EV Discussion thread

Netexporter

The Zoe was pretty good at 1,500kg to 1,600kg, and the Chinese are lighter than most legacy auto BEV's .... I think?

My 61kWh MG5 is 1550kg and it isn't even built on a dedicated EV platform.

Grumpy_chap

1961Nick said:

shinytop said:

Grumpy_chap said:

So, why does the VW cost so much please compared to my TM3?

Isn't it a different class, i.e. bigger? Like comparing a 3 series to a 5?

The ID7 is about 8" longer than the Model 3 & it'll be interesting to see how much of that translates into cabin space. The big difference is weight with the ID7 being 400kg heavier.

The combined front & rear legroom for a model 3 is 77.9" which is exactly the same as a 5 series. I can't find the spec for the ID7 other than 'palatial in the rear'.

I am not sure whether the extra 8" makes it a size class up or not - possibly does assuming that the extra space is used effectively to benefit cabin comfort and / or luggage volume.  If the extra 8" all gets lost just in the structure then the benefit is less.

Still, today, the iD7 is £55.5k with 384 mile range.
The TM3 LR is £50k with 390 mile range.
That is the new "highlander" version of the TM3.

My TM3 purchased in June was a fair bit cheaper than the TM3 facelift pricing (I must have benefitted from the model run-out).

Both are comfortable family cars (by the looks of it) with reasonable amounts of space.
It is difficult to see how VW aim to make significant inroads against the TM3 if their price entry point into the product is so challenged.
I suppose it might depend on how much the price is marketing driven and how much the price is forced by costs of manufacture (which VW won't share readily).




PS - nothing in the Autumn Statement to change anything vis-a-vis EVs or any other environmental points so far as I heard.

QrizB

Reed_Richards said:

My OH hates heated seats, says it feels like you've wet yourself.

I like heated seats. I'm sitting on one now!

JKenH

The OBR is out of touch with what is happening in the electric car market. Contrast its comments about upfront costs and higher interest rates in the first report below with the reality of (generally) falling PCPcosts shown in the second report.

Watchdog lowers forecast for sales of electric cars

The fiscal watchdog said generally higher upfront costs of electric cars would “likely still be disincentivising many consumers”, adding this particularly related to purchases using car finance as interest rates were significantly higher than anticipated in 2022.

https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/politics/6267965/watchdog-lowers-forecast-for-sales-of-electric-cars/

New EV discounting rockets 323% in 12 months: What Car?

What Car?’s exclusive Target Price mystery shopper data revealed that, between November 2022 and November this year, the average combined cash and finance discount for fully electric vehicles in the UK increased by 323%, with the average combined discount worth £4,399.

https://www.am-online.com/news/market-insight/2023/11/23/ev-discounts-rocket-323-in-12-months-what-car

Martyn1981

This kinda tickled me, though I do feel a little sorry for the shops and ICEV owners, as its so hard to get anything right at the start of a major transition. So ..... there aren't enough public chargers/charging spaces ...... or are there too many?

In this example, there are currently too many EV spaces (20%), which is upsetting ICE owners, and I can get that with parking limited. Spare spaces will encourage EV ownership, or at least reduce fears, so I guess it's a no-win situation, at the moment for LA's.

Did think that they could mark some up as open to all, and revise over time, but the article mentions Gov subsidies/policies, to which that might controvene.

Early days, and baby steps, I suppose. 20% of spaces does sound great, but if parking is limited, and UK ownership is around 5% of the fleet, there will be many tricky balancing acts like this, going forward.

The UK Gives Us The Biggest EV Parking Spat I’ve Ever Seen

But, most of these parking lot spats are over a space or two at most. But, a recent story at Yahoo News (reprinted from The Yorkshire Post) tells the story of a spat over a whopping 10 EV parking spaces, and it involves a whole municipal government, hundreds of angry drivers, and some merchants who feel like they’re losing customers. And I thought Texas did stuff big!

Basically, the problem is that parking is scarce in historic Yorkshire Town. The main parking lot is always full of tourists and other paying customers, and they’re the lifeblood of the local economy. Out of 56 charging spaces, the local government put in 10 EV stations, marking them for EV charging only. But, EV adoption among the customers seems to be low, so most charging spaces sit empty, even on the busiest days.

Grumpy_chap

Martyn1981 said:

In this example, there are currently too many EV spaces (20%), which is upsetting ICE owners, and I can get that with parking limited. Spare spaces will encourage EV ownership, or at least reduce fears, so I guess it's a no-win situation, at the moment for LA's.

In our area, there are EV charge sockets being installed to lampposts.  Apparently, the Council is not able to designate the spaces as EV only, so these are available to all.  Most of the streets are back-to-back parked cars.  I have never seen anyone actually plugged into the lamppost chargers.

In other streets, there are fast chargers with the spaces designated as EV spaces.  The chargers seem to be out of order so no-one parks there at all whether EV or ICE.

Alnat1

In our small local railway station car park there are now 12 ordinary spaces and 4 with charging points. The problem is, the 4 spaces are for EVs to charge but not just if they want to park. 

Most EV drivers charge at home and don't need to charge at the station so use the ordinary bays and the EV bays are almost always empty. This results in more cars parked in the nearby street, making residents grumpy.

There are also now 2 disabled bays which are rarely used and a new disabled toilet which used up another 2 ordinary parking bays.

What was a 20 car parking area is now full with just 12 cars. Luckily they decided to put the new double decker 12 point cycle rack on the platform rather than the car park or that would have been 2 more bays gone. Not seen a cycle in there yet either.

Reed_Richards

I got an EV at the end of September and I'm a bit appalled at how my miles per kWh have gone down as the weather gets colder.  In the future, will EVs have an insulated cabin and double-glazed windows just to keep the heat in better? 

MikeJXE

Lol That won't go down well on this thread, you're not supposed to say negative things about an EV

I have just been reading an article regarding the super charging hub in Birmingham where it costs more to charge than it does to fill up with petrol but I darn't post it on here 

Grumpy_chap

Reed_Richards said:

I got an EV at the end of September and I'm a bit appalled at how my miles per kWh have gone down as the weather gets colder.  In the future, will EVs have an insulated cabin and double-glazed windows just to keep the heat in better? 

This is a thread to be open about EV - warts and all so I don't understand why others are suggesting the contrary.

In terms of miles per kWh, this will be impacted by extra loads such as cabin conditioning, more lights, wipers etc.  Particularly in the case of cabin heating, an EV needs to take battery energy to heat the cabin as there is little waste heat generated to provide cabin heating.  An ICE is inherently less efficient and produces loads of heat so can use that waste heat to warm the cabin.

Obviously, an EV starts from a baseline of around 4 miles / kWh.  It would have to reduce a lot to reach the 1 mile / kWh that is typical of an ICE.

I wonder about the detail of the charging hub that is, apparently, very expensive.  Is that the EV equivalent of a motorway petrol station which is much more expensive than the local supermarket?