Potential Breach of Contract

JJ_Egan

Thats true but they will say salesman never said that  , you must be mistaken .

Jon_01

Shevchenko01 said:

You spoke to a salesperson, they told you that the S21 can be used as a hotspot which is 100% true. You can't expect them to elaborate on that as they're paid to sell stuff, not to provide technical advice beyond the basics. 

Anyway moving forward, your best option is buy a third party 5G router and put the S21 sim into that.

The router I suggested earlier seems to be an unlocked 5G router? Unless I'm mistaken it takes any 5G sim card?

Otherwise this should do the trick, though its not cheap but its the best you can get - 5G dual band wifi 6 router: (you can send it back to Amazon for a full refund if it doesn't perform to your expectation)

Thanks again for that recommendation.  But again, it isn't mobile, although it uses a SIM card, it has to plugged in to the mains - I know which MiFi device I want, but I need my mobile supplier to pay for it (or at least most of the cost) as I should not have to.  It has to be a 5G MiFI, like...

https://amazon.co.uk/NETGEAR-MR1100-100EUS-Nighthawk-Downloading-Streaming/dp/B08HWRYVH5/ref=sr_1_9?dchild=1&keywords=5g+wifi&qid=1632824877&refinements=p_89:NETGEAR&rnid=1632651031&s=computers&sr=1-9&th=1

...so I can use it out and about or with clients.

I would guess, knowing how they think, the only way you'll get that would be to take them to the ombudsman or sue them in court.  That means getting a deadlock letter.

But you'd need to be completely sure of your evidence. You said in the op that you recorded the conversion, I think you'll find that unless you told the guy you were talking to you were doing that and he agreed to be recorded then you can't use that as I think you'll find that it breaches GDPR regs. 

But if you want to go down that road you'd be better off posting on a legal site, or better still, actually talking to to a law firm.

Shevchenko01

JJ_Egan said:

Thats true but they will say salesman never said that  , you must be mistaken .

They can say what they want - I already have a copy of the call recording!!!

Shevchenko01

I would guess, knowing how they think, the only way you'll get that would be to take them to the ombudsman or sue them in court.  That means getting a deadlock letter.

But you'd need to be completely sure of your evidence. You said in the op that you recorded the conversion, I think you'll find that unless you told the guy you were talking to you were doing that and he agreed to be recorded then you can't use that as I think you'll find that it breaches GDPR regs. 

But if you want to go down that road you'd be better off posting on a legal site, or better still, actually talking to to a law firm.

Already have a copy of the call, and it was provided by the Mobile Phone company under Data Protection Subject Access rules and the recording clearly "shows" me telling him my plans (using Hot Spot to replace Home & Office Broadband, needing large data, etc) and asking if I can do it and i there is any reason not to do it and him saying "Yes" and "No" respectively.

But (on a separate subject), regards recording a call yourself, if the other party states (as they very often do), "This call may be recorded", I see that as permission to do just that ... record the call ... as they never say "This call may be recorded by us".  It may not be meant as that, but a badly placed word or ambiguity plays havoc with the law!

I have read other posts on this forum along similar lines (not always re mobile phones) and simply wanted opinions from others, perhaps some that have had similar issues.

ItsComingRome

Shevchenko01 said:

ItsComingRome said:

You're confusing mobile speeds with WiFi speeds.

5Ghz WiFi will offer speeds of up to 1300Mbps but that frequency results in reduced signal penetration so is not exactly ideal.  Regardless 2.4GHz Wifi offers speeds of up to 600Mbps, 3 times the speed that the 5G can potentially provide, but realistically won't, offer.

4G will offer anything up to 40MBit/s and even at an "average" of 10Mbit/s is still fine for average office use.

You're always going to be limited to the speed of the weakest links, and 5G generally performs horribly inside a building.

If you're trying to get out of the contract you won't get to keep the phone.  Are you just trying it on because your phone battery is now fluxxed, or do you expect to keep the phone and cancel the contract?

I don't think so, I am referring to the fact that not using the phone and using the MiFi device offered meant two issues: 4G instead of 5G and 2.4GHz instead of 5GHz.  The worst of both worlds.  And I always have my phone next to my laptop.

