EV Discussion thread

Martyn1981

1961Nick said:

Reed_Richards said:

I've measured my charging losses at home and I get 90% of what I put in.  I wasn't trying to brag about my low costs per mile, just to complain about the high costs per mile of charging anywhere other than at home at night.

Mine's similar at 92.9% using a 7.2kWh home charger.

Can you remind me what the granny charger efficiency was? I think you reported it as a bit over 10% loss, but I've forgotten.

We tend to charge the Tesla with the granny (on cheap rate) as that usually widens the cheap rate period, so we get to run the A2A for longer through the cold periods. And now as we start to enter PV territory, it works well for that too. We can of course, dial down the amps even from the 7kW charger, but when I asked Indra, they said their chargers don't like operating at low levels for long periods. That sounds weird to me, but not a problem with the granny.

As you say, with cheap home charging, the cost of driving is incredibly cheap anyway.

1961Nick

Martyn1981 said:

1961Nick said:

Reed_Richards said:

I've measured my charging losses at home and I get 90% of what I put in.  I wasn't trying to brag about my low costs per mile, just to complain about the high costs per mile of charging anywhere other than at home at night.

Mine's similar at 92.9% using a 7.2kWh home charger.

Can you remind me what the granny charger efficiency was? I think you reported it as a bit over 10% loss, but I've forgotten.

We tend to charge the Tesla with the granny (on cheap rate) as that usually widens the cheap rate period, so we get to run the A2A for longer through the cold periods. And now as we start to enter PV territory, it works well for that too. We can of course, dial down the amps even from the 7kW charger, but when I asked Indra, they said their chargers don't like operating at low levels for long periods. That sounds weird to me, but not a problem with the granny.

As you say, with cheap home charging, the cost of driving is incredibly cheap anyway.

The only time I used my granny charger was 18 months ago when my Rolec wallbox was playing up. From memory the loss was over 10% but you'd expect that because the car's charging hardware is active for 3x longer for a given charge. Grumpy has much more accurate data for 2.5kWh charging.

1961Nick

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/04/18/ftse-100-markets-latest-news-oil-interest-rates-inflation/

Electric car sales plummeted across Europe last month as demand dried up despite the EU’s push to ban petrol and diesel vehicles by the middle of the next decade.

Sales of battery-powered cars dropped by 11.3pc as demand in Germany, Europe’s largest economy, plunged by 28.9pc, according to the European Automobile Manufacturers’ Association (ACEA).

Only 13pc of new registrations were electric, down from 13.9pc in March last year and down from 14.6pc for all of 2023.

Sales of electric cars have stalled despite Europe’s plans to ban the sale of new internal combustion engine cars by 2035.

It's beginning to look as if the public are telling the politicians that they'll accept hybrids but not BEVs. That's not good news for Tesla but it could reduce competition in the BEV market.

shinytop

1961Nick said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/04/18/ftse-100-markets-latest-news-oil-interest-rates-inflation/

Electric car sales plummeted across Europe last month as demand dried up despite the EU’s push to ban petrol and diesel vehicles by the middle of the next decade.

Sales of battery-powered cars dropped by 11.3pc as demand in Germany, Europe’s largest economy, plunged by 28.9pc, according to the European Automobile Manufacturers’ Association (ACEA).

Only 13pc of new registrations were electric, down from 13.9pc in March last year and down from 14.6pc for all of 2023.

Sales of electric cars have stalled despite Europe’s plans to ban the sale of new internal combustion engine cars by 2035.

It's beginning to look as if the public are telling the politicians that they'll accept hybrids but not BEVs. That's not good news for Tesla but it could reduce competition in the BEV market.

I suspect some sort of reset is due.  Even the Scottish Government is backing off from its unrealistic targets. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-68841141#:~:text=The Scottish government is to,climate targets could also go.

If people are willing to accept hybrids, especially PHEVs, maybe the powers that be should "take the win" and adjust policy accordingly.

michaels

1961Nick said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/04/18/ftse-100-markets-latest-news-oil-interest-rates-inflation/

Electric car sales plummeted across Europe last month as demand dried up despite the EU’s push to ban petrol and diesel vehicles by the middle of the next decade.

Sales of battery-powered cars dropped by 11.3pc as demand in Germany, Europe’s largest economy, plunged by 28.9pc, according to the European Automobile Manufacturers’ Association (ACEA).

Only 13pc of new registrations were electric, down from 13.9pc in March last year and down from 14.6pc for all of 2023.

Sales of electric cars have stalled despite Europe’s plans to ban the sale of new internal combustion engine cars by 2035.

