Is it dangerous to move to house with structural issues

TripleH

I know professional bodies take accusations against members' behaviour very seriously IF that behaviour relates to the work they do.

It is up to you how you proceed on this, making a complaint is not to be taken lightly and his institute's aim would be to protect their name ahead of his welfare and career, so it may be for him to convince them of his innocence. This could drive a deeper rift between you two. However he did agree to uphold a set of standards when he became a member, which from this evidence presented, it appears he isn't.

Section62

FaceHead said:

You absolutely need to report this shocking behaviour to his professional body (IStructE I suppose?). I'd propose doing this before next Thursday, so that you can say that IStructE are investigating, if that comes up. 

The OP should only say that if it is true.  If she reports the ex to IStructE for alleged professional misconduct the institution will, in due course, start an investigation if they believe the matter is serious enough.

Until the institution starts their investigation, the most the OP can say is that she has reported him.

And that won't carry much weight in a family court hearing.  As Doozergirl points out, family courts are incredibly forgiving of behaviour that most of us would find completely unacceptable.  And over-egging a structural report is very low on the scale where something like drink-driving with your children in the car is not considered a safety concern.

Making false or inaccurate claims about the other parent in a family court hearing is a very bad idea - if the institution decided not to investigate then the ex could present evidence at the next hearing that the OP had misled the court.  And one thing courts really hate is being lied to.

FaceHead said:

Given your independent report, the expectation is that the judge will give him a dressing down next Thursday.

Very unlikely.

As it stands it is the professional opinion of one person versus the professional opinion of another.

One of them has said "Without opening exposing what looks like a drop beam in the lounge, I wont be able to verify the adequacy of the support".

The obvious response from the ex's solicitor is what use is a structural report which says 'I've not been able to check the adequacy of the support' - which in fact endorses what the ex is saying.


The OP has a good case if it is handled well. But she needs a good solicitor.  And needs to avoid falling into the trap of thinking this is an open and shut case.

They never are.

Section62

thegreenone said:

Sounds like blackmail.

It has nothing at all to do with blackmail.

If anything, as others have said, it appears that coercive control could be a possibility.

But any parent is entitled to make an application for a prohibited steps order, and in advance of the hearing the applicant's solicitor has a duty to explain to the other party what the applicant is seeking.  This is all set out in the relevant Procedure Rules and Practice Directions.

The ex's solicitor is not trying to blackmail the OP.

Slinky

Sounds as though opening up the access to the beam once in the property would then allow the engineer to comment further one way or the other.

This whole thing sounds like pure jealousy on the part of the father that the OP is moving on with her life and isn't dependant on him.

Section62

TripleH said:

I know professional bodies take accusations against members' behaviour very seriously IF that behaviour relates to the work they do.

It is up to you how you proceed on this, making a complaint is not to be taken lightly and his institute's aim would be to protect their name ahead of his welfare and career, so it may be for him to convince them of his innocence. This could drive a deeper rift between you two.

The engineering institutions take reports of misconduct seriously, but are generally far more forgiving of member behaviour than you believe.

TripleH said:

However he did agree to uphold a set of standards when he became a member, which from this evidence presented, it appears he isn't.

Which evidence?  As it stands it is one professional opinion versus another.  Neither of the reports are definitive.


It is really important the OP gets professional legal advice.  Although people's supportive comments are understandable, it is vital that the OP gets balanced and measured advice from a legal professional instead.

Jeepers_Creepers

hnnguse said:

 Summary/ screenshot  from his report: 

As said by others, that report is not unusual, and certainly not frightening. In most of the wall-removal cases there, he actually suggests there will be beams present due to the size of the downstands. The exception is in the second paragraph, where - if there isn't a steel hidden within the floor thickness - that would need checking and addressing.

With the removed chimney stacks, as said before there are a number of ways in which to provide support for these, and he cites only the current method. So, provided the method chosen for supporting the stack was correct for its era and is secure (eg, brick corbel, gallow brackets, etc), then it ain't going to fall down, and no-one is going to demand it's replaced by a steel beam.

So, that's actually a generally 'good' report.

You've sensibly had a second opinion, and this confirms that there are no signs of concern. So, all good?

