Contactless limit to rise to £100.

The_Green_Hornet

Contactless was originally marketed as Tap & Go so it isn't surprising that the average consumer taps their card/device on the card reader to pay.

https://youtu.be/6la3sDlPAA4

Why it so upsets some forumites that they do this is the thing that surprises me.

gsmh

Who’s upset? I have only read observations on here. An observation does mean one is upset lol!

masonic

YBR said:

masonic said:

I have no problem with a £100 limit. However, it would be good if people had an option to set their own lower limit just as they can temporarily freeze cards from many issuers.

I don't agree with being able to spend (lose if fraudulent) £100 with absolutely no verification, it's really not a trivial amount as the initial contactless limits were. I would rather the amount were kept low as the reward for skimming cards is now enough to encourage criminals to attempt it more seriously.

The option set my own lower limit would be second best, but still acceptable, in my view.

There is indeed an argument that you will be more likely to be the victim of theft by virtue of the fact many people will be carrying around cards with the max limit and any would-be thief won't know your limit is lower.

The same argument can be made about mobile phones. I have a modestly priced mobile, but many people now carry around devices worth several hundred pounds and do not adequately secure them. I don't know if the statistics bear out that there has been an increase in muggings since people have started routinely carrying around valuable devices in their pockets. I suppose I should want those expensive devices not to be available if that were the case. However, I'm just content that cheaper devices are still available so I don't have to follow the crowd if I don't want to.

As an aside, the first experience I had of using contactless was the TSB cashback offer (https://www.tsb.co.uk/news-releases/tsb-launches-555/). I seem to recall people people having no problems back then spending £100 on gift vouchers by doing 4 x £25 contactless transactions in quick succession. I don't think there has ever been a time where it was not possible to spend large amounts of money on contactless without any verification. Originally I could do about 5-6 transactions before I was asked for a PIN verification. Nowadays it is so rare I have to think quite hard before entering my PIN - several hundred pounds of spending between verifications I'd estimate. Even back when the limit was £10, there were ways of someone doing many transactions without verification as several merchants were doing offline contactless in the early years.

Zanderman

gsmh said:

Zanderman said:

But, if you feel inclined, please explain what your line 

The time for excuses is rapidly coming to an end. 

was all about.  That line seemed very odd.

I worked in IT in an educational context for a couple of decades, where my job was to coordinate and facilitate the use of IT by colleagues in a school. It was clear to me that some colleagues claimed not to understand the tech and did not want to use it - to the detriment of their students. What they wouldn't do, however, was learn how to use it. They would rather pretend it wasn't there or that they were incapable of learning how to use it. We're talking about highly educated people too. I found it negligent, TBH, that teachers would be so happy in their comfort zones that they would try and force students into them too. I suppose that experience has coloured my views on why some people refuse to understand or use the technology around them. My experience has given me a real-world understanding of this over many years, so I can't really argue with someone that this experience is somehow invalid or debatable. 

The time for excuses is rapidly coming to an end refers to how people will have to embrace technology, kicking and screaming if need be, otherwise they will not be able to function in a 21st Century society and all they will have left is to complain about it. We see it on here when people proclaim they have no mobile phone so can't verify something their bank wishes them to verify. I'm sure some people would be happier painting on cave walls.

I see these forum posts as a starting point for conversation, which will inevitably diverge from the original post - just like conversation in the real world. I am entitled to put forward my views, you are entitled to argue against what I and others say - but we each have an equal right to state those views and choose whether we respond to someone who wishes to nit-pick about what we say. Tom cats we surely are!

But but but - what has all this got to do with the fact that touching a card onto a card reader is no evidence at all of some sort of lack of understanding? As I pointed out earlier it can be interpreted as cleverer than just hovering.  And as others have pointed out touching (tapping) was the original instruction.  How and where does a rant about not embracing technology fit in here?  I'm not saying you can't express your views on people not embracing technology, but can't see how this particular view is relevant to the specific discussion about whether to touch your card on a reader or just to hover. 

