How do ordinary people make the switch to electric vehicles ?

BOWFER

[Deleted User] said:

BOWFER said:

born_again said:

BOWFER said:

born_again said:

NBLondon said:

BOWFER said:

Re-thinking usage is something I was chatting to a London cabbie about last week.
for some weird reason, their electric (PHEV) black cabs are only 28KWh batteries (!!!), which I found incredibly weird when they clearly have the space to fit much larger batteries.

That is odd - those charging breaks are non-earning time.  I would have expected them to want a battery that could run for a typical shift then charge overnight - or maybe a small top-up during a meal break.

But how long on a average shift do they spend parked up? 
So while they are waiting for a fare, they charge up..

As one EV U-Tuber is fond of saying ABC Always Be Charging. Even if it's only a quick 5 min comfort break. He is well know for doing long trips in EV's

He said he spends about 3 x per day charging, maybe 20-30 minutes each time.
He's a total convert, even from the point of view that the car isn't a noisy, vibrating mess any more.
Just baffling as to who made the decision to only give 28KWH batteries, when the floorpan could easily accommodate a lot more.

Cost?

Bigger batteries = dearer car. 

Maybe they did some research into the cabbies daily usage and went for a battery pack that is big enough to cover a days usage with normal breaks used for charging.
Also balancing weight V battery usage. Bigger battery = more weight = higher consumption.

Why make them hybrids at all, was my question.
Seems to me the designers maybe panicked about range anxiety with taxi drivers and decided hybrid was the way to pacify that.
Then, in the process, they hamstrung themselves with no room for a decent battery pack.
OK, he was only one driver, but I guess they're much of a muchness. and he said a 62KWH pack would more than cater for his daily needs with no need to charge.
He's hopeful the next gen will have bigger packs.
I'm sure he said he was something like £240 a week for the lease.

Hybrids are a terrible idea in general, if you can be pure battery electric there is so much less to go wrong and to maintain with the car.

Reason for the relatively small battery is cost. It's just not worth paying for a larger one when you need to take breaks anyway. You end up paying for something you barely use, and getting worse efficiency due to the extra weight the rest of the time.

It's the same for private car owners. A 500 mile battery sounds nice but in reality you will pay thousands more for it and pay to lug it around all the time, and end up saving minutes a year on those very rare 12 hour non-stop road trips.

I think people massively over-estimate distance. When I spoke to people about my EV they ask if I can get to the next city over, 23 miles away. They seem to think it's closer to 70 miles away. Without looking it up, how far do you think London to Manchester, or London to Edinburgh is?

Not sure what you mean about the breaks.
He's having to take breaks now because of the 28KWH battery, he didn't before when it was diesel.
And, presumably, he might go back to no breaks if he got a bigger battery.
Whether this is good thing or not is another story (I doubt the welfare of the drivers was a consideration in the odd decision to go for 28KW).

Advocado

BOWFER said:

born_again said:

With any luck Chinese EV's will be hitting the UK soon & some of them are massive & well priced. Nio ES8

As I mentioned in another post, they're going to hit all kinds of jingoistic nonsense here.
Would the MG5 and MGZS electric cars have sold so many if they were known as the SAIC5 and SAIC-EZS?
Not a chance.

I think it's actually really sad that people are buying MGs thinking they have something to do with the old MG they used to know.

People really are so easy to dupe.

Advocado

Herzlos said:

Sea_Shell said:

I think the bigger issue, nationally, is going to be for those for whom owning/running a car is borderline affordable ATM.

Those driving £500 15-20 year old "ordinary" cars (Focus/Astra), being their only means of getting to work, to maybe do a minimum wage job.

Will we still be relying on private vehicles by 2040?

Yes.

Taxis, trains and buses have been around for over a hundred years, but the personal car still rules.

Just because cars will have batteries instead of a fuel tank won't suddenly make everyone use public transport.

jimbo6977

Advocado said:

BOWFER said:

born_again said:

With any luck Chinese EV's will be hitting the UK soon & some of them are massive & well priced. Nio ES8

As I mentioned in another post, they're going to hit all kinds of jingoistic nonsense here.
Would the MG5 and MGZS electric cars have sold so many if they were known as the SAIC5 and SAIC-EZS?
Not a chance.

I think it's actually really sad that people are buying MGs thinking they have something to do with the old MG they used to know.

People really are so easy to dupe.

I'm not convinced too many are. I think they are buying them because they are the cheapest sensible EVs available. 

