I missed a detail through the Newbie thread to do list what impact will its have?

Daveh87

so what should I do now

Coupon-mad

Your decision, it's your money. We've advised you.  The NEWBIES thread already tells you what to do as well.

Why on earth would you just pay? I don't know why you think there is a dilemma.

Redx

Daveh87 said:

so what should I do now

Give us something concrete to work with , it may seem a joke and legalised robbery but it's real and it's a fact ! Nothing will change in this cowboy industry until summer 2022 , when government regulations kick in !

I did ask you to give us the legal reasons for your defence , seeing as you need to make one , because I haven't seen anything useful yet , just one moaning and groaning ( the poor me observations ). Grounds for a defence are the code of practice , laws , previous established court judgments , etc , such as

No landowner authority
No contract
Poor and inadequate signage
Poorly lit signage
Forbidding signage
POFA 2012
CRA 2015
The relevant CoP in force at the time
Promissory estoppel

Etc

Once you give us something useful to work with , we can assist you , but we do not give legal advice , just opinions ! Employ a qualified lawyer if you require actual legal advice. That is one of their professional and regulated jobs.

You have 3 weeks to produce a legal defence to non payment of the actual parking fee and subsequent non payment of the invoice ( the NTK PCN )

What is the total being claim ? Around £260 ?

Daveh87

Redx said:

Daveh87 said:

so what should I do now

Give us something concrete to work with , it may seem a joke and legalised robbery but it's real and it's a fact ! Nothing will change in this cowboy industry until summer 2022 , when government regulations kick in !

I did ask you to give us the legal reasons for your defence , seeing as you need to make one , because I haven't seen anything useful yet , just one moaning and groaning ( the poor me observations ). Grounds for a defence are the code of practice , laws , previous established court judgments , etc , such as

No landowner authority
No contract
Poor and inadequate signage
Poorly lit signage
Forbidding signage
POFA 2012
CRA 2015
The relevant CoP in force at the time
Promissory estoppel

Etc

Once you give us something useful to work with , we can assist you , but we do not give legal advice , just opinions ! Employ a qualified lawyer if you require actual legal advice. That is one of their professional and regulated jobs.

You have 3 weeks to produce a legal defence to non payment of the actual parking fee and subsequent non payment of the invoice ( the NTK PCN )

What is the total being claim ? Around £260 ?

thanks your right.. and I appreciate your not legally representing

Daveh87

Can you tell me what CoP acronym/Abreviation is please

Redx

Daveh87 said:

Can you tell me what CoP acronym/Abreviation is please

Code of Practice = CoP , should be in the acronyms in post 5 of the newbies FAQ sticky thread near the top of the forum in announcements , where they all are explained

There are currently 2 , BPA and IPC , depending which one the PPC has joined and is following , they are currently on version 8 , so it's the relevant CoP that applied on the day of the incident , so could be a previous version , depending on how long ago the incident was ? ( And which PPC issued the claim ) only one CoP applies. The new government single CoP will apply from next summer  when mandatory regulations kick in

PPS are IPC on those signage pictures

You never told us the total on the claim form ?

Daveh87

So, I've been looking the POFA and I'm aware that I might not be able to use some of the act as I’m past the 28 days but I’ve pulled up these for some advice.

 

And I assume that me being at a different address and not being forwarded the Ntk isn’t viable.  I was meant to be at the registered address but a personal situation forced the change (not a moan or feel sorry for me just the facts) but the reason that my V5 wasn’t my current address and why I missed the appeal period.

 

So my reason for appealing is that I believe £160 isn’t a fair and ethical amount to pay for even the cost of a maximum stay period i.e. and that no-one should be hit with these PCNs

 

I appreciate that I don’t have a valid personal reason but I’m happy to proceed if I can use any of the arguments against them.

 

POFA2012

5(1)The first condition is that the creditor—

(a)has the right to enforce against the driver of the vehicle the requirement to pay the unpaid parking charges; but

(b)is unable to take steps to enforce that requirement against the driver because the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver.

(2)Sub-paragraph (1)(b) ceases to apply if (at any time after the end of the period of 28 days beginning with the day on which the notice to keeper is given) the creditor begins proceedings to recover the unpaid parking charges from the keeper.

(paragraph 4(6)), nor will they have the right to pursue the keeper, as opposed to the driver, of the vehicle where they have sufficient details of the driver’s identity. 

Does the above stand for me? 

2. Poor signage
3. Poor Lit Signage

 

Then

 

I have the land owners names and Obvs PPS don’t own it so does that come under No Land Owner Authority – and if I need to find this out I assume I need to get hold of the land onwers details to find out?

Daveh87

Also on there contract they state that will charge the money owing plus a £60 (Still way to much to Pay) is that an argument against the added £100 and the whole claim is just shy of £260 off the top of my head (dont have the paperwork on me )

Redx

They only have to show service to the address obtained from the DVLA database , which they did when they posted it , not receipt by the victim

The original PCN was for no more than £100 , discounted by 40% for early payment , so not £160 , it was never £160 and still isn't , but it may well be £100 , the maximum allowed !

Yes , try and obtain landowner details , Umkomaas posts his guide and advice every week on here regarding the search options to obtain landowner details

The Barry Beavis case 6 years ago killed off the excessive loss arguments , he lost in 3 courts , the last being the Supreme court in London , so that argument won't wash ! Neither will fair or ethical either ! Nothing will change until government regulation next summer , too late for you

I did think that the claim was about £260 , so they added on spurious charges and interest , the defence template already argues against these. A typical loss in court is about £200

If you were both keeper and driver , POFA won't help you , because what would you honestly say in court , under oath , if they ask you if you were the driver ? Perjury being a criminal offence !

Umkomaas

Yes , try and obtain landowner details , Umkomaas posts his guide and advice every week on here regarding the search options to obtain landowner details

SOME IDEAS ON DETERMINING WHO OWNS THE LAND 

1. Google searches

2. If a retail park, check on any signage which lists the on-site outlets

3. Ask retailers on the site if there is a managing agent

4. Ask retailers on the site to whom do they pay rent

5. Contact the local authority and ask who pays the non-domestic/business rate for the car park (some councils have a spreadsheet on their website)

6. Contact the local Valuation Office and ask if they know. They often have a website which might provide the information 

7. Contact The Land Registry and for around £3 they should be able to provide definitive detail

8. If you haven't already done so, give us the name of the car park, we may have seen other cases there.