Thinking for car change

Herzlos

Ibrahim5 said:

The point is that these second hand markets are toxic to the naive. Some people will pay £20k for a motorhome and buy a load of rubbish. EVs tend to have 8 year battery warranties. 8 year old EVs seem to go for about £10k. If the battery is dead you may have a £10k bill to fix it. A knowledgeable EV buyer may offload his EV at the right time and benefits from high residuals. The naive buyer might buy a 8 year old and need to pay another £10k to keep it on the road.

Sure, but how many 8 year old EVs have dead batteries? Almost none. They'll have degraded a bit (I'd guess no more than 30% loss) and that reduced range is going to be reflected in the price. That range would still be fine for the OP.

You can't assume that a warranty length is how long you'd expect a thing to last otherwise we'd be scrapping a lot of cars at 3 years old. 

Ibrahim5

Running an older EV risks an enormous bill. The Fiesta has a great engine. I don't see where such a big bill could ever come from. And the Fiesta will keep running when the EV is out of juice from it's old batteries.

grumiofoundation

Ibrahim5 said:

The budget is £5-10k which means getting a much older EV. They are the ones that will have battery issues. So you could end up paying the same again for a new battery. Much less risk with the tried and tested petrol they already have.

Ibrahim5 said:

The point is that these second hand markets are toxic to the naive. Some people will pay £20k for a motorhome and buy a load of rubbish. EVs tend to have 8 year battery warranties. 8 year old EVs seem to go for about £10k. If the battery is dead you may have a £10k bill to fix it. A knowledgeable EV buyer may offload his EV at the right time and benefits from high residuals. The naive buyer might buy a 8 year old and need to pay another £10k to keep it on the road.

Ibrahim5 said:

Running an older EV risks an enormous bill. The Fiesta has a great engine. I don't see where such a big bill could ever come from. And the Fiesta will keep running when the EV is out of juice from it's old batteries.

As you are so concerned with helping the naive what can you detail the risks and practicalities of these battery issues? 

E.g. What is the enormous bill being risked for a 6 year old leaf with 90% of its original battery capacity? 

Alternatively make vague claims 

Up to you. 

[Deleted User]

grumiofoundation said:

E.g. What is the enormous bill being risked for a 6 year old leaf with 90% of its original battery capacity? 

Alternatively make vague claims 

Nothing vague about this long term data, 90% after 6 years is wishful thinking. Mileage is more important than age though.

2nd gen was from 2017 so I can't get 6 year data to compare.

BTW: I'm not against EV cars whatsoever, I just find it irritating that the fanboys exaggerate the benefits and performance and that will not help the progression unless the market demands more and better from EV.

Ibrahim5

It's like a game of 'pass the parcel'. Who's got the car when the battery is dead. With normal depreciation you might not  spend much so the risk might be worth it. In the current environment you risk spending £10K and then either lose your £10K or spend a lot on a new battery. A lot of people say you shouldn't spend more on a repair than a car is worth. Like the guy who has spent £20K on an old motorhome to find the engine is rubbish and the chassis corroded. Do you throw more money at it or accept the loss?

grumiofoundation

Deleted_User said:

grumiofoundation said:

E.g. What is the enormous bill being risked for a 6 year old leaf with 90% of its original battery capacity? 

Alternatively make vague claims 

Nothing vague about this long term data, 90% after 6 years is wishful thinking. Mileage is more important than age though.

2nd gen was from 2017 so I can't get 6 year data to compare.

I agree mileage is more important than age (one of the reasons for asking the poster to clarify their claims).

The data you have provided gives lines of best fit at 80 and 70% after 6 years.

Also clearly shows data points above 90% - so 90% at 6 years is not complete “wishful thinking”

We have a 9 year old leaf which according to the car has ~85% of 

the original capacity (11/12 bars).  edit: this should be >85% still 12/12 (not sure why I thought was 11/12 - maybe "I'm just being naive and believing Ibrahaim5's vague claims...!)

grumiofoundation

Ibrahim5 said:

It's like a game of 'pass the parcel'. Who's got the car when the battery is dead. With normal depreciation you might not  spend much so the risk might be worth it. In the current environment you risk spending £10K and then either lose your £10K or spend a lot on a new battery. A lot of people say you shouldn't spend more on a repair than a car is worth. Like the guy who has spent £20K on an old motorhome to find the engine is rubbish and the chassis corroded. Do you throw more money at it or accept the loss?

I see you took my second option.

ontheroad1970

grumiofoundation said:

Ibrahim5 said:

It's like a game of 'pass the parcel'. Who's got the car when the battery is dead. With normal depreciation you might not  spend much so the risk might be worth it. In the current environment you risk spending £10K and then either lose your £10K or spend a lot on a new battery. A lot of people say you shouldn't spend more on a repair than a car is worth. Like the guy who has spent £20K on an old motorhome to find the engine is rubbish and the chassis corroded. Do you throw more money at it or accept the loss?

I see you took my second option.

For him, you only need to quote a famous Tom Jones song...

Herzlos

Ibrahim5 said:

It's like a game of 'pass the parcel'. Who's got the car when the battery is dead. With normal depreciation you might not  spend much so the risk might be worth it. In the current environment you risk spending £10K and then either lose your £10K or spend a lot on a new battery. A lot of people say you shouldn't spend more on a repair than a car is worth. Like the guy who has spent £20K on an old motorhome to find the engine is rubbish and the chassis corroded. Do you throw more money at it or accept the loss?

You know that you can test the range and battery health before buying an EV, right? And that the degradation is gradual? You won't just buy a car and find the battery completely dead.

In the unlikely event the battery degrades to a point you can't use it, then you can get a new battery fitted. It'll cost less than a new engine if you buy one that's got a bad belt. All cars require maintenance, but EV's have less to maintain.

Of course you'd know all this already if you had any idea of what you were talking about, but for some reason you just want to keep derailing threads with this anti-EV garbage.

Ibrahim5

Never had any engine problems. Never suffered any engine degradation. No reason why a 1.25 Fiesta should have any engine issues. EVERY ev has a gradually deteriorating battery. ALWAYS going to cost a fortune to fix.