EV Discussion thread

JKenH

How Tesla Autopilot and Full Self-Driving fared during a 6,400-mile drive

Autopilot and FSD undoubtedly take some if the strain off a long journey and the videos I have seen of FSD are impressive. However I felt this comment was significant and from what I have heard reflects the views of many.

“As a result of changing focus, Autopilot experience is worse than when we got our Model 3 in summer 2019,” he said.

Please note the link takes you first to an article about a Tesla being driven off a cliff and you  need to scroll through that.

https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-miracle-250-foot-cliff-drop-video/

JKenH

Cruise’s driverless robotaxis are accepting passengers in Phoenix and Austin

It’s not without its problems but cruise is operating a commercial service.

https://www.theverge.com/2022/12/20/23518833/cruise-driverless-taxi-austin-phoenix-waitlist

I am posting this in response to the querying of a comment made in an earlier post about Ford and GM offering competition to Tesla. Robo taxis were one of the drivers of Tesla’s meteoric share price rise and the failure to capitalise may be one of the factors behind the subsequent fall. Elon Musk had famously said “The overwhelming focus is on solving full self-drivng. It’s really the difference between Tesla being worth a lot of money or worth basically zero.”

michaels

UK new car sales hit 30-year low but electric vehicle demand soars - BBC News

What I find interesting is the comments.   Many with the most up-votes are entirely misinformed and factually incorrect.

(In general based on the comments and up-votes on HYS I do despair for the country)

Grumpy_chap

michaels said:

UK new car sales hit 30-year low but electric vehicle demand soars - BBC News

What I find interesting is the comments.   Many with the most up-votes are entirely misinformed and factually incorrect.

(In general based on the comments and up-votes on HYS I do despair for the country)

What I found interesting in that piece was the statement that that low sales were because of supply-constraints:
"Although demand for new vehicles remained high, manufacturers struggled to get hold of parts."

As cost of living bites and manufacturers overcome supply-chain challenges, it may well create the perfect storm for manufacturers.

Petriix

michaels said:

UK new car sales hit 30-year low but electric vehicle demand soars - BBC News

What I find interesting is the comments.   Many with the most up-votes are entirely misinformed and factually incorrect.

(In general based on the comments and up-votes on HYS I do despair for the country)

Generally speaking the people who comment and rate comments on BBC articles tend to be from a pretty narrow section of society with generally conservative views and a dislike for change. 

JKenH

Just an update on today’s WBAC values. My old 20 plate 40kWh Leaf is now down to £14k (from £20,685 in October) and my son’s old 30kWh Leaf (which he sold for £11.5k when he got mine) is now down to £8k (I can’t recall the exact figure back in October but it was around £12k). 

Meanwhile my 20 plate petrol Golf went from £15k in November to £14,550 in December to £14,645 today.

I got a WBAC valuation in May on a 69 plate 14k miles Tesla SR+ of £43k. Today it is £27,745.

Petriix

It's generally a really good thing if EVs are becoming affordable. 40kWh Leafs were available from about £22k in 2019 new so £7k depreciation in 4 years seems reasonable. The going rate on Autotrader is closer to £16k on the whole with only a few very high mileage or cat N examples under £15k.

JKenH

I’ve only looked at Tesla and Leaf prices and I suspect they have suffered worse than other EVs because the used car market is awash with them coming off leases. 3 years ago they were the only EVs available in volume and were purchased by fleets and in SalSac schemes. When I bought my last Leaf in January 2020 (for March delivery) you were waiting 9 months for a Kia e-Niro and the VW ID3 had yet to appear. 

Demand for used EVs has slowed a little because of the higher electricity prices just as used Leaf and Tesla supply has shot up. It only takes a small adjustment to supply or demand to seriously affect prices in an elastic market. 

I don’t think we can read too much long term into the current trade pricing caused by exceptional factors but I am concerned that the used EV market demand will take a while to catch up with new EV demand which is driven by financial (tax) incentives not available to the used car buyer.

JKenH

Tesla cuts prices of its entire China line-up

https://www.electrive.com/2023/01/06/tesla-cuts-prices-of-its-entire-china-line-up/

The Tesla Model 3 is now available in China for the equivalent of around £28000. List price in the UK is £48,490 but on the Tesla website it seems that it will actually cost £51,090. I know it is not unusual for there to be regional variations (Apple traditionally used to charge the same price in £ as in $) and there are shipping costs and of course local taxes but this difference is huge. Is Tesla actually making any money in China? Presumably the marginal cost of producing each extra car is less than £28k but it will erode Tesla’s market leading margins. 

https://www.tesla.com/model3/design

Edit: For comparison this thread suggests the MG4 retails for £23,460 in China compared to £25,995 in the UK.

https://www.mgevs.com/threads/mg4s-prices-in-china.7324/

1961Nick

JKenH said:

Tesla cuts prices of its entire China line-up

https://www.electrive.com/2023/01/06/tesla-cuts-prices-of-its-entire-china-line-up/

The Tesla Model 3 is now available in China for the equivalent of around £28000. List price in the UK is £48,490 but on the Tesla website it seems that it will actually cost £51,090. I know it is not unusual for there to be regional variations (Apple traditionally used to charge the same price in £ as in $) and there are shipping costs and of course local taxes but this difference is huge. Is Tesla actually making any money in China? Presumably the marginal cost of producing each extra car is less than £28k but it will erode Tesla’s market leading margins. 

https://www.tesla.com/model3/design

Edit: For comparison this thread suggests the MG4 retails for £23,460 in China compared to £25,995 in the UK.

https://www.mgevs.com/threads/mg4s-prices-in-china.7324/

You've got metallic & 19" wheels selected. The base price is £48490. Excluding vat & destination fee the price is £39473. I don't think China taxes BEVs so the difference is about £11.5K.

The TM3 is probably cheaper to manufacture than the MG4 due to the giga presses used for the front & rear structures. The structural battery pack has also reduced cost significantly according to Musk.