Doing a number of tests shows consistently better speeds (via Fast.com) whilst connected to 5G vs 4G in my office and home and has always been far faster than my broadband speed ever was (by 3x at its worst).  When I forced my phone to use 2.4GHz whilst on 4G (mimicking the MiFi box) the speed slower than my old broadband speed.

I use a lot of data.  Last month, I used 58.6 GB of data - sending and receiving very large packets of data, video conferencing, and many other non-work related things.  Of course, that's what the unlimited data is for, but the speed ensures I am not waiting a day for a transfer of a file.

I understand that I won't keep the phone if the contract is ended.  I am hoping that the mobile provider sorts this out and offers me a solution to put me in the position I should be, and I will be a little sad to see it go (I like the S21) but if I cannot use the 5G, then why have it in the first place?  Why have the 5G data plan?  To use the phone as a hotspot was the only reason I bought it.  But that said, the  (mobile provider) need to do something or else the phone will die in side the contact period - as a result of their bad advice.

That's not how it works, you're always limited by the speed of the slowest link.  That is always going to be your mobile connection, not your WiFi, as 5G can't operate fast enough to saturate a 2.4GHz connection.

Perhaps "6G" will be able to saturate a 2.4GHz connection if you're sat directly under the mast, but we're not there yet.

Shevchenko01

That's not how it works, you're always limited by the speed of the slowest link.  That is always going to be your mobile connection, not your WiFi, as 5G can't operate fast enough to saturate a 2.4GHz connection.

Perhaps "6G" will be able to saturate a 2.4GHz connection if you're sat directly under the mast, but we're not there yet.

I can only comment on what I observed and what results I saw.  On 5GHz I consistently had better results.  But it's immaterial anyway, as I still am not being offered what I am paying for ... and that is the key issue.

JSmithy45AD

Shevchenko01 said:

I would guess, knowing how they think, the only way you'll get that would be to take them to the ombudsman or sue them in court.  That means getting a deadlock letter.

But you'd need to be completely sure of your evidence. You said in the op that you recorded the conversion, I think you'll find that unless you told the guy you were talking to you were doing that and he agreed to be recorded then you can't use that as I think you'll find that it breaches GDPR regs. 

But if you want to go down that road you'd be better off posting on a legal site, or better still, actually talking to to a law firm.

Already have a copy of the call, and it was provided by the Mobile Phone company under Data Protection Subject Access rules and the recording clearly "shows" me telling him my plans (using Hot Spot to replace Home & Office Broadband, needing large data, etc) and asking if I can do it and i there is any reason not to do it and him saying "Yes" and "No" respectively.

But (on a separate subject), regards recording a call yourself, if the other party states (as they very often do), "This call may be recorded", I see that as permission to do just that ... record the call ... as they never say "This call may be recorded by us".  It may not be meant as that, but a badly placed word or ambiguity plays havoc with the law!

I have read other posts on this forum along similar lines (not always re mobile phones) and simply wanted opinions from others, perhaps some that have had similar issues.

"But (on a separate subject), regards recording a call yourself, if the other party states (as they very often do), "This call may be recorded", I see that as permission to do just that ... record the call ... as they never say "This call may be recorded by us".  It may not be meant as that, but a badly placed word or ambiguity plays havoc with the law!"

Good luck in court using that argument, they'll laugh you all the way back out.

JSmithy45AD

There is a lesson here BTW, never ever make what is a very expensive purchase/decision and then ask the guy selling it to you for confirmation of the finer details. Always do your research online first.

Shevchenko01

Good luck in court using that argument, they'll laugh you all the way back out.

Why?  Do you need to ask for permission to do something if they have already told you that it may be done?  Besides a) it isn't illegal to do, and b) there are arguments that, if one side is allowed to record then the other side may also record.  I wasn't asked, simply told that this is what they'd do so ... no choice.  But it's irrelevant as my recording came from them under a DP SAR.

And, believe me, many things have been allowed in court because the wording used was poorly chosen or ambiguous.

Shevchenko01

There is a lesson here BTW, never ever make what is a very expensive purchase/decision and then ask the guy selling it to you for confirmation of the finer details.

And as I have already pointed out here, I did - it's all in the recording - it confirms all I have claimed.