Diary of a 30-something idiot

in_need_of_direction

have you calculated how much more quickly you could clear debt if OH got even 10 hours per week at minimum wage?

stymied

I love the idea of breaking it down week by week @foxandflowers! Especially if there’s a visual success chart involved.

Could you cost out how much it would be for you to start learning to drive and see if it’s doable sooner rather than later?

dreaming

foxandflowers said:

I snapped a bit last night and pointed out that I leave the house at 6.45, and don't get back until 6pm, then there is cooking, cleaning the kitchen, tackling laundry etc etc etc and then its bedtime and I have had no downtime except the two hours I spend on public transport. He said that he just wants me to go through things with him and get a system in place, and I wish I'd had the balls to say "You don't need a system to do ironing if you see full ironing baskets, or put rubbish in the bin instead of near it? You just do it because you see it needs doing, like I do every day??" I mean, surely that's basic adulting. I'm going to talk him through everything this weekend and then see how we go next week. But it cannot carry on like this. And I know I keep saying that, and things KEEP carrying on like that, but I'm not quite ready to face up to that part of my life. Sorry. I know you all want me to, but I'm just not able to yet. 

This part of your post immediately made me think of my son who was diagnosed as having Asperger's when he was 38 (I don't think it is called that anymore but that was what the psychologist called it). The bit about your partner wanting a system put in place reminded me so much of my son who would pretty much do anything to help as long as the instructions were very clear. Asking him to "have a bit of tidy round" meant nothing to him but if I said "put the books back in the bookcase and wash your cups up" he would do so. As we both learned more about Asperger's/autism, he was able to explain that he really doesn't see dirt or mess and that even if he did, he didn't really know how to deal with it so we put a "timetable" in place (he was back living with me by then as his relationship had broken down due largely to his apparent laziness). It largely worked, and I learned to be a lot more explicit in asking him to do things although there were a lot of other difficulties encountered. Anyway, I have wondered before whether your partner might be on the spectrum as many of the things you say about him are very similar to my son. I know many people (including me) have thought of him as lazy (definitely something I often accused my son of) but maybe there is an underlying cause. Unfortunately unless he is willing to seek help for himself it is unlikely to confirm or rule this possibility out (and even getting any sort of appointment in this area is nigh on impossible) but it might be worth trying to put a system in place of him doing certain jobs on certain days. It will be slow progress, and I know how hard it is when they are meant to be an adult (I sometimes felt that I had a toddler living with me instead of a fully grown man in his 30's) and especially when you want an equal partner, but it might just help. 

MeandO

foxandflowers said:

I don't want you to feel sorry for me! It was more a musing on how there is inevitably too much month at the end of my money, and I can probably manage that a bit better if I apportion things out into weekly sections. And as an added bonus, if I can save the bus fare money and use it for wine and brownies - then that doesn't have to come from the groceries budget, and then that pot should hopefully have money spare at the end of March for rounding over  

I snapped a bit last night and pointed out that I leave the house at 6.45, and don't get back until 6pm, then there is cooking, cleaning the kitchen, tackling laundry etc etc etc and then its bedtime and I have had no downtime except the two hours I spend on public transport. He said that he just wants me to go through things with him and get a system in place, and I wish I'd had the balls to say "You don't need a system to do ironing if you see full ironing baskets, or put rubbish in the bin instead of near it? You just do it because you see it needs doing, like I do every day??" I mean, surely that's basic adulting. I'm going to talk him through everything this weekend and then see how we go next week. But it cannot carry on like this. And I know I keep saying that, and things KEEP carrying on like that, but I'm not quite ready to face up to that part of my life. Sorry. I know you all want me to, but I'm just not able to yet. 

Hi Fox, apologies, I'm not always very good with words and I hope it didn't sound patronising, it wasn't meant in that way, just out of sadness for the way you're trying so hard and getting nothing in return.

I will confess, I actually cried reading the post you made as I could have written it some years ago when I was married and doing everything for my then husband, coping with a poorly baby, paying off the debt and managing the household more or less completely alone. I had no family or friends nearby and was constantly on survival mode. I realise now that I was also dealing with undiagnosed postnatal depression and huge amounts of anxiety which made things so much more difficult. I spent so long trying to tweak budgets and scrape together money for this and that that it became utterly exhausting and it broke me. I just really feel for you and hope you can find the strength to tackle the real issue as difficult as that is to do. 

I'm not surprised you lost it last night. As for 'needing a system from you', if I remember rightly, you have been down this road with him before. You had the same scenario and conversation last year and any change was short lived.
I remember your elation at coming home to having the dishwasher or washing machine on and I felt sadness then that you deserved so much more. I'm sorry to sound like a broken record, but any improvement in his help around the house is likely only to last for a few more weeks until the pattern repeats itself. 

As Humdinger suggested, counselling may really be a game changer for you. I have had very low self esteem most of my life and I went down the route of counselling last year. If you don't want to speak to the doctor, I know from personal experience that women's aid provide a very good (free) telephone service in this area and they are extremely supportive. They're not just for women with physical domestic violence issues as many perceive them to be.  xx

WinterWarrior

Like @MeandO I had a similar first marriage and looking back it feels like I had a form of Stockholm syndrome for 20 years. That dithering cost me financially as well as emotionally as he had no assets and took half of everything I had worked so hard for including my pension. I know it’s so hard to hear, I’ve been there and I do wish I’d had this lovely gang of online friends to share their experience with me back then, so I hope you take this in the spirit it is intended. You deserve a much easier life with multiple brownies and nice things. 

foxgloves

@foxandflowers - I wondered if perhaps Mr Fand F has always been used to women doing all of the household tasks. I remember reading a magazine article a while back which surprised me because I thought that in the 2020s, really, we should as a society have left this highly gendered division behind, but apparently not because it perpetuates down the generations. Men still often grow up in households where women run the household, including domestic finances, childcare, etc, so when they move out & live with partners, they expect the same. Women then facilitate this by doing all of the above, as well as often working. I have often challenged colleagues who would complain about having to do everything at home & the response was often that it just ended up being easier than having to explain it all, or do it again if it wasn't done properly, etc, & I used to think that this is exactly how they had made a rod for their own backs. Not so many blokes are going to be jumping up volunteering for dull household chores if women are already doing them. I don't buy the oft heard thing about men doing the jobs poorly either. I think that can be a way of getting out of being expected to do it again. A friend once said she ironed all her husband's shirts. They both worked full-time. She said he would leave creases in them. Well, tough banana! If he lived in my house, he'd have been going to work in creased shirts! I know that in some cases, things have moved on socially, in that there are husbands doing childcare & running the home while their wife works & that is a fair division of labour. What ISN'T fair is a situation where one half of the relationship goes out to work, runs the household finances, cooks, cleans, does the laundry, shops, etc, while the other half is at home all day contributing nothing. I don't work since my VR, but I do my share by running the household & its economy (including getting us debt-free after very many silly spendy years), growing food & plenty of other stuff. We can manage perfectly well on one income. If we couldn't & were unable to pay our bills & outgoings, then I would return to work. 
So, I just wondered if Mr Fand F has always been used to women doing everything. If so, it is 2024. not 1950 & he needs to show some responsibility & pull his weight. I absolutely agree with you that ANY adult should know that washing needs doing, an evening meal needs cooking, the house needs cleaning, etc, I think 'You need to tell me & give me a system' is just a well-worn male get-out clause for not doing it. You must be a very kind person, as he wouldn't last 5 minutes in our house! 
Look after yourself - we are all concerned about how much you have to do & the fact that you are doing it alone doesn't help your goals around money management & becoming debt-free. 
F x

stymied

Are there people who do better without a list? I know my productivity goes up if I know what I intend to achieve that day, at work as well as at home. Trying to organise / keep it all in my head just doesn’t work for me personally.

foxandflowers

@MeandO don't worry, I didn't think you were being patronising, I totally took it as intended and appreciate you so much for always looking out for my wellbeing.

@foxgloves the response was often that it just ended up being easier than having to explain it all, or do it again if it wasn't done properly, etc, & I used to think that this is exactly how they had made a rod for their own backs the phrase for this is weaponised incompetence, and I think it's a tool a certain person in my house has learned to wield. I am naturally a caretaker, and I have found myself over the last eight years doing more and more until it's got to this point where I am doing everything and he is pretending he doesn't know how a washing machine works. Actually, he might not know - before me his mum used to do his laundry. Either way, I guess I will show him what's what this weekend, if I don't divorce him first. 

@stymiedI have printed off a whole colouring in debt tracking worksheets and I've made them into a little workbook We have Non-Stepchange debt, Friend One loan, Friend Two loan, Stepchange debt, Mayglothling, Mr F credit card, misc little debts, and two emergency fund trackers. I printed them off at work and stapled them together and I am very much looking forward to colouring them in haha. 

In work related news: the amount I needed at £25 weekly overpayments was approximately £1300 per year. I've just been told there is definitely a retention payment due to me in March and June. March will not be the full amount because I haven't been here long enough, but ought to be £3-400ish, and June is £1000 after tax... I am stunned. I don't actually know what to do with that money. Do I chuck it all into an emergency fund? Do I pay off some debt? Do I take it out in cash and stuff it under my mattress (only joking). In the past I would have been all over the idea of spending it on something extravagant, but even every single thing on my wishlist would only be about £500. And I don't want to waste it. I also don't want to tell Mr F about it, because he will come up with something that "needs" spending on and I don't want to do that. That's a huge amount of money to essentially fall into my lap. HELP. 

enthusiasticsaver

I strongly suggest you do not tell MrF about any work bonus. Squirrel it away in an account for emergencies. 

IdaClaire

It’s like the light is seeping in, missus 😊 Proud of you.

The universe has provided! Say nothing about the money to himself. An item or two off your list wish list and something for your girl. Then, half to emergency fund, half to debt. Pay your friends first would be my choice, even if maybe not the most sensible.