How many people buying a Citroen have any concept that they are buying a Dutch-Italian-American car?

Grumpy_chap

Advocado said:

BOWFER said:

As I mentioned in another post, they're going to hit all kinds of jingoistic nonsense here.
Would the MG5 and MGZS electric cars have sold so many if they were known as the SAIC5 and SAIC-EZS?
Not a chance.

I think it's actually really sad that people are buying MGs thinking they have something to do with the old MG they used to know.

People really are so easy to dupe.

There is also a massive amount of "double standards" in how people view brands.

The Chinese-owned SAIC / MG EV new entry vehicle is, apparently un-desirable.

The Chinese-owned Geely / Polestar new entry vehicle is, apparently a highly desirable premium car.

The complete stranger no history doesn't want to run a car company and makes cars with poor build quality Elon / Tesla is, apparently, highly desireable.

Makes you wonder whether SAIC aren't kicking themselves for not investing a bit more in advertising and chucking the MGs out at £50k instead.

movilogo

Electric cars are too expensive. Charging takes too long. 
Ordinary people can continue with cheaper, better petrol/diesel cars as long as these are avaialble.

BOWFER

Grumpy_chap said:

Advocado said:

BOWFER said:

As I mentioned in another post, they're going to hit all kinds of jingoistic nonsense here.
Would the MG5 and MGZS electric cars have sold so many if they were known as the SAIC5 and SAIC-EZS?
Not a chance.

I think it's actually really sad that people are buying MGs thinking they have something to do with the old MG they used to know.

People really are so easy to dupe.

There is also a massive amount of "double standards" in how people view brands.

The Chinese-owned SAIC / MG EV new entry vehicle is, apparently un-desirable.

The Chinese-owned Geely / Polestar new entry vehicle is, apparently a highly desirable premium car.

The complete stranger no history doesn't want to run a car company and makes cars with poor build quality Elon / Tesla is, apparently, highly desireable.

Makes you wonder whether SAIC aren't kicking themselves for not investing a bit more in advertising and chucking the MGs out at £50k instead.

The SAIC/MG is undesirable, to me, because they're so old-fashioned in their styling.
The MG5 looks like a 15 year old Passat estate, the MGZS looks like a 10YO Hyundai IX35.
if they ever come out with some up-to-date or futuristic designs, I won't give a damn that it says MG.
The Polestar is desirable because it's smart as hell, inside and out (and available with an Ohlins suspension pack, which anyone with any suspension knowledge knows is pure p o r n).
Tesla are desirable because they're just so damned fast (slowest one is 5.8 seconds to 60)

BOWFER

movilogo said:

Electric cars are too expensive. Charging takes too long. 
Ordinary people can continue with cheaper, better petrol/diesel cars as long as these are avaialble.

What an utterly rubbish post to me in with at this point.
Booooo

Herzlos

jimbo6977 said:

Advocado said:

BOWFER said:

born_again said:

With any luck Chinese EV's will be hitting the UK soon & some of them are massive & well priced. Nio ES8

As I mentioned in another post, they're going to hit all kinds of jingoistic nonsense here.
Would the MG5 and MGZS electric cars have sold so many if they were known as the SAIC5 and SAIC-EZS?
Not a chance.

I think it's actually really sad that people are buying MGs thinking they have something to do with the old MG they used to know.

People really are so easy to dupe.

I'm not convinced too many are. I think they are buying them because they are the cheapest sensible EVs available. 

How many people buying a Citroen have any concept that they are buying a Dutch-Italian-American car?

Exactly. MGR went bust in 2005 (16 years ago), and the MG 6 was barely a blip on the radar before being canned in 2016 (5 years ago). I suspect most people beyond some older petrolheads have pretty much forgotten MGR ever existed, and I say that as a big MG enthusiast... 10 years ago. I wouldn't buy one based on brand loyalty alone, and I don't know anyone who would.

People are more likely buying based on cost, since the MG 5 EV is incredible value for an all electric estate, and the MG ZS / MG 3 were pretty cheap compared to their peers too.

BOWFER

jimbo6977 said:

I'm not convinced too many are. I think they are buying them because they are the cheapest sensible EVs available. 

How many people buying a Citroen have any concept that they are buying a Dutch-Italian-American car?

I've zero doubt the MG badge helps, adding an air of familiarity.
You'll never convince me the cars would sell the same if they were badged SAIC, even with the cheap cost and long warranty.
I'd venture SAIC have thought the same, or they wouldn't have bothered.