It's beginning to look as if the public are telling the politicians that they'll accept hybrids but not BEVs. That's not good news for Tesla but it could reduce competition in the BEV market.

Didn't Germany remove or scale back a subsidy this year - not surprising that sales would have been pulled forward to last year and thus fall this year.  All the subsidies are distorting the new and also second hand markets which then screws with residuals which in turn depresses the new market - and this on top of the technology curve which means EVs are getting better and cheaper every year making it always worthwhile to delay a purchase as next year EVs will be cheaper and better than this year, a double whammy as used prices for this year's models will also be depressed by the availability of these better, cheaper new models.

The opposite is true for ICE cars, they are getting more expensive and limited second hand supply (exacerbated by supply being cut off during the pandemic) means stronger than historic residuals making buying new better value than normal.

Other examples are the UK where the congestion charge and road tax exemptions are ending.

Magnitio

Martyn1981 said:

1961Nick said:

Reed_Richards said:

I've measured my charging losses at home and I get 90% of what I put in.  I wasn't trying to brag about my low costs per mile, just to complain about the high costs per mile of charging anywhere other than at home at night.

Mine's similar at 92.9% using a 7.2kWh home charger.

Can you remind me what the granny charger efficiency was? I think you reported it as a bit over 10% loss, but I've forgotten.

We tend to charge the Tesla with the granny (on cheap rate) as that usually widens the cheap rate period, so we get to run the A2A for longer through the cold periods. And now as we start to enter PV territory, it works well for that too. We can of course, dial down the amps even from the 7kW charger, but when I asked Indra, they said their chargers don't like operating at low levels for long periods. That sounds weird to me, but not a problem with the granny.

As you say, with cheap home charging, the cost of driving is incredibly cheap anyway.

I've been using a granny charger for our e-Golf. The average consumption according to the car over the past 5 months is 4.05m/kWh. Based on the actual energy that has been recorded to charge the car, the consumption is 3.35m/kWh. This works out about 83% efficient. I'm not totally confident in what the car reports though as it seems to ignore the pre-heating of the cabin. Hopefully know more in the coming months unless we start pre-cooling.

JKenH

At last some objectivity. If you are thinking of getting the Model3 Highland and are worried about the gear selector or lack of steering stalks you should have a look at this review from an owner first. Most of the comments concur. You can rely on an Aussie for some straight talking.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1737462746527033/permalink/3626521297621159/?

JKenH

This probably won’t make much sense to anyone who hasn’t driven on track but being able to control how a car behaves when you lift off does make a difference as weight transfer is used to load or unload wheels. On the road however, while it may feel satisfying to row through the gears, I don’t see it as having quite the same benefit. 

I Was Ready To Hate Hyundai's Fake EV 'Shifting.' Then I Tried It

It sounded stupid. When Hyundai announced that the Ioniq 5 N would let drivers pretend it had an eight-speed dual-clutch transmission, I thought there was a real chance the company had ruined what could have been the world's first great enthusiast EV. Then I tried the clunkily named "N e-Shift" for our on-track review, and I saw the light. It isn't just a good idea. It's a huge leap forward for performance EVs.

https://insideevs.com/reviews/716661/hyundai-ioniq-5-n-shift/

1961Nick

JKenH said:

This probably won’t make much sense to anyone who hasn’t driven on track but being able to control how a car behaves when you lift off does make a difference as weight transfer is used to load or unload wheels. On the road however, while it may feel satisfying to row through the gears, I don’t see it as having quite the same benefit. 

I Was Ready To Hate Hyundai's Fake EV 'Shifting.' Then I Tried It

It sounded stupid. When Hyundai announced that the Ioniq 5 N would let drivers pretend it had an eight-speed dual-clutch transmission, I thought there was a real chance the company had ruined what could have been the world's first great enthusiast EV. Then I tried the clunkily named "N e-Shift" for our on-track review, and I saw the light. It isn't just a good idea. It's a huge leap forward for performance EVs.

https://insideevs.com/reviews/716661/hyundai-ioniq-5-n-shift/

Tesla's relatively strong regenerative braking enables you to control the weight transfer through a corner with just the one pedal. That's a lot easier for fast road driving that balancing the car with the brake & throttle on an ICEV.

I've noticed that there is now a trend of decoupling the transmission on the overrun on ICEVs to save fuel. I find that very irritating as it often leads to a stab of the brake pedal approaching a corner. Selecting a sport setting usually disables it but at the cost of spending too much time in a low gear. Even the latest Porsches have this annoying feature!

Netexporter

Tesla's relatively strong regenerative braking enables you to control the weight transfer through a corner with just the one pedal.

Also works on my humble MG5. I love one-pedal driving.