[As for the 'time for excuses having to end', well, frankly, excuses will never end.  There will always be people who are left behind.  You and I will almost certainly be left behind too, one day, in our dotage.  No-one stays on top of technology for ever.  These problems have been around for ever too, parents who need the kids to work the VCR, people scared of motor cars, luddites breaking machinery, everything changes and no-one keeps up for ever.]

Nebulous2

gsmh said:

Zanderman said:

But, if you feel inclined, please explain what your line 

The time for excuses is rapidly coming to an end. 

was all about.  That line seemed very odd.

I worked in IT in an educational context for a couple of decades, where my job was to coordinate and facilitate the use of IT by colleagues in a school. It was clear to me that some colleagues claimed not to understand the tech and did not want to use it - to the detriment of their students. What they wouldn't do, however, was learn how to use it. They would rather pretend it wasn't there or that they were incapable of learning how to use it. We're talking about highly educated people too. I found it negligent, TBH, that teachers would be so happy in their comfort zones that they would try and force students into them too. I suppose that experience has coloured my views on why some people refuse to understand or use the technology around them. My experience has given me a real-world understanding of this over many years, so I can't really argue with someone that this experience is somehow invalid or debatable. 

The time for excuses is rapidly coming to an end refers to how people will have to embrace technology, kicking and screaming if need be, otherwise they will not be able to function in a 21st Century society and all they will have left is to complain about it. We see it on here when people proclaim they have no mobile phone so can't verify something their bank wishes them to verify. I'm sure some people would be happier painting on cave walls.

I see these forum posts as a starting point for conversation, which will inevitably diverge from the original post - just like conversation in the real world. I am entitled to put forward my views, you are entitled to argue against what I and others say - but we each have an equal right to state those views and choose whether we respond to someone who wishes to nit-pick about what we say. Tom cats we surely are!

For some people it is an indicator of status. I don’t need to do that. That’s what the hired help is for. Like the managers in the past who were heartily offended when expected to do their own typing. 

I once read a story, which may not be true, about a rich Indian prince or maharajah or someone, who had the nerves to his arms cut so he couldn’t use them. Far from seeing it as a disability, as most of us would, he saw it as a status symbol. He was so rich and powerful that he didn’t need arms. 

You clearly have an opposing point of view, but some at least of these people are convinced their unfamiliarity with IT demonstrates that they are better than you. 

Dr_Crypto

I always thought you had to touch the card! A bit like Oyster (which was my first experience with contactless) - tap in/out. 

(I’ve got 3 degrees). 

General_Grant

Zanderman said:

gsmh said:

Zanderman said:

But, if you feel inclined, please explain what your line 

The time for excuses is rapidly coming to an end. 

was all about.  That line seemed very odd.

I worked in IT in an educational context for a couple of decades, where my job was to coordinate and facilitate the use of IT by colleagues in a school. It was clear to me that some colleagues claimed not to understand the tech and did not want to use it - to the detriment of their students. What they wouldn't do, however, was learn how to use it. They would rather pretend it wasn't there or that they were incapable of learning how to use it. We're talking about highly educated people too. I found it negligent, TBH, that teachers would be so happy in their comfort zones that they would try and force students into them too. I suppose that experience has coloured my views on why some people refuse to understand or use the technology around them. My experience has given me a real-world understanding of this over many years, so I can't really argue with someone that this experience is somehow invalid or debatable. 

The time for excuses is rapidly coming to an end refers to how people will have to embrace technology, kicking and screaming if need be, otherwise they will not be able to function in a 21st Century society and all they will have left is to complain about it. We see it on here when people proclaim they have no mobile phone so can't verify something their bank wishes them to verify. I'm sure some people would be happier painting on cave walls.

I see these forum posts as a starting point for conversation, which will inevitably diverge from the original post - just like conversation in the real world. I am entitled to put forward my views, you are entitled to argue against what I and others say - but we each have an equal right to state those views and choose whether we respond to someone who wishes to nit-pick about what we say. Tom cats we surely are!

