EV Discussion thread

Martyn1981

70sbudgie said:

Probably a weird question, but how big are they, physically? I am definitely after what would be classed as a small family (electric) car. There are many occasions (mainly on the school run) when I am grateful for having a small car which allows me to park in places most other parents can't! My children are now tall enough not to need car seats, so I don't have to worry so much about rear seat headroom, which the Zoe was surprisingly great for. 

I think the Leaf is probably the biggest that I would like to go for. 

If £40k is too much for a smaller EV, I am more than happy to adapt down! My minimum size is based on not feeling too vulnerable on the motorway and being able to comfortably fit a ~5'6 adult in the back. 

I think your plans are sound. Even the smaller BEV's have great road presence thanks to the slightly higher weight, but mostly because it's placed evenly and low in the car. [Obviously you know all this, just agreeing with you.]

I think the Zoe and Leaf actually shared the same platform for a while, but not sure which models, and the Leaf (to me) does look bigger. Not the friendliest charging compared to other offerings, but excellent value with the huge discounts.

Tesla's are big, not only are they longer, so akin to the bigger offerings, but they are more American wide, than many European cars. It's not much, but if parking, school runs etc are tight, then it is an issue to consider.

You may like the Hyundai/Kia offerings such as the Kona/Niro, not as heavily discounted, and maybe a tad bigger than the Zoe. Or there's smaller models like the EV3 coming out, but no discounting yet. I did see the new Hyundai Inster at the recent Everything Electric show, and that's 'as cute as a button', with a small package, but plenty of room. But again, new, so no discounts yet.

Also saw the new retro Renault 5, looks super cool (perhaps just to me, as I wanted a R5 Turbo in the 1980's but couldn't get the insurance). It's a similar size to the Zoe, perhaps a tad shorter, should be selling in the low to high £20k's depending on trim/options. So if you were generally happy with Renault (just not the Zoe issues) then that's an option.

Starting to feel like I'm just listing evrything now, incredible how many options there are. Plus I don't think the UK is following the EU with the additional tariffs on Chinese cars, so we may get 'flooded' with options from there, and the many, many, many companies.

Magnitio

70sbudgie said:

Probably a weird question, but how big are they, physically? I am definitely after what would be classed as a small family (electric) car. There are many occasions (mainly on the school run) when I am grateful for having a small car which allows me to park in places most other parents can't! My children are now tall enough not to need car seats, so I don't have to worry so much about rear seat headroom, which the Zoe was surprisingly great for. 

I think the Leaf is probably the biggest that I would like to go for. 

If £40k is too much for a smaller EV, I am more than happy to adapt down! My minimum size is based on not feeling too vulnerable on the motorway and being able to comfortably fit a ~5'6 adult in the back. 

It's worth considering the VW ID3, especially the updated version if that fits within your budget. It's not too large and has a great turning-circle. If you do look at older ones, make sure the software has been updated and that there are no battery issues.

JKenH

JKenH said:

Sounding increasingly likely we won’t see the Model 2 anytime soon. Musk denied the Reuters report it had been cancelled but it amounts to the same thing. 

Tesla puts ‘$25,000 electric car’ codenamed NV9 on back burner despite what Elon Musk said

Electrek can confirm that the program, which was internally called ‘NV9’, was postponed, according to sources familiar with the matter.

Musk might take issues with claiming that it is “canceled”, but the project is effectively scratched right now as Tesla is putting all resources into its self-driving effort.

According to sources familiar with the matter, Musk told Tesla’s team in Austin in December 2023 that NV9, an expansion of Gigafactory Texas for the new cheaper next-gen model, was a priority for 2024.

However, the project was recently completely defunded, and many people involved in it were laid off as part of the round of layoffs announced today.

https://electrek.co/2024/04/15/tesla-puts-electric-car-codenamed-nv9-back-burner-despite-elon-musk-said/

Elon Musk Confirms There’s No $25,000 Tesla EV On The Way

In April, the volatile billionaire claimed Reuters was “lying” after it reported that the so-called Model 2 program was canceled, but now he appears to have validated that story.

