Pay and Display Overstay £100

CastorTroy

Hi,

I have received a private parking charge notification through the post for an overstay of 15mins. 

I purchased a ticket but struggled to return to the car and purchase an extension. 

As I arrived back I shouted to the attendant who I could see was approaching my car. He ignored me. 

He was still at the car taking photos when I appealed to him that I would either go or purchase an additional ticket. He refused and said it was too late and I had to appeal. I left. 

The ticket was £2.50 for two hours, I was late by 15mins.  The carpark has been mentioned here a few times and is by all accounts a one man band. IPC members.

Is this scenario defendable? From the examples I only see 'mitigating circumstances'  as defence (injured child). I don't really remember what signage they had other than pay and display, but ultimately I did by a ticket. I'm just annoyed at the excessive  cost for a minor over stay. 

The forum suggests I should either respond direct and ask not to go through IAS and request directly to court for the £100 or respond as keeper asking them prove I was driver.

Which is the best approach?


Keeper defence (landowner is carpark): 

Re PCN number: xxxxx

I dispute your 'parking charge', as the keeper of the vehicle. I deny any liability or contractual agreement.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. Since your PCN is a vague template, I require an explanation of the allegation and your evidence. You must include a close up actual photograph of the sign you contend was at the location on the material date.

If the allegation concerns a PDT machine, the data supplied in response to this appeal must include the record of payments made - showing partial VRNs .

If the allegation involves an alleged overstay of minutes, your evidence must include any actual grace period.

KeithP

What car park?

What parking company?

CastorTroy

What car park? Bakewell Bridge

What parking company? NForce Parking Management

One post here about fine for hitting height barrier with bike. Seems to be a private carpark, not attached to a third party.

patient_dream

YES, a one man band .. Bryce Holland.   The parking goon who you spoke to could have resolved it on the spot but chose not to.  This is not car park management, it's farming a car park for money

What caused the delay getting back to the car ?

And you still have the ticket you paid for ?

Nforce Parking Management have this amateur web site ....
https://www.nforceparking.co.uk/

They state two things as they use agents

Accredited Signage

Receive your FREE BPA approved signs

Commission

You will receive £15 commission for every paid PCN

As they highlight the BPA, there is no mention of the IPC on their site.

The question is, does the BPA know that their name is being used to run a commission scheme 

On 14 November 2020 at 5:28PM  

Umkomaas said .....

"There are BPA logos and roundels all over the NtKs. Latest information (IPC AOS list) is that they are now IPC operators. For the sake of an email enquiry it might be interesting to contact the BPA and ask the date on which nForce left the BPA"

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6214928/defence-advice/p2

The joke of that thread is that BWLegal took on the sad case and then realised their claim was rubbish and discontinued ???

What do they show on the signs and ticket ... is it the BPA or IPC

CastorTroy

The PCN only has IPC and IAS logos no mention of BPA. 

I had two toddlers with me and one fell and hurt himself on the way back. Was cold/upset and I had to carry him while pushing the other. I'd had COVID a few weeks before and was exhausting. Had to put him down eventually and walk back. Just took longer than planned. Explained to the attendant as he walked round the car but wasn't interested. Just kept saying appeal. 

Not sure I still have the paper ticket, cleaned out the car. They have sent photo of car and ticket in windscreen on the PCN. 

 

Redx

Even though the one man band said appeal ( to fob you off ) , was a second ticket subsequently purchased ?

If not , they have a valid point , whereas if a 2nd ticket was purchased , you would have a valid defence with an extremely valid point , due to 2 payments covering the total time on site ? Ie ,  non payment or underpayment is bilking , despite the awful circumstances !

I find it difficult to see a way out of this one

CastorTroy

No, as he said it was too late and the kids were upset I just got them in the car and left. 

As you say I'm not convinced that although annoying that there is any factual based defence. 

Coupon-mad

I think you should not pay it and not try IAS as there isn't anything they will consider. 

Wait and see if they try court.

Not known for it and presumably you told them in the appeal already, about your injury and recovering from Covid?  So they have the mitigating circumstances but ignored them.

Return the compliment.  Ignore them unless they try a claim them come back and defend.  Obviously, if you move house within 6 years you must tell them as you must see all their letters, to be sure nothing is happening.

CastorTroy

I've not responded at all as of yet. 

I'll appeal direct and state mitigating circumstances. I don't expect a response.

D_P_Dance

If tyis is a vey small company it it likely tha thaey will pay out to take you to court when they must be aware that their chance of winning are not good?  Have they been to court before?  Have you copmplained to your MP?

CastorTroy

Difficult to say I guess. I would say unlikely. Depends if they try and pass on to debt collector and drive up the bill before going to court. 

As far as I see it I can either: 

1) Appeal direct via their site. Argue mitigating circumstances and hope they cancel the charge. 

2) Same as above but request that if they don't cancel the charge that I'd like to proceed directly to court and argue mitigating circumstances in front of a judge. Best case they chose not to go to court or the judge sides with me and charge cancelled, worst case judge feels there is no evidence to support mitigating circumstances (I can't call a toddler as a witness) and instructs me to pay the £100 + court costs of £300+.