MoneySavingExpert.com Cheapest Train Fares Article Discussion

MSE_Martin

I work in the rail industry and as far as i am aware, splitting tickets is a valid way to save money, however split tickets mean you MUST split your journey. The slpit ticketting issue would be down to the discretion of the on train staff, however, the rules are that a direct journey requires a direct ticket. just another thing to be aware of, ticket office staff cannot split your ticket for you, for immediate travel. they can only sell you the portion from their station to where you wish to split your ticket.

This is a slight misunderstanding. Providing the train stops at the relevant station (as it states in the article) you are fine. The train company can demand you get off the train and back on again but in practice is doesn't happen.

Martin

dzug

brucec75 wrote: »

I work in the rail industry and as far as i am aware, splitting tickets is a valid way to save money, however split tickets mean you MUST split your journey. The slpit ticketting issue would be down to the discretion of the on train staff, however, the rules are that a direct journey requires a direct ticket. just another thing to be aware of, ticket office staff cannot split your ticket for you, for immediate travel. they can only sell you the portion from their station to where you wish to split your ticket.

I'm afraid that just shows how badly some rail station staff are trained - whether deliberately or otherwise I don't know. Station staff are OBLIGED to sell you the tickets you ask for if their ticket machine is capable of selling them.

bunking_off

With respect to the earlier comments about cc fees on trainline, I'd also advise using Virgin Trains' site. As I understand it, this actually uses the underlying trainline booking engine, but does not charge a cc fee.

Cheddington2001

Arriva Trains Wales at www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk/home.aspx are good for rail tickets. It is powered by trainline but there are currently no credit card and postage charges.

dzug

Cheddington2001 wrote: »

Arriva Trains Wales at www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk/home.aspx are good for rail tickets. It is powered by trainline but there are currently no credit card and postage charges.

Ditto just about every other TOCs website - Chiltern, FGW, etc. You don't have to be using their services to buy tickets there.

Altarf

klint wrote: »

I don't understand something in the main article about "travelling short" - that's where you buy a ticket for a longer journey than you are actually doing. The article states: "Many people do this, it's known as traveling 'short', but sadly it's a no go as it's against the ticket's terms and conditions, and you can get kicked off a train if you do."

It depends on the type of ticket that you buy whether you can start, break, resume or end a journey at a midpoint. A standard open ticket allows you to do all of these things, but with some cheaper tickets (e.g. some Advance and Saver tickets) you cannot. So for example if you bought a standard Open Return from London to Peterborough you could get off and back on at Stevenage, but if you bought a Saver Return you could not. The only way you know whether you can do this is if the ticket conditions say that 'break of journey is allowed'

If you do 'short stop' then they can charge you the difference between what you should have paid and what you did. So if the train goes from A to C via B, but A to C is £50 and A to B is £75 (even though it is less distance) ,if you buy an A to C that does not allow a break of journey and you get off at B they can charge you the extra £25. National Rail Conditions of Carriage rule 16.

16. Starting, breaking or ending a journey at intermediate stations
You may start, or break and resume, a journey (in either direction in the case of a return ticket) at any intermediate station, as long as the ticket you hold is valid for the trains you want to use. You may also end your journey (in either direction in the case of a return ticket) before the destination shown on the ticket. However, these rights may not apply to some types of tickets for which a break of journey is prohibited, in which case the relevant Train Companies will make this clear in their notices and other publications.
If you start, break and resume, or end your journey at an intermediate station when you are not entitled to do so, you will be liable to pay an excess fare. This excess fare will be the difference between the price paid for the ticket you hold and the price of the lowest priced ticket(s) available for immediate travel that would have entitled you to start, break and resume, or end your journey at that station on the service(s) you have used.

PMurray wrote: »

A trick I haven't seen mentioned is to use Saver Return (maybe yours are a different name) tickets backwards.
...
I travel up to London every couple of weeks or so leaving early in the morning during the peak period. I return the following day and, as mentioned in the article, have a nice meal in First Class on an off-peak service.

The trick is that I always buy my ticket in London for the off-peak journey home and travel into London on the return portion on a peak morning train. If you buy a ticket to London for the morning train it would be full fare.