“We’re not making a non-robotaxi model,” he said. “I think we’ve made very clear that the future is autonomous.”

https://www.forbes.com/sites/alanohnsman/2024/10/23/elon-musk-confirms-theres-no-25000-tesla-ev-on-the-way/

JKenH

Charging downtime costing fleets eight times more than the electricity

Charging downtime is costing job need electric fleets eight times more than the electricity used to top up the batteries, according to estimates from Co Charger.

The neighbourhood community charging business estimates that time lost to charging typically costs £17,000 per year per asset or around 260 non-productive hours across a 12-month period to charge while “on shift”.

https://www.fleetnews.co.uk/news/charging-downtime-costing-fleets-eight-times-more-than-the-electricity

silvercar

Exiled_Tyke said:

There are about 70 Tesla chargers in the UK which are now open to non-Tesla cars. Off-peak they are about 50p/kWh. 

Also regarding the over £40k car tax, this is currently applied to EVs. From next year the standard car tax will be applied but as things stand not the super-tax.  This could all change next week though. 

22 out of 90 supercharging stations open to all EVs. 

michaels

70sbudgie said:

Nearly all my charging is at home, except for maybe one trip a month where I need to stop and charge. But as that is usually a 4 hour drive, I stop midway to recharge myself. So far I have done pretty well with type 2 EV chargers - although there aren't as many type 2 chargers, there also isn't much competition! And my Zoe can charge with. three phase type 2 ie up to 22kW. My next EV shouldn't really be a technological step backwards 

Edit to add that I like fast type 2 chargers because they are invariably cheaper.

I think the French are the ones who are big into 22kw AC so I guess it will be Renault Group and Stellantis group cars that are most likely to support it.  However I suspect it will be a dying standard as most who are charging on route will want the fastest speeds possible, which generally now means a minimum of 100kw on a DC charger.

The Leaf is considerably larger than the Zoe (think golf rather than polo).  There are a few of the smaller size EZs (old Kona, Kia Soul, Dacia Spring, A BYD) and lots more coming but they do tend to have shorter range than the next size up cars but probably all good for 200 miles with a single charge in all weathers.

Martyn1981

silvercar said:

Exiled_Tyke said:

There are about 70 Tesla chargers in the UK which are now open to non-Tesla cars. Off-peak they are about 50p/kWh. 

Also regarding the over £40k car tax, this is currently applied to EVs. From next year the standard car tax will be applied but as things stand not the super-tax.  This could all change next week though. 

22 out of 90 supercharging stations open to all EVs. 

I just did a quick count and I think it's ~73.

I think they opened 14 stations originally, then upped that to 22 shortly after, but that was a year or so ago.

Exiled_Tyke

Martyn1981 said:

silvercar said:

Exiled_Tyke said:

There are about 70 Tesla chargers in the UK which are now open to non-Tesla cars. Off-peak they are about 50p/kWh. 

Also regarding the over £40k car tax, this is currently applied to EVs. From next year the standard car tax will be applied but as things stand not the super-tax.  This could all change next week though. 

22 out of 90 supercharging stations open to all EVs. 

I just did a quick count and I think it's ~73.

I think they opened 14 stations originally, then upped that to 22 shortly after, but that was a year or so ago.

yeah I did the same count up as you a week or so ago to come up with this estimate. 

EricMears

Martyn1981 said:

At ~£40k you really have massive choice. Perhaps just manage a Tesla 3, and close to some of the discounts now on the massive Jaguar Ipace down £30k to around low £40k's.

Then, on Autrotrader you get to see so many cars at huge discounts into the mid/low £20k's - Corsa and Mokka E's, Peugeot E208, Nissan Leaf 40kWh (bit short of 200 miles), MG4.

Peugeot E308, Nissan Leaf 62kWh around £30k.

Loads of choice, so if you're happy to take your time, you can probably test loads and see what you really like.

Alas,  'luxury car tax' is based on a car's list price rather than actual amount paid !
see: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/administrative-amendment-to-vehicle-excise-duty-expensive-car-supplement/administrative-amendment-to-vehicle-excise-duty-expensive-car-supplement

michaels

There is some sort of budget change in VED rates but possibly sounds like VED still coming to EVs but combustion cars will see an increases so EVs are cheaper?