Windows 11 - Thoughts?

Jenni_D

Windows 11 has been mentioned in another thread but the posters there (wisely) didn't want to discuss the pros and cons as it would detract from the OP's query. Thus I have created this thread.

I moved to W11 a couple of nights ago (via forced download rather than waiting for Win Update to offer it). I did an in-situ install rather than a wipe and clean install. My thoughts?

• The first obvious difference is the centre-aligned taskbar which is only really as wide as it needs to be, rather than it being left-aligned / full width. This took a bit to get used to (especially as my work laptop is still W10)
• The options when you click on the Start button (or press the Win key) are different - I'm reserving judgement for now as to how I feel about it
• In file explorer the context (right click) menu has changed a lot ... it's much compressed and you need to select More Options to see the full list. (e.g. I'll often want to open a file in, say, Notepad++ but I need to select More Options first before I see it)
• I've not encrypted my drive yet, but I may do. (I'd previously already changed my MS account to be passwordless and I login via PIN ... my laptop webcam isn't an IR type so it doesn't support Hello Face)

That's it for now - what are your thoughts and opinions?

grumpycrab

An OS should be (not?) seen and not heard... so you can do your stuff efficiently - seems ok from that point of view.  The tiles/metro disaster of Window8 have finally been buried.  A couple of install/config notes...
- you can easily left-justify the icons if the "appleisation" annoys you
- unhiding the notification/corner icons is more difficult than it was before (I like to see all the notification icons)
- upgrading Windows10 using a Windows11 ISO is painless, as is disabling CPU checking prior to doing the upgrade.
I've done a number of upgrades to 4/5 year old Intels without any performace issues.... so far...
- the 11 upgrade process doesn't prevent you from declining an internet connection but its still easy to decline use of a Microsoft account by entering 1@1.com and "1" as password.

Chickereeeee

"Disable CPU checking"

The main obstacle to upgrading old cpu pcs to 11 is hardware support of security features, particularly TPM. Are you saying you are loading 11 on CPUs without these features?

grumpycrab

Chickereeeee said:

"Disable CPU checking"

The main obstacle to upgrading old cpu pcs to 11 is hardware support of security features, particularly TPM. Are you saying you are loading 11 on CPUs without these features?

I've upgraded a couple of laptops with supported TPM but unsupported CPUs.

CoastingHatbox

I haven't tried Windows 11 yet.

Partially because the only modern machine I've have which will run Windows 11 without registry hacks, runs Debian and that is my preferred operating system and my workflows are optimised for it.

But I just so happen to be acquiring another machine in the next few weeks which will meet the criteria of Windows 11, and as I intend using that in the main for amateur radio related activities, I'll probably happily run Windows 11 on it despite my misgivings.

The main advantages of running Windows 11 seem to centre on security. In terms of functional changes, it really is only the UI that has has been updated. I don't yet see any advantages for end users in terms of the functionality the OS delivers.

Windows 11 seems to build on what Windows 10 started, in terms of becoming more of a Microsoft controlled walled garden and creating a captive audience for Microsoft's content marketing. I have to do things to "decrappify" Windows 10 (essentially remove unwanted apps and advertising) and even more things to prevent Windows 10 from transmitting data I don't want to share with Microsoft to Redmond.

Windows 11 builds on this, buy providing more undefeatable ways for content providers (and Microsoft themselves) to enforce DRM. This is the mentality that you can never really buy perpetual licenses for things (software, music, movies and other media) but you will instead subscribe to them.

I think turning an operating system into a medium for delivering content and advertising represents a natural conflict of interest. I would much rather pay for an operating system that is simply operating system. That is to say it provides a desktop UI, resource scheduling and a set of APIs for the software I run on my computer.

I will run Windows 11 on some machines because it is in my interest, as a maintainer of systems that run the Windows operating system, to be apprised of developments in the latest version of Windows.

Microsoft has been identified as one of the companies giving money to lobbying groups opposing legislation to address climate change. I personally don't like the thought that I'm contributing to Microsoft's coffers as they earn revenue for delivering content via their operating system.

I'm also distressed by the thought of all the e-waste/landfill that Windows 11 will generate. Yes, it is possible to make Windows 11 install on unsupported hardware, but people who will take those steps are, in my opinion, the minority.