You are lucky to have encountered unobservant ticket collectors so far. National Rail Conditions of Carriage rule 17 prevents you using tickets in reverse like you are doing -

17. Using a return ticket
A return ticket (including a two-part return ticket) is only valid for the ouward journey shown on that ticket if the ticket is completely unused. You may not use the outward part of a return ticket after you have used the return part.

brucec75 wrote: »

I work in the rail industry and as far as i am aware, splitting tickets is a valid way to save money, however split tickets mean you MUST split your journey.

Utter nonsense. I suggest that you go and read National Rail Conditions of Carriage rule 19 -

19. Using a combination of tickets
You may use two or more tickets for one journey as long as together they cover the entire journey and one of the following applies:
(a) they are both Zonal Tickets (unless special conditions prohibit their use);
(b) the train you are in calls at the station where you change from one ticket to another; or
(c) one of the tickets is a Season Ticket (which for this purpose does not include Season Tickets or travel passes issued on behalf of a passenger transport executive or local authority) or a leisure travel pass, and the other ticket(s) is/are not.

So if it is not a season ticket, the only requirement is that you hold tickets that cover the whole journey and the train actually stops at the station where your tickets change.

MSE_Martin wrote: »

This is a slight misunderstanding. Providing the train stops at the relevant station (as it states in the article) you are fine. The train company can demand you get off the train and back on again but in practice is doesn't happen.

Martin this is not true. As you can see from National Rail Conditions of Carriage rule 19 there is no requirement to get off the train and back on again.

brucec75 wrote: »

The slpit ticketting issue would be down to the discretion of the on train staff, however, the rules are that a direct journey requires a direct ticket.

There is no discretion, National Rail Conditions of Carriage rule 19 is the last word on the subject.

brucec75 wrote: »

just another thing to be aware of, ticket office staff cannot split your ticket for you, for immediate travel. they can only sell you the portion from their station to where you wish to split your ticket.

Again nonsense, ticket office staff are required to sell you any ticket that you ask for. The ticket office staff are only obliged to tell you the cheapest direct ticket from A to B, but if you have done your research in advance and know the cheaper combination of tickets they must sell what you ask for.

Anyway, if I go into the ticket office and ask for a return from London to Peterborough and a return from Peterborough to Leeds, the ticket office staff may suspect that I am ticket splitting, but equally I may be going to a meeting in Peterborough followed by a meeting in Leeds.

And if anyone wants to read the National Rail Conditions of Carriage, they are here http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_fares/nrcc/

brucec75

dzug wrote: »

I'm afraid that just shows how badly some rail station staff are trained - whether deliberately or otherwise I don't know. Station staff are OBLIGED to sell you the tickets you ask for if their ticket machine is capable of selling them.

If tickets are for immediate travel then passengers wishing to purchase tickets for other stations or for advanced purchase may be asked to wait untill local tickets have been sold as cheap day returns and railcard discounts are not available to purchase on board. Why should other peolpe be penalised because somebody wants to buy split tickets when the train is ready to depart. My point was only to buy your tickets in advance if you wish to split them.

Altarf

brucec75 wrote: »

My point was only to buy your tickets in advance if you wish to split them.

Not until the railway companies make tickets fully refundable without question and without administration fees.

I buy my tickets on the day I want to travel just in case there is a change to my plans or problems with the trains. If I am at the front of the queue and am buying tickets for that day, then I am at the front of the queue and people who arrive after me can wait until I am served.

Victors_Bruvver

Thursday 27 December and I have just returned from dropping my wife off at Folkestone Central. The ticket (day return to London) I bought her from the ticket office was £21.90. When I checked the times & prices yesterday (& again this morning) both the National Rail & TrainLine websites are stating that a saver return for today is £16.00.
Not entirely surprised but it niggles me that if Southeastern are along with other TOC's running a Saturday timetable today why are they still charging her £21.90? Obviously the booking office staff is telling us that it is because her outward journey is before 10:00am but surely that ‘peak period’ relates to a Monday to Friday timetable? Is this not odd?

trubster

Does Anyone know what has happened to all the advance purchase fares, i tried getting them on the crappy xc web site and not one fare is showing as available, it is for the 14/1 and rtn 18/1 from sheffield to newcastle for 2 adults with a disabled rail card.

I thought the trick was booking within 3 months?

any help gratefully recieved...