But but but - what has all this got to do with the fact that touching a card onto a card reader is no evidence at all of some sort of lack of understanding? As I pointed out earlier it can be interpreted as cleverer than just hovering.  And as others have pointed out touching (tapping) was the original instruction.  How and where does a rant about not embracing technology fit in here?  I'm not saying you can't express your views on people not embracing technology, but can't see how this particular view is relevant to the specific discussion about whether to touch your card on a reader or just to hover. 

[As for the 'time for excuses having to end', well, frankly, excuses will never end.  There will always be people who are left behind.  You and I will almost certainly be left behind too, one day, in our dotage.  No-one stays on top of technology for ever.  These problems have been around for ever too, parents who need the kids to work the VCR, people scared of motor cars, luddites breaking machinery, everything changes and no-one keeps up for ever.]

This afternoon in Lidl's the card reader included "tap" in the on-screen instructions.

I also remember the problems experienced early on when the near field was so great that incorrect cards were being charged.

Gers

https://www.visa.co.uk/how-you-pay-matters/payment-technologies/contactless.html

Contactless payments are touch-free with no need to type in your PIN or hand over your card. Simply touch your card to the reader, listen for the beep, and your payment is securely processed.

Even has a picture!

masonic

General_Grant said:

Zanderman said:

gsmh said:

Zanderman said:

But, if you feel inclined, please explain what your line 

The time for excuses is rapidly coming to an end. 

was all about.  That line seemed very odd.

I worked in IT in an educational context for a couple of decades, where my job was to coordinate and facilitate the use of IT by colleagues in a school. It was clear to me that some colleagues claimed not to understand the tech and did not want to use it - to the detriment of their students. What they wouldn't do, however, was learn how to use it. They would rather pretend it wasn't there or that they were incapable of learning how to use it. We're talking about highly educated people too. I found it negligent, TBH, that teachers would be so happy in their comfort zones that they would try and force students into them too. I suppose that experience has coloured my views on why some people refuse to understand or use the technology around them. My experience has given me a real-world understanding of this over many years, so I can't really argue with someone that this experience is somehow invalid or debatable. 

The time for excuses is rapidly coming to an end refers to how people will have to embrace technology, kicking and screaming if need be, otherwise they will not be able to function in a 21st Century society and all they will have left is to complain about it. We see it on here when people proclaim they have no mobile phone so can't verify something their bank wishes them to verify. I'm sure some people would be happier painting on cave walls.

I see these forum posts as a starting point for conversation, which will inevitably diverge from the original post - just like conversation in the real world. I am entitled to put forward my views, you are entitled to argue against what I and others say - but we each have an equal right to state those views and choose whether we respond to someone who wishes to nit-pick about what we say. Tom cats we surely are!

But but but - what has all this got to do with the fact that touching a card onto a card reader is no evidence at all of some sort of lack of understanding? As I pointed out earlier it can be interpreted as cleverer than just hovering.  And as others have pointed out touching (tapping) was the original instruction.  How and where does a rant about not embracing technology fit in here?  I'm not saying you can't express your views on people not embracing technology, but can't see how this particular view is relevant to the specific discussion about whether to touch your card on a reader or just to hover. 

[As for the 'time for excuses having to end', well, frankly, excuses will never end.  There will always be people who are left behind.  You and I will almost certainly be left behind too, one day, in our dotage.  No-one stays on top of technology for ever.  These problems have been around for ever too, parents who need the kids to work the VCR, people scared of motor cars, luddites breaking machinery, everything changes and no-one keeps up for ever.]

This afternoon in Lidl's the card reader included "tap" in the on-screen instructions.

I also remember the problems experienced early on when the near field was so great that incorrect cards were being charged.

My experience has been that some readers are so weak it is necessary to bring the card right up against the reader, perhaps in response to those early reports of cards within wallets being zapped.

In any case, if the concern around touching your card against a reader is the transmission of Covid, then you are far more likely spread it or become infected with it by breathing air in a supermarket vs transmission via a payment terminal. The CDC estimates the risk of infection through direct contact with a contaminated surface as being less than 1 in 10,000: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/more/science-and-research/surface-transmission.html YMMV with other infections like norovirus.

castle96

I thought I had paid/touched/hovered and it was a hell of a shock when the security guard collared me in the car park for not paying. I now touch and get a receipt !