Microsoft also continue to make some questionable decisions in terms of their relationship with the open source community.

I would urge anyone who shares any of my concerns, to perhaps at least think about trying a free and open source operating system and at least make a more informed choice. And of course, I will always continue to support people with technology problems, both professionally and personally, irrespective of what operating system they choose.

Grey_Critic

Got this from somebody I know when discussing if I should change - only one of my laptops is curently compatible with W11 -

Windows 11 will now require a Microsoft account to be connected to every user account, granting them the ability to correlate user behavior with one's personal identity. Even those who think they have nothing to hide should be wary of sharing potentially all of their computing activity with any company, much less one with a track record of abuse like Microsoft.

You may have heard that thousands of machines currently running Windows will not be allowed to upgrade to Windows 11 due to a hardware incompatibility. At first glance this seems like plain old forced obsolescence, but the reality is much more sinister. Windows 11 now requires the use of a small dedicated chip attached to a computer motherboard called a TPM, something which their advertising copy and the mainstream press call a "Trusted Platform Module." This is slightly misleading, as when it's deployed by a proprietary software company, its relationship to the user isn't one based on trust, but based on treachery. When fully controlled by the user, TPM can be a useful way to strengthen encryption and user privacy, but when it's in the hands of Microsoft, we're not optimistic.

I would not be surprised if the EU and other governments don't eventually take out anti-trust actions against Microsoft over W11, lets face it thousands of people got new computers in the last 5 yrs to run W10 and now a large number will be useless for W11... still looking on the bright side there should be an increase in the number of newer second hand machines bringing the prices down for us linux users

grumpycrab

Grey_Critic said:

...

Windows 11 will now require a Microsoft account to be connected to every user account, granting them the ability to correlate user behavior with one's personal identity. 

Err no.  I've upgraded a number of computers and windows11 installed with a local only account with no trouble. Unless we're talking about different things?  Just on my way out but I'll read your post later...

CoastingHatbox

grumpycrab said:

Grey_Critic said:

...

Windows 11 will now require a Microsoft account to be connected to every user account, granting them the ability to correlate user behavior with one's personal identity. 

Err no.  I've upgraded a number of computers and windows11 installed with a local only account with no trouble. Unless we're talking about different things?  Just on my way out but I'll read your post later...

This is true for the home version unless you "hack" your way around it.
Not true for the pro version.

jamesd

grumpycrab said:

Grey_Critic said:

...

Windows 11 will now require a Microsoft account to be connected to every user account, granting them the ability to correlate user behavior with one's personal identity. 

Err no.  I've upgraded a number of computers and windows11 installed with a local only account with no trouble. Unless we're talking about different things?  Just on my way out but I'll read your post later...

Per xda-developers:

"According to Microsoft, you need both an internet connection and a Microsoft account to set up Windows 11 Home. In Windows 10, Microsoft already started requiring a Microsoft account for the Home edition, but you could work around it by not connecting to the internet. Here, it’s a similar situation, and you can trick Windows 11 into letting you use a local account.

When setting up your PC for the first time, you’ll have to connect to the internet, which then allows you to sign with your Microsoft account. If you don’t have an internet connection, you won’t be able to progress.

However, you can connect to the internet and let the computer check for updates. When you get to the license agreement, press the airplane mode button on your laptop or disconnect the Ethernet cable – whatever turns off the internet completely for you. If you do this, you’ll be able to set up a local account instead of a Microsoft one."

The key distinction there is that it's needed during original setup. Doing an upgrade you wouldn't have done an original setup.

Having a linked Microsoft account enables assorted extra login recovery options and I think it;s usually desirable to use a linked account. I do.

Microsoft is unlikely to know your actual identity unless you use a card to make purchases through their store.

Neil_Jones

For 11 you only need a Microsoft account if you set it up from fresh/new.  If you upgrade to it from 10, you can keep your local account.

I have yet to try setting 11 up clean to find a bypass, though I suspect it will be slightly more difficult than 10 was, ie disconnect from the internet

Jenni_D

Regarding the taskbar ... I've found the setting to put it back to left-aligned. Seems more instinctive that way.

Regarding tin-foil-hats ... I'm on Home but I'd set it up on W10 with an MS account anyway. (My technophobe partner is set up with a local account).