include a cp). Mr S registered both of ours as I was in hospital with both for a week after they were born.  

Yes a dad can register on his own if he is married or in CP with the birth mother.   There would still only be one signature on the register/certificate. 

But if it's the OP's Dad's signature wouldn't that tell you they were married at least at the time of the OP's birth? 

theonlywayisup

Spendless said:

theonlywayisup said:

Spendless said:

Dad can register a birth on his own is he is married (and nowadays that would include a cp). Mr S registered both of ours as I was in hospital with both for a week after they were born.  

Yes a dad can register on his own if he is married or in CP with the birth mother.   There would still only be one signature on the register/certificate. 

But if it's the OP's Dad's signature wouldn't that tell you they were married at least at the time of the OP's birth? 

Did you not read what I said.

A dad can register a birth alone.  But only if he is married/cp to the birth mother. 

Spendless

theonlywayisup said:

Spendless said:

theonlywayisup said:

Spendless said:

Dad can register a birth on his own is he is married (and nowadays that would include a cp). Mr S registered both of ours as I was in hospital with both for a week after they were born.  

Yes a dad can register on his own if he is married or in CP with the birth mother.   There would still only be one signature on the register/certificate. 

But if it's the OP's Dad's signature wouldn't that tell you they were married at least at the time of the OP's birth? 

Did you not read what I said.

A dad can register a birth alone.  But only if he is married/cp to the birth mother. 

Yes, I read what you said. I was aware of this, as my husband registers both of our children as I was in hospital at the time, as I already wrote a few posts back (that you have quoted)..

People are saying to the OP that something he can look into is who registered his birth. I have said if that was done by his Dad then wouldn't that tell  him and his Mum were married at the time of his birth and whether they are/were married is what the OP wishes to find out.  

Having not got a birth certificate at hand and having not looked at one for several years  are you saying you can only find out if 1 or 2 people registered the birth than who actually registered?  

[Deleted User]

If they married in England,  or Wales, you can check online at either https://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl ( up to about 1984) or Findmypast or Ancestry ( subscription  sites but you can buy credits) up to 2007, or for Scotland  https://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/search-our-records