Economy 7 Tariff Times not transparent

dunstonh

jrh22542254 said:

Checked my economy switch off times on three dates now and each time its switched off between 0759 and 35 to 45 seconds. So conclusion is dont believe what your energy supplier says , check yourself.

Everyone with E7 should do that.

jrh22542254

Checked my meter this morning (19/8/21) and it switched at 0759 and 38 seconds. I have not stayed up to check if it switches at 1am yet!
So all this has got me thinking..... I am very happy that I can use E7 between 7.15am and 8am, as I get up at around 7.30am.
However I am constantly bombarded with emails trying to get me to go over to electronic meters, which so far I have avoided as I have seen the bad press about not been able to switch suppliers as easily. 
But now I am also worried that going over to an electronic meter would affect my E7 timings, and hence I would be significantly worse off? Would this be the case? Thank you. 

jrh22542254

coffeehound said:

dunstonh said:

Gerry1 said:

Your nominal switching times are probably 0000 - 0700 winter and 0100 - 0800 summer, but you need to look at the meter around 0100 to confirm this.

I'm not aware of any region switching at xx15 (see the map) ; perhaps the relevant person was confused about the +/- 15 minutes tolerance?

Meters can go out of sync over time.   Although I believe that is less common on circuit switching rather than timer based.

From the OP's photo, it's a teleswitch so under direct control via the Radio 4 longwave signals.  I've got a vague recollection that East Mids used some sort of dynamic variable timing to manage loads so it might be they still do (?)  Which would be problematic for anyone setting timers manually . .

Thanks coffeehound, so just suppose I switch over to an electronic meter will my E7 timings potentially change to something else that I dont like? ie potentially switch at 0715 or 0730? This would be a major reason why I would avoid switching for as long as possible! I dont recall this being a reason for not switching to an electronic meter - please tell me I have got this wrong!  

jrh22542254

slimbuck said:

jrh22542254 said:

I was under the impression that my economy 7 tariff was between the hours of 1am and 8am. I looked through all my emails and documentation to see where I had been notified in my T&Cs prior to taking on my current supplier (Sainsburys). I could not find it anywhere. In the end I rang Sainsburys and they told me over the phone 12.15am to 7.15am. As you can imagine I was not very happy given I go out of way to use a lot of electricity between 7.15am and 8am!
So this got me thinking , the times should be part of the T&Cs. The T&Cs cant just say 'you are on economy 7', and expect the customer to find out what those times are ?
I checked my previous suppliers and they too dont appear to put the times in their T&Cs.
How can we change the system to make this a requirement?
Thank you.
 

"The installation of a smart meter should assist you in awareness of what rate you are being charged at, as well as allowing in theory an almost infinite number of multi rate tariffs in the future."

Thanks slimbuck, 

So just suppose I switch over to a smart meter, will my E7 timings potentially change to something that I dont like? I have found out my current set up switches over at 0800 using a very old teleswitch, so will installation of a smart meter  potentially allow a supplier to change the switchover time to say 0715 or 0730? What is the likelihood this would happen and has it happened to anyone else?
This would be a major reason why I would avoid switching to a smart meter for as long as possible! I dont recall this being a reason for not switching to an electronic meter - please tell me I have got this wrong! 
Thank you.

Carrot007

jrh22542254 said:

slimbuck said:

jrh22542254 said:

I was under the impression that my economy 7 tariff was between the hours of 1am and 8am. I looked through all my emails and documentation to see where I had been notified in my T&Cs prior to taking on my current supplier (Sainsburys). I could not find it anywhere. In the end I rang Sainsburys and they told me over the phone 12.15am to 7.15am. As you can imagine I was not very happy given I go out of way to use a lot of electricity between 7.15am and 8am!
So this got me thinking , the times should be part of the T&Cs. The T&Cs cant just say 'you are on economy 7', and expect the customer to find out what those times are ?
I checked my previous suppliers and they too dont appear to put the times in their T&Cs.
How can we change the system to make this a requirement?
Thank you.
 

"The installation of a smart meter should assist you in awareness of what rate you are being charged at, as well as allowing in theory an almost infinite number of multi rate tariffs in the future."

Thanks slimbuck, 

So just suppose I switch over to a smart meter, will my E7 timings potentially change to something that I dont like? I have found out my current set up switches over at 0800 using a very old teleswitch, so will installation of a smart meter  potentially allow a supplier to change the switchover time to say 0715 or 0730? What is the likelihood this would happen and has it happened to anyone else?
This would be a major reason why I would avoid switching to a smart meter for as long as possible! I dont recall this being a reason for not switching to an electronic meter - please tell me I have got this wrong! 
Thank you.

Not just a smart meter but any meter change. Only timewsitched meters have been fitetd for years (the teleswitched signals were meant to beturned off in 2005, they will go at some point). 0194 is a teleswitched SSC. You would most likely be moved to 0151 (00:30 - 07:30) or 0244 (00:00-07:00) (GMT meaning +1 hour in the summer).

Of course this has all been ignored for years with suppliers hoping people with the teleswitched meters just change supplier and make it someone elses problems due to the customers issues when meters are changed! The issues being 1. the time period moving (though with smart meters there is no reason they could not just program it to anything if they created a new SSC and put it in the MDD), and the bigger problem of 2. Loosing the switching ability, meaning the customer had to pay to get their own switchign solution. Since they want the signal off and the meters changed I suspect the suppliers will all be told to provide an external contactor to do the job as the solution.

jrh22542254

Carrot007 said:

jrh22542254 said:

slimbuck said:

jrh22542254 said:

I was under the impression that my economy 7 tariff was between the hours of 1am and 8am. I looked through all my emails and documentation to see where I had been notified in my T&Cs prior to taking on my current supplier (Sainsburys). I could not find it anywhere. In the end I rang Sainsburys and they told me over the phone 12.15am to 7.15am. As you can imagine I was not very happy given I go out of way to use a lot of electricity between 7.15am and 8am!
So this got me thinking , the times should be part of the T&Cs. The T&Cs cant just say 'you are on economy 7', and expect the customer to find out what those times are ?
I checked my previous suppliers and they too dont appear to put the times in their T&Cs.
How can we change the system to make this a requirement?
Thank you.
 

"The installation of a smart meter should assist you in awareness of what rate you are being charged at, as well as allowing in theory an almost infinite number of multi rate tariffs in the future."

Thanks slimbuck, 

So just suppose I switch over to a smart meter, will my E7 timings potentially change to something that I dont like? I have found out my current set up switches over at 0800 using a very old teleswitch, so will installation of a smart meter  potentially allow a supplier to change the switchover time to say 0715 or 0730? What is the likelihood this would happen and has it happened to anyone else?
This would be a major reason why I would avoid switching to a smart meter for as long as possible! I dont recall this being a reason for not switching to an electronic meter - please tell me I have got this wrong! 
Thank you.

Not just a smart meter but any meter change. Only timewsitched meters have been fitetd for years (the teleswitched signals were meant to beturned off in 2005, they will go at some point). 0194 is a teleswitched SSC. You would most likely be moved to 0151 (00:30 - 07:30) or 0244 (00:00-07:00) (GMT meaning +1 hour in the summer).

Of course this has all been ignored for yeahs with tsupplier hoping people of the teleswitched meters change supplier and make it someone elses problems due to the customers issues when meters are changed! The issues being 1. the time period moving (though with smart meters there is no reason they could not just program it to anything if they created a new SSC and put it in the MDD), and the bigger problem of 2. Loosing the switching ability, meaning the customer had to pay to get their own switchign solution. Since they want the signal off and the meters changed I suspect the suppliers will all be told to provide an external contactor to do the job as the solution.

Thanks Carrot007. I did not know E7 old meters were so problematical. I will certainly be holding out for as long as possible before moving to a smart meter. Better to have a working E7 system where I am happy with the switching times. I think I avoided a car crash thanks to this forum. Thank you to all.

QrizB

jrh22542254 said:

Thanks Carrot007. I did not know E7 old meters were so problematical. I will certainly be holding out for as long as possible before moving to a smart meter. Better to have a working E7 system where I am happy with the switching times. I think I avoided a car crash thanks to this forum. Thank you to all.

What you will also avoid is the option of choosing smart-meter-only tariffs which could be cheaper than the one you're on now.

(You've not said what tariff you're currently on?)

jrh22542254

QrizB said:

jrh22542254 said:

Thanks Carrot007. I did not know E7 old meters were so problematical. I will certainly be holding out for as long as possible before moving to a smart meter. Better to have a working E7 system where I am happy with the switching times. I think I avoided a car crash thanks to this forum. Thank you to all.

What you will also avoid is the option of choosing smart-meter-only tariffs which could be cheaper than the one you're on now.

(You've not said what tariff you're currently on?)

Good point. I am on
Sainsbury's Energy 1 Year Fix and Reward v13. Price Guaranteed Until 19th Jan. 2022
Exit fees £30 per fuel
Thank you.

Swipe

I went from a mechanical meter to smart meter and I was much better off with the new timings as my old meter used to start E7 at 23:20 GMT, the new one doesn't kick in until 00:37 GMT now so  I gained an extra hour and twenty minutes in a morning from the change which is great as I'm normally up at 6am everyday.

nologo

I'm with Octopus with a smart meter ( not tele switch) and have downloaded the "Bright "app on my phone & it shows time of use    00:00  - 07:00 @. 11.424
 
          07:00  -00:00 @.   19.614        

this is in Kent .
hth. nologo