Economy crash =/= stock market crash?

coyrls

Type_45 said:

masonic said:

Type_45 said:

Since I bought VANECK UCITS ETFS VANECK VECTORS JNR GOLD MIN  (GJGB) on 19 April its lost 27.85% of it's value.  An absolute horror show.  Haemorrhages money pretty much every day.

I should have made the decision to have a certain stop on it and sold it before now.  I don't feel I can do that anymore.

It currently represents 13.40% of my portfolio, so it's not hurting too much.  It's just annoying.

Of course, it pales into insignificance compared to my crypto losses.

It's a shame I was unable to convince you to sell out at an 18% loss a month ago. Searching for gold to mine is an expensive venture and heavily dependent on inexpensive capital and the promise of jam tomorrow. One could draw comparisons to tech stocks. Then again, I was wrong about crypto, I thought $30k was around the bottom for BTC. I suppose this is the danger with some 'alternative assets'... frying pan --> fire.

On unemployment, I think the current shortage of labour has a lot to do with central banks taking their hawkish stance, since not only do we have full employment, there are more jobs than can currently be filled, so a mild recession will not see unemployment become a problem to the extent it might have done in the past. It is a dangerous game to play, though, as a deep recession will be more harmful than a period of high inflation, and interest rates will do little to impact the supply-side inflation we are currently facing. Gives them somewhere to go if it hits the fan, which is probably the main reason for the tightening. Either they play it right, and get to level off / pause, or overshoot and need to go into reverse.

But I was too much of a visionary  ........

Yes, I expect that's the reason.

Grenage

Type_45 said:

masonic said:

Type_45 said:

Since I bought VANECK UCITS ETFS VANECK VECTORS JNR GOLD MIN  (GJGB) on 19 April its lost 27.85% of it's value.  An absolute horror show.  Haemorrhages money pretty much every day.

I should have made the decision to have a certain stop on it and sold it before now.  I don't feel I can do that anymore.

It currently represents 13.40% of my portfolio, so it's not hurting too much.  It's just annoying.

Of course, it pales into insignificance compared to my crypto losses.

It's a shame I was unable to convince you to sell out at an 18% loss a month ago. Searching for gold to mine is an expensive venture and heavily dependent on inexpensive capital and the promise of jam tomorrow. One could draw comparisons to tech stocks. Then again, I was wrong about crypto, I thought $30k was around the bottom for BTC. I suppose this is the danger with some 'alternative assets'... frying pan --> fire.

On unemployment, I think the current shortage of labour has a lot to do with central banks taking their hawkish stance, since not only do we have full employment, there are more jobs than can currently be filled, so a mild recession will not see unemployment become a problem to the extent it might have done in the past. It is a dangerous game to play, though, as a deep recession will be more harmful than a period of high inflation, and interest rates will do little to impact the supply-side inflation we are currently facing. Gives them somewhere to go if it hits the fan, which is probably the main reason for the tightening. Either they play it right, and get to level off / pause, or overshoot and need to go into reverse.

The gold miners and crypto were a mistake, without which I'd be doing better in my portfolio than 99% of small investors.

And I'd be doing even better still had I stuck to my guns from September 2021 when I went into purely cash and gold.  But I was too much of a visionary, went too early, the market kept going up, and I jumped back in.

I had the right ideas but I was ahead of my time and my gambling instincts took over.  We live and learn.

We'd all be doing better than 99% of investors if we'd only done this or that.

Type_45

Grenage said:

Type_45 said:

masonic said:

Type_45 said:

Since I bought VANECK UCITS ETFS VANECK VECTORS JNR GOLD MIN  (GJGB) on 19 April its lost 27.85% of it's value.  An absolute horror show.  Haemorrhages money pretty much every day.

I should have made the decision to have a certain stop on it and sold it before now.  I don't feel I can do that anymore.

It currently represents 13.40% of my portfolio, so it's not hurting too much.  It's just annoying.

Of course, it pales into insignificance compared to my crypto losses.

It's a shame I was unable to convince you to sell out at an 18% loss a month ago. Searching for gold to mine is an expensive venture and heavily dependent on inexpensive capital and the promise of jam tomorrow. One could draw comparisons to tech stocks. Then again, I was wrong about crypto, I thought $30k was around the bottom for BTC. I suppose this is the danger with some 'alternative assets'... frying pan --> fire.

On unemployment, I think the current shortage of labour has a lot to do with central banks taking their hawkish stance, since not only do we have full employment, there are more jobs than can currently be filled, so a mild recession will not see unemployment become a problem to the extent it might have done in the past. It is a dangerous game to play, though, as a deep recession will be more harmful than a period of high inflation, and interest rates will do little to impact the supply-side inflation we are currently facing. Gives them somewhere to go if it hits the fan, which is probably the main reason for the tightening. Either they play it right, and get to level off / pause, or overshoot and need to go into reverse.

The gold miners and crypto were a mistake, without which I'd be doing better in my portfolio than 99% of small investors.

And I'd be doing even better still had I stuck to my guns from September 2021 when I went into purely cash and gold.  But I was too much of a visionary, went too early, the market kept going up, and I jumped back in.

I had the right ideas but I was ahead of my time and my gambling instincts took over.  We live and learn.

We'd all be doing better than 99% of investors if we'd only done this or that.

Well exactly. Hindsight is 20/20.

[Deleted User]

So far 108 pages of doom but she carries on going. People can be squeezed, doesn't mean they will burst. There are ways to make additional income to keep afloat. One may work on the weekend, stop luxury, eat less etc. A little inconvenient. But I would say tough is being on the street. If you still have a roof over your head its just inconvenient and you do get used to things being different. If someone told me 10 years ago what my life would be like now I would have said impossible. You are tougher than you think.

lozzy1965

Type_45 said:

GSP said:

Type_45 said:

Since I bought VANECK UCITS ETFS VANECK VECTORS JNR GOLD MIN  (GJGB) on 19 April its lost 27.85% of it's value.  An absolute horror show.  Haemorrhages money pretty much every day.

I should have made the decision to have a certain stop on it and sold it before now.  I don't feel I can do that anymore.

It currently represents 13.40% of my portfolio, so it's not hurting too much.  It's just annoying.

Of course, it pales into insignificance compared to my crypto losses.

Well as long as you can still afford enough baked beans to keep you going between 3 months and what is it 24 months now of ‘rough times ahead’.
And also enough around you to protect your ‘wealth’ what’s left of it in a world where ‘currency’ has a new meaning and trades are done on a daily basis to stay alive.
Thinking something as bad as Zombie fleasheaters the impression you give how bad things will be.

incidentally, if you say nearly 15% of your portfolio is a horrow show, but this pales into insignificance of your cryto losses, just how well are you doing?

What % is your portfolio down from its highest point?

Just to show off a bit, mine's about 6% down from it's highest recent point.  Heavily FTSE100 and FTSE250 weighted individual shares across a wide range of industries and companies.

Type_45

lozzy1965 said:

Type_45 said:

GSP said:

Type_45 said:

Since I bought VANECK UCITS ETFS VANECK VECTORS JNR GOLD MIN  (GJGB) on 19 April its lost 27.85% of it's value.  An absolute horror show.  Haemorrhages money pretty much every day.

I should have made the decision to have a certain stop on it and sold it before now.  I don't feel I can do that anymore.

It currently represents 13.40% of my portfolio, so it's not hurting too much.  It's just annoying.

Of course, it pales into insignificance compared to my crypto losses.

Well as long as you can still afford enough baked beans to keep you going between 3 months and what is it 24 months now of ‘rough times ahead’.
And also enough around you to protect your ‘wealth’ what’s left of it in a world where ‘currency’ has a new meaning and trades are done on a daily basis to stay alive.
Thinking something as bad as Zombie fleasheaters the impression you give how bad things will be.

incidentally, if you say nearly 15% of your portfolio is a horrow show, but this pales into insignificance of your cryto losses, just how well are you doing?

What % is your portfolio down from its highest point?

Just to show off a bit, mine's about 6% down from it's highest recent point.  Heavily FTSE100 and FTSE250 weighted individual shares across a wide range of industries and companies.

You