Octopus Heat Pumps

stripling

@matt_drummer  ok, ignoring the grant, mine was actually triple the quote I was referencing. So including the grant, several thousand more. 

For me, apart from cost (which matters because I'm working on a teensy shoe-string), it is the erraticity of the quotes.
They would not budge on the 50º design temp so I arm-twisted to get the couple of extra K2s (which is naff all in cost to them considering their bulk-buying capacity) so I had the option to at least tweak it a bit. But as you know, the quote is issued long before they even talk to you or see your house. 

matt_drummer

stripling said:

@matt_drummer  ok, ignoring the grant, mine was actually triple the quote I was referencing. So including the grant, several thousand more. 

For me, apart from cost (which matters because I'm working on a teensy shoe-string), it is the erraticity of the quotes.
They would not budge on the 50º design temp so I arm-twisted to get the couple of extra K2s (which is naff all in cost to them considering their bulk-buying capacity) so I had the option to at least tweak it a bit. But as you know, the quote is issued long before they even talk to you or see your house. 

My quote was issued after the survey, so no, I don't know.

I doubt it's a quote, maybe a ballpark figure subject to survey?

Mine was a fixed quote after survey.

Maybe they have to travel further each day to your home, who knows, it's still a bargain for what you get, and far less than I had to pay.

But I am still happy, just to be clear.

Maybe people shouldn't discuss their quotes in public for no other reason than it spreads discontent. There will be reasons why quotes vary that won't necessarily be apparent to every home owner.

In any case, they are cheap for several reasons, not all of them bad by any means.

But designing to run at 50c is a terrible idea that will cost the customer one way or another.

smallblueplanet

If you're not happy get someone else to do your install? Our quote went up from pre-EPC insulation changes, as we couldn't go ahead, but it's still a good price. They are replacing 9 radiators which they couldn't have known when they quoted, but it's still not as cheap as some others have said for install with multiple rads replaced. That's the way it goes, no rhyme or reason but the choice is still yours.

stripling

@matt_drummer  Actually, the 🐙  quote was no better than British Gas - I've gone with them because the the installer I met knows his stuff and we clicked.  

Also the aftercare/service is cheaper than BG and better afaik and I included (amongst other things) how they responded to your 9kw debacle in my assessment of this. 

Even the heat geek quote I received wasn't much higher than mine so 🐙 ain't so cheap any more, or maybe the others are lowering their prices. Who knows?  Octopus are nearby so travelling isn't an issue either.  

I never heard of a post-survey quote before from O. but I followed most of your story over on OEM and it helped me learn and make the decision to go down this route. 

matt_drummer

stripling said:

@matt_drummer  Actually, the 🐙  quote was no better than British Gas - I've gone with them because the the installer I met knows his stuff and we clicked.  

Also the aftercare/service is cheaper than BG and better afaik and I included (amongst other things) how they responded to your 9kw debacle in my assessment of this. 

Even the heat geek quote I received wasn't much higher than mine so 🐙 ain't so cheap any more, or maybe the others are lowering their prices. Who knows?  Octopus are nearby so travelling isn't an issue either.  

I never heard of a post-survey quote before from O. but I followed most of your story over on OEM and it helped me learn and make the decision to go down this route. 

Wouldn't you have got a Vaillant with BG?

stripling

@matt_drummer
Wouldn't you have got a Vaillant with BG?

No, that would've cost more. They quoted for exactly the same Daikin as 🐙.  HG also quoted for a Daikin initially then a Vaillant for more $$.  BG offer 3 different heat pumps but I forget what the 3rd was.

I would've quite like a Vaillant but Daikins are good too so I'm fine. 

And to be clear, whatever they did previously, they now issue fixed quotes before surveying and they emphasise it's fixed. They price they quoted me before the survey is the price I have signed a contract for after surveying. Even the installer told me to push back on the 50º design temp but they wouldn't budge.  

I think maybe they're gearing up to bosh out their plug-and-play Cosy. 🙀

Spies

BG wanted around £7k via their instant website quote and Heatgeek was £5.5k with a maximum of 3 radiator changes.

Octopus cannot be beaten for whatever reason, maybe the easier installs subsidise the more expensive ones?

smallblueplanet

Spies said:

BG wanted around £7k via their instant website quote and Heatgeek was £5.5k with a maximum of 3 radiator changes.

Octopus cannot be beaten for whatever reason, maybe the easier installs subsidise the more expensive ones?

I'm not convinced of that either when you read (on the FB forum) some people's deals. I'd say it's more likely down to labour costs, but how can they know that either? 
It is what it is and a bit like the cost of plane tickets or similar being 'variable' if you are happy with your quote then that's all you should concentrate on.

MP1995

I think unless you know your stuff with heat pumps the order should be heat geeks first then an energy supplier of your choice and accept they might not spec the system to its most efficient state but will be cheaper.

Although give the energy suppliers another couple of years under their belts and who knows they might set the bar for systems running at 35oc not 50oc

stripling

smallblueplanet said:

Spies said:

BG wanted around £7k via their instant website quote and Heatgeek was £5.5k with a maximum of 3 radiator changes.

Octopus cannot be beaten for whatever reason, maybe the easier installs subsidise the more expensive ones?

I'm not convinced of that either when you read (on the FB forum) some people's deals. I'd say it's more likely down to labour costs, but how can they know that either? 
It is what it is and a bit like the cost of plane tickets or similar being 'variable' if you are happy with your quote then that's all you should concentrate on.

I think it's swings and roundabouts.. I don't think it's labour costs in my case because I'm a quick install - they've said this. I really can't work out their logic. I asked right at the beginning after the online fixed quote and all I got was nonsense bluster from sales. 

Plane tickets are variable only if you don't know what you are doing (ie *how* you buy them) or if you don't buy at the optimal time. These two things make a huge difference to what you pay. If you have to fly regularly you know this and factor it in if you can. 

The heat pump market is a mess.  If we want to see the switch to carbon-free heating for environmental reasons then the cost of installing heat pumps has got to come down or it won't ever happen.  And it needs to be credible - in terms of a degree of stability of pricing. Like installing gas boilers. 

Also, Mr & Mrs Jo Public aren't going to jump on the seriously steep learning curve I put myself on, for example, just to buy a heating system. The Octopus Cosy is an attempt to change that by manufacturing a plug-and-play version but unless the electricity market is also changed it will be too expensive in running costs compared to gas to run... 

Heat Geek have only had fewer than 200 installations according to Adam Chapman in the Guardian recently which is not so good although he also says there's 750 "have begun the process of connecting to an installer".  

Octopus / BG /Ovo and the like have huge buying power so are paying peanuts for kit and lower wages than the independents. Heat Geek is a brand that has its ups and downs - their training is online whereas Octopus and BG mix classroom with on-the-job training. 

Thus, as I said - the heat pump market is a bit of a mess right now. That's inevitable as it is a relatively new development in the UK but these random figures from Octopus that bear minimal relation to effective costs are just going to kill credibility. Particularly when not all the installs are so great - although Octopus mostly have a good reputation for returning to put things right at least.  

A few people on YouTube have published their entire contracts including costs and documented their installations I think the more people share and are transparent about costs and how their installation went - the better. I didn't opt for a heat pump as a lifestyle choice, my gas boiler died and it seems wrong to put another one in.  I'm an example of how most customers will likely arrive at buying a heat pump. But doing this is costing me a LOT more than a new gas boiler. 🙈