Gas Bills

Gerry1

Oh dear, you still don't get it.  You're not being charged 100 times the correct rate.

Stop comparing £DD amounts.  Start comparing with Citizens Advice and 'Which? Switch', entering your annual kWh usage derived from actual meter readings a year apart. Just compare annual costs, always ignore all projections and savings claims: they aren't realistic because of Ofgem's daft rules.

Remember that separate suppliers are often cheaper than dual fuel, so do the sums for both. Also have a look at the customer service ratings on Citizens Advice and the 'Add your feedback on energy supplier xxxx...' threads here on the forum.

Robin9

@hypokratis   Please forget £'s and DD, variable and fixed.  What is important is your ACTUAL ANNUAL CONSUMPTION  - without that figure you and the suppliers are only guessing.

I ask again what consumption figure did you give Octopus and what ae you using for the latest "offer"?

How far back can you go with your statements and your own meter reading records ?   Keep on looking for those ACTUAL readings - meter readers are very rare these days and  if you haven't been giving meter reads - preferably monthly - then everything is guesswork. One day the supplier gets an ACTUAL read and you get a big of a catch up bill.

molerat

I do hope you didn't say to Octopus " my current supplier is charging me £88 a month" and they came back with "we will charge you £55" as that is only going to end in tears.  The one and only figure you give to a supplier is an accurate taken from your own meter readings annual kWh usage.  Anything else is going to lead to a stab in the dark monthly payment figure.

hypokratis

Robin9
I did not give Octopus an annual consumption figure. I was not asked for one or a start. What I was asked for was a current gas and electricity meter reading which I gave. Luckily to a large degree I have kept a personal record of both readings for quite a few years back. Some are too old to be of use ! For months I gave my old supplier monthly readings ( keeping a record) and even on the same date where possible. My final reading were not shown on my official bills recently sent me as A,C or E but as “ your read” My new supplier “ suggests” I send monthly readings. It is already an established procedure with me ( plus my own record) which is now going to be of use. I do not believe any past or present supplier has actually asked for my annual energy consumption. It is going  to be an estimate which I suppose would suit them but, I repeat, I was never asked 

Gerry1

hypokratis said:

I understand I hope the difference between “fixed” and “ variable”. 

I'm not sure that you do.

Two completely different things can be fixed or variable.

• A Fixed Tariff is where the cost of each kWh and the daily charge is fixed for a year or two, but nothing else is fixed.  Use more than you said you would and the DD will be increased twice, firstly to reflect your higher annual usage and secondly to start claiming back the arrears that have built up.  A Variable Tariff means that the cost per kWh and / or the daily charge can be increased, usually with 30 days' notice.  If you don't like it you can leave at any time without penalty.

• A Fixed Direct Debit means that the supplier expects to debit your account with the same amount every month, but only IF your usage forecast is borne out by the reality.  A Variable Direct Debit means that the supplier will bill you for the exact usage since the last bill.  It gets rid of all the misunderstandings about FDD and it avoids problems of getting large credit balances repaid if the supplier goes bust.  It also alerts you earlier if your consumption is higher than expected (so no delayed bill shock), but it does mean bigger bills in winter and smaller ones in summer.  Some people don't like VDD if they can't maintain sufficient 'float' in their bank account, and some suppliers don't even offer it.

hypokratis

Gerry1
The point about units and 100’s of units that I made, was because I learned through the changeover of suppliers at the start of the dispute the difference and in some confusion I think in others concerning the existence of a conversion factor 0.0283 etc
 I am having to believe that the units listed on my meter face, mean something else and that fact has never been clear. The analogy is the one saying “when we talk in £ units we really mean £100 units. 

I have the situation where my new supplier is telling they use 0.0283 in converting cu.ft. to cu. metres and too many people on this forum are saying the opposite ! 

I have contacted Citizens advice already and been passed on to my old supplier ‘s Consumer Focus team who told me there was good news in the fact that their factor 2.83 was correct! My new supplier says the exact opposite. 

If I do not “get it” Gerry, is it any surprise ?? 

Which magazine only spoke of 2.83 
Gov.Uk said 0.0283 for meters reading in cu.ft. 

Who else doesn’t get it either Gerry 
I have quite some homework to do to figure all this out to the best probable answer 
Thanks for your feedback. It all helps 
Hypokratis 

victor2

hypokratis said:

Robin
I understand I hope the difference between “fixed” and “ variable”One is more stable than the other so long as one stays within the consumption limits, which I have always managed to do until recently. I spotted a £32/ month offer for example but it was variable 

I have to take the time to analyze the info I now have and learn what I can from it including monitoring the claim that my new supplier will be working with the factor 0.0283  and having the correct details of my gas meter. 

There are no "consumption limits". On a fixed contract you will be charge a fixed rate for every kWh of gas you use. The monthly amount you pay by DD is based on an estimate of how much you will use over a year. Use more than that estimate and you'll owe the supplier money, use less and they'll owe you money.

Forget the 0.0283/2.83 issue. The supplier will be applying it correctly.

Record your own monthly readings and work out the kWh you've used - the formula for that will be on your statements. You can then see if you've paid enough. In the summer you usually end up in credit so that you cover the extra cost in the winter when you have the heating on and use more gas than your monthly DD covers.

Of course, your meter must be getting old, being imperial, so you'll one day get a new meter which will be metric, probably smart too. Another challenge!...

Gerry1

This site (scroll down one third of the page) will convert your volume usage to kWh.  Just enter your kWh rate inc VAT.  You'll have to add the daily charge if you want the figure that appears on the bill.

Don't worry about the exact Calorific Value, which is a measure of how 'weak' or 'concentrated' the gas is.   It varies all the time but it doesn't make a vast difference because it has to be between 38 and 41 for normal mains gas.

They also explain the 100 cubic feet idea very well.

[Deleted User]

hypokratis said:

Gerry1
The point about units and 100’s of units that I made, was because I learned through the changeover of suppliers at the start of the dispute the difference and in some confusion I think in others concerning the existence of a conversion factor 0.0283 etc
 I am having to believe that the units listed on my meter face, mean something else and that fact has never been clear. The analogy is the one saying “when we talk in £ units we really mean £100 units. 

I have the situation where my new supplier is telling they use 0.0283 in converting cu.ft. to cu. metres and too many people on this forum are saying the opposite ! 

I have contacted Citizens advice already and been passed on to my old supplier ‘s Consumer Focus team who told me there was good news in the fact that their factor 2.83 was correct! My new supplier says the exact opposite. 

If I do not “get it” Gerry, is it any surprise ?? 

Which magazine only spoke of 2.83 
Gov.Uk said 0.0283 for meters reading in cu.ft. 

Who else doesn’t get it either Gerry 
I have quite some homework to do to figure all this out to the best probable answer 
Thanks for your feedback. It all helps 
Hypokratis 

You could help by posting the two differing statements that you are concerned about. All gas statements show the formula that has been used to convert volume (in either cubic feet or cubic metres) to kWhs.

Robin9

hypokratis said:

Robin9
 I do not believe any past or present supplier has actually asked for my annual energy consumption. It is going  to be an estimate which I suppose would suit them but, I repeat, I was never asked 

I've always switched online and that asks for an annual consumption.  (ignoring any other options like number of rooms - which is a recipe for disaster)