Yes. Until it goes pear-shaped with your ex's highly-emotive estimate for the works! Can you imagine any surveyor writing such things for their 'client'?!

"In my experience, over 35 years, the vast majority of structural work carried out without approval under the Building Regs is ultimately found to be non-compliant" (Almost certainly a statement of the bleedin' obvious - but that's not to say any work is unsafe.)

"Structural work designed on the hoof on a DIY basis or by a jobbing builder inevitably lacks the necessary rigorous assessment of the loadpaths..." (That's a statement of the bleedin' ditto.)

"In my experience, where chimney breasts have been partially removed without approvals, it is very rare to find adequate means of support. In this case there is, perhaps, potentially a tonne or more of brickwork overhanging what will be your children's bedroom."

"I understand the vendors purchased the property relatively recently and, if they did so without seeking professional advice, or ignoring that advice, the ramifications should remain with them to resolve, otherwise, setting aside the ongoing risks to H&S, you will find yourself in their position when you need to move on."

Phew, scary... And that's its sole purpose. Completely unprofessional imo.

Good luck. Stay strong. I would agree with someone earlier - send your concerns to the appropriate regulating body of which he is (hopefully) a member right away, especially citing his estimate for the works and the highly emotive and unprofessional language used. I guess it's unlikely he'll receive a comm from them before the hearing to say a concern has been logged with them, but it should be quite unnerving for him if he did, and hopefully take the wind out of his bluster during the case.

You stay calm, factual, steely - like the almost certainly present beams.

It reminds me of a previous house where I got quotes to paint the outside. One gave a large quote which included scaffolding - with the directly-implied threat that if I were to select a painter who did not use scaffolding, I would be personally liable should they fall off whatever they were using instead.

 

TripleH

Section62, thank you.

I was going by my experience of professional bodies (where a complaint = guilty now prove you're not) but accept I have no experience of the engineers institutuons.

Yes also that the details here are also appear one-sided. I accept I got caught up in things. I know that some institutes require impartiality in working and would question if the Op's ex acted thus?

It appears he doesn't want her to but the house and how will he prove it rather than he should have gone here is a house, what state is it in?

JCarmello

When people are saying that there are two professional opinions here, I would challenge that. There is one opinion from a professional who is independent of the property.

There is another opinion from a professional who is not independent of the property.

I don't know how family court works, but surely a judge will have bought a house in the past, and so knows what a good survey looks like.

My sympathies to you OP - but please make sure you have a solicitor who is experienced in family court matters.

deannagone

I'd also point out that the works weren't recent, and nothing has fallen in since the works, suggesting children are safe in the house.., as well as present the new survey.  I'd suggest that the ex's stance is biased and unsupported (no suggestions of imminent collapse or structural weakness).  

I wonder if there is something in law that protects the OP in this case, it seems like the ex forbidding her to move into a new house, with all proper checks having been made is a legally suspect case.  If this kind of 'don't move otherwise you will lose your children' stance is very suspect and demonstrates an attempt to be coercive.  Its not like the OP has been able to find anything suggesting the house is in a state of imminent collapse, neither did the ex.

I would also be immediately on receiving this letter, go to a family law solicitor and ask if there is anything that can be done to protect the OP and her children against having the ex refusing to return the children.  I suspect there isn't any protection, but i'd be asking.

verytired11

There's a lot of plausible deniability here on his behalf.  You will have to be extremely strategic and don't get emotional.  Make sure you comply with everything you are required to whilst having a good solicitor to fight your case.  Do you know why he doesn't want you to move?  If you know this it allows you to prep some reassurances that the court may accept.  For example, if his complaint is that it will be more difficult to see the children you can set out steps you will take to ensure that contact remains at the same level, for example.  If it is only about the safety of the house, provide some builders quotes for the remedial work and make it clear that of course you would never put your children's safety at risk and you fully intend to investigate and remediate any issues compromising safety.  Have the surveyor's report but also have evidence of other steps you have taken to address the concerns.  At all costs avoid a 'he said, she said' type situation and don't rise to any bait.  Detach your behaviour from his and think of how the court will judge your behaviour, not how they will judge his.  If you ignore his concerns that goes in his favour and against you.  Good luck, it sounds like a horrible stressful situation.