Car Parking charges and false information from Ipserv Ltd

Le_Kirk

If you know you were driving or you "outed" yourself in an appeal (or any other correspondence with the PPC) then you would be foolish to "lie" on a defence and say you were not.  Just imagine what you will say if the judge asks you outright "were you driving on the day?"  Bigger penalties exist for perjury.  If, however, there are several legally entitled drivers, proven by insurance for example or it is too far back in time for you to remember or prove, it is fine to say "it cannot be recalled or proven who was driving on the day"

Umkomaas

Cardriver45 said:

Le_Kirk said:

If you know you were driving or you "outed" yourself in an appeal (or any other correspondence with the PPC) then you would be foolish to "lie" on a defence and say you were not.  Just imagine what you will say if the judge asks you outright "were you driving on the day?"  Bigger penalties exist for perjury.  If, however, there are several legally entitled drivers, proven by insurance for example or it is too far back in time for you to remember or prove, it is fine to say "it cannot be recalled or proven who was driving on the day"

I see. But if the NTK doesn't correctly meet POFA criteria are you allowed to say that you don't have to legally identify who was driving if the judge asks?

PoFA isn't a legal authority to refuse to answer a legitimate question by a Judge. You may never get asked, but if you do, you could decline to answer (politely), but I wouldn't  guarantee what a Judge would make of that!

Umkomaas

Not if they've cancelled it, but this is an unregulated sector where anything goes, but it would be the first case I've heard of. 

Redx

Bear in mind that just because driver A was driving on one date it doesn't follow that driver A was the driver on any other date , even if it seems obvious , They can assume using the balance of probabilities argument , but each case is bespoke

I am the RK and a driver ( driver A ) on my vehicle , my wife is driver B , plus my son has also driven it on occasion ( driver C ) , never mind that plenty of other people like car mechanics have driven it too

Hypothetically , we go to Asda or Morrisons shopping in it next week , who is the driver ??
If I drive it there and Mrs Redx drives it back , who was the driver for the alleged overstay ? ( Who is responsible ? )
I am going out tomorrow and she is out in it on Monday , who can remember who wa driving in a year's time ? Or in 3 years time ?

Umkomaas

You're overthinking this. If they've cancelled and the BPA have confirmed it, they'd be absolutely crackers to resurrect anything. You're asking for guarantees against hypotheses - I can't give you those, in the same sense that I can't guarantee that one day the sky won't fall down.

Umkomaas

ANPR cameras are for monitoring VRM plates, nothing else. In all the time I've been on this forum (8.5 years), never, ever has any PPC attempted to utilise an ANPR camera shot that has a byproduct of a grainy photo of the driver as any form of evidence to identify who that driver was. 

Cardriver45

On the SAR request that I will be sending to Ipserv should I ask for all information on all PCNs including cancelled ones?
Or how should I word that part, please so they still send the required info they have on a cancelled PCN?

On the template on the newbies thread, it only suggests to ask for info on any outstanding PCNs. But the one BarkingDog suggested seeking a claim for under GDPR was cancelled so would they still have and send the info on that one too or just the live one?

Umkomaas

Ask for all and every data the hold on you and your vehicle (VRM - AB12CDE).  If they fail to deliver anything relating to the cancelled PCN, you go back and tie them down to that. 

Cardriver45

Just to double check before I send it, is this everything I should ask for or am I missing anything?

Please supply the data about me that I am entitled to under data protection law relating to myself.

Including the following:

- all and every piece of data held on myself and vehicle (VRM *********)

- all photos taken

- all letters/emails sent and received, including any appeal correspondence earlier

- all data held, all evidence you will rely on, and a full copy of the PCN, NTK

- a list of all PCNs outstanding against me and/or this VRN ********

Cardriver45

I'll add this one as well as it was pay and display as well as permit

PDT machine record from 25/05/2021 and from 01/06/2021, of payments made