Unusually high gas usage of 43000kwh per year

On-the-coast

I have a similar size house, not built to modern standards, but DG and 100mm loft insulation. 

South of England.   

8 yr old Worcester combi. 

24000 KWh pre energy crisis
17000 KWh last 12 months. Trying to economise but still basically at 20c. (Ie not trying very hard..,)

Good luck working it out!

Mobtr

I’m not great with gas usage and how boilers work so please correct me if I’m wrong but to me it looks like the heating & UFH is on 24/7 especially over the winter. Surely when outside temperatures are very low, inside is not going to be above 16 degrees so heating will kick in? 

I live in a 5 bed newish build & we have our heating off completely overnight. 

giles007

Magnitio said:

You are using more in a month than we do in a year! However, we are in a smaller 4 bed detatched with two occupants. Your usage in June last year was very high considering it was so warm; were you using excessively large amounts of hot water e.g. filling an outdoor pool, multiple baths etc?

Yes in July last year I realized that our hot waster was on for much longer than was needed and i reduced the time with which it came on in the morning and in the evening, hence Augusts usage will be JUST hot water

Nebulous2

giles007 said:

youravinalarrrf said:

giles007 said:

I don't think our settings are that drastic - we have played with them in the past - up down a degree, on / off for shorter hours etc, but all to no real discernable avail.

We have always turned the AGA off in the summer months, as yes it does heat as well as cook
Whilst the AGA was on though, the underfloor heating didn't ever kick in as the temperature was always adequate from just the AGA.

Yes it would have been just hot water in the Summer

Oddly the upstairs temp is controlled by a thermostat downstairs (odd historical house configuration) and it gets affected by the downstairs heat - we often complain its too cold upstairs.

I cant see any reason we would be pumping out heat and not be readily aware that we are

Here's my two penn'orth.

It's your money of course but unfortunately you seem to be in denial and until you understand and accept the basic principal that if your gas central heating, underfloor heating, AGA and any other gas appliance you may have is turned on your gas meter dials keep turning and it's increasing your usage and burning your money. The only way to reduce you usage is to turn the temperature settings down, reduce the time period they're turned on for or turn them off altogether.

As someone else has already commented the reality is that your temperature settings are set too high and on for too long.Try setting everything to 17 degrees across the board and turn it off overnight. You can always increase/override the settings in unusually cold periods or if you find that 17 degrees is just too cold for your comfort.

Are you heating rooms even when they're not in use? Turn the thermostatic radiator valves (TRV's) down to their frost protection setting in any unused rooms.

Why on earth is your heating on when everybody is in bed? You might as well sit in bed burning £5 notes? If you're in bed the heating doesn't need to be on as it's of no benefit to anybody. In my opinion it's just wasting your money unnecessarily.

Try the reduced settings for one full month (a day or two is not long enough for a proper comparison) and then compare your usage with the same period a year ago to see what difference it makes to your usage.

" .. gas central heating, underfloor heating, AGA and any other gas appliance .."

The AGA is off and has been for the past 3 months
We have no other gas appliances

Is 17 degrees a comfortable living temperature? to me that sounds pretty chilly, and I honestly don't believe the average household's temperature is set that low as its pretty cold. Unless you are saying that the average 5 bed house's gas kWh yearly usage is 17000kWh purely BECAUSE everyone wears 2 jumpers all the time?

The CH and UFH are off overnight as soon as the lower temperature schedules kick in and would rarely, if ever, come back on before the next daytime schedules, as the temperature rarely gets down to the levels set for those periods

I am not in denial, quite clearly something is amiss and it am trying to get to the bottom of it. I have friends and family members with similar sized houses and not new efficient boiler systems that have no where near our gas usage

To give a slightly different perspective. We have a really old 3 bedroom house with a combi boiler. Shower is electric, no gas cooking, so gas is only used for heating and hot water. Our usage was around 18,000 KWh per year  for gas and in the last 12 months has been 14,500. We are in the North of Scotland, so likely to have a lower ambient temperature than you. March has been particularly cold and we used over 2000KWh. 

Our heating this winter has been set to 18 degrees from 5:30 - 21:00 and 16 degrees from 21:00 to 5:30. We tried it lower overnight, but it took a long time to heat up in the morning when it had dropped further than 16.  We have worn a fleece inside most of the winter and thermal base layers - more for walking the dog than to keep warm inside, but we are wearing them most days. 

I'd say 17000 for a 5 bedroom house would require active management and working at it. 

High inflation causes 'demand destruction' where people actively reduce usage. That is one thing when it is trips to the theatre, or meals out, we are talking about. It translates into sacrifices that many people will find very hard when we are talking about things we have come to regard as essentials, such as centrally-heated homes. 

giles007

youravinalarrrf said:

giles007 said:

The CH and UFH are off overnight as soon as the lower temperature schedules kick in and would rarely, if ever, come back on before the next daytime schedules, as the temperature rarely gets down to the levels set for those periods

That's not what your earlier post suggested was actually happening (see highlighted text below).

giles007 said:

Heating and Schedules

We have a couple of UFH zones downstairs and they are set to 21 degrees from 6am to 11pm, then they are set to 17 degrees overnight

The rest of the house is controlled by 1 thermostat which is set to

20 degrees 6am to 9am

16 degrees 9am to 3pm

20 degrees 3pm to 11pm

16 degrees 11pm to 6am

Under Floor Heating

Installed over half of the downstairs. Its a separate manifold with water temperature set at 40c

If the CH and UFH are not being fully turned off overnight (ie no times set at all) your boiler will be kicking in automatically and be burning gas whenever the temperature falls below those minimum temperature levels you have set. Because you are asleep in bed you will probably not even be aware when it's happening and you may be surprised by how often the temperature drops below your temperature settings during the night.

The whole thing about reducing your consumption and costs is about shaving bits off your time and temperature settings.

Perhaps 17 degrees may ultimately prove to be too low for your overall comfort but it is a starting point and can always be increased if necessary.

I admit that I had my heating set to 18 degrees (occasionally 20 degrees) prior to the recent price hikes but a 1 degree reduction in temperature has made a difference to my usage and bills and the difference in comfort level is honestly hardly noticeable.

For a comparison government guidance for the minimum temperatures for all UK indoor workplaces is 16 degrees (or 13 degrees if doing manual work).

As others have said I think your fears and excuses for not having smart meters fitted are unfounded and I'm surprised Shell haven't insisted on replacing that old gas meter on age and safety grounds. When they do you will have no choice and it will be replaced with a smart meter as the old type meters are no longer available or fitted. It might be a good idea to force the issue and request that both gas and electricity meters are replaced with smart meters.

On another note if the press reports are to be believed you may well become an Ovo customer in the near future if the proposed takeover goes ahead.

thanks for your reply again

You are correct, i am presuming that setting the temperature low in the night time is akin to turning the heating off, but looking at my usage graphs on my Neo Heatmiser app, the lower threshold is hardly ever met overnight and if it is, it is very close to the time at which it would be changing schedule anyway and not nearly enough times to mirror any daytime usage - i will have another look at that.

The builder and plumber who installed my system have both said that the UFH settings I have set should be very efficient. I have no reason to doubt them they are family friends

"For a comparison government guidance for the minimum temperatures for all UK indoor workplaces is 16 degrees (or 13 degrees if doing manual work)."

That minimum is not a comfortable living or working temperature - i challenge you to turn your heating down to 16 for a month and see?

Re smart meters, there are plenty of people who don't want them for health reasons so please don't patronize by describing my reservations as "excuses" 

.. but i appreciate your response and thank you again for your help

Keep_pedalling

macman said:

If you want a meter test, then the replacement will be a smart meter: dumb meters are no longer available from any supplier..

I know a few electricity meters are certified for 40 years but I don’t any gas ones are, so it is highly unlikely that they would test the existing meter just change it out for a smart meter.

noitsnotme

giles007 said:

youravinalarrrf said:

giles007 said:

The CH and UFH are off overnight as soon as the lower temperature schedules kick in and would rarely, if ever, come back on before the next daytime schedules, as the temperature rarely gets down to the levels set for those periods

That's not what your earlier post suggested was actually happening (see highlighted text below).

giles007 said:

Heating and Schedules

We have a couple of UFH zones downstairs and they are set to 21 degrees from 6am to 11pm, then they are set to 17 degrees overnight

The rest of the house is controlled by 1 thermostat which is set to

20 degrees 6am to 9am

16 degrees 9am to 3pm

20 degrees 3pm to 11pm

16 degrees 11pm to 6am

Under Floor Heating

Installed over half of the downstairs. Its a separate manifold with water temperature set at 40c

If the CH and UFH are not being fully turned off overnight (ie no times set at all) your boiler will be kicking in automatically and be burning gas whenever the temperature falls below those minimum temperature levels you have set. Because you are asleep in bed you will probably not even be aware when it's happening and you may be surprised by how often the temperature drops below your temperature settings during the night.

The whole thing about reducing your consumption and costs is about shaving bits off your time and temperature settings.

Perhaps 17 degrees may ultimately prove to be too low for your overall comfort but it is a starting point and can always be increased if necessary.

I admit that I had my heating set to 18 degrees (occasionally 20 degrees) prior to the recent price hikes but a 1 degree reduction in temperature has made a difference to my usage and bills and the difference in comfort level is honestly hardly noticeable.

For a comparison government guidance for the minimum temperatures for all UK indoor workplaces is 16 degrees (or 13 degrees if doing manual work).

As others have said I think your fears and excuses for not having smart meters fitted are unfounded and I'm surprised Shell haven't insisted on replacing that old gas meter on age and safety grounds. When they do you will have no choice and it will be replaced with a smart meter as the old type meters are no longer available or fitted. It might be a good idea to force the issue and request that both gas and electricity meters are replaced with smart meters.

On another note if the press reports are to be believed you may well become an Ovo customer in the near future if the proposed takeover goes ahead.

"For a comparison government guidance for the minimum temperatures for all UK indoor workplaces is 16 degrees (or 13 degrees if doing manual work)."

That minimum is not a comfortable living or working temperature - i challenge you to turn your heating down to 16 for a month and see?

I had ours set between 16 and 17.5 degrees for various rooms (Hive individual room thermostats) all winter in the mornings and evenings.  Off all during the main part of the day and overnight. We would all wear a jumper or dressing gown, or perhaps a blanket over the legs while watching tv if needed, but it’s been more than bearable.

Highest used months were December at 1093 kWh and January at 1073 kWh.  Dropping to 835 for Feb and 760 for March all according to the Bright app.

Thats a 3 bed with combi boiler, GCH, boiler fed shower and electric oven/hob.

Edited to add - our boiler is about 16 yrs old so is probably not as efficient as a modern one.  I’ve just totted up our last 12 months gas usage which according to Bright was 5744 kWh.  Also don’t know why I said we have an electric shower!  That’s also fed from the boiler - have amended above.

theoretica

You haven't, I think, clarified how you use the house - how much you are in and how much out - it is of course a waste to heat places to a comfortable temperature when you are not likely to be in them.  Are you all out at school/work, someone needing one room of an office warm, or actually using much of the house?  My daytime setting is indeed something I think uncomfortably cold if I am sitting working at home and not moving - and if I am cold I ask the heating to boost, which may happen once or twice a week.  Result is I am warm enough if home, and not heating the place when out, so saving on several days heating a week - maybe 10-15%?

Alnat1

We've had ours set at 16.5C 6.30-14.00 then 17.5C until 22.30, thermostat in living room, off overnight except when we got those extreme cold snaps, then left on overnight at 14C. I've used a heated throw if I got chilly sitting around in the evening.

We have boiler set around 60C and hot water tank 55C (heated for 40 mins a day, does 2 showers and some left for cleaning etc)

TVRs on full in living room, set to 2 in kitchen/bathroom/used bedroom. Unused rooms on 1.

We're in a 20 year old 4 bed detached in Yorkshire, 2 adults and used 7193kWh gas in the last year

jennifernil

17-18 degrees in the living area would be too cold for us, we need 20-21, and, being retired,  are home a lot, but we only heat the rooms we use at the times we use them.

We are in Central Scotland, in quite an exposed to the wind situation, house is 34 years old, reasonably well insulated, and 2800 sq ft.

House is south facing, just regular radiators.

In the past we used around 28000 kWh of gas, only for heating and HW, but have recently had a new, more efficient, boiler fitted, and slightly more precise controls, so seem to be on target for a 25-30 % saving over the year.

Boiler is a  Veissmann Vitodens 100 heat only, stored HW, Tado control system. 

We have always had TRVs, now have Smart TRVs in most rooms.

We do not heat the house overnight, never have.

Our gas use does vary a lot with the weather, and how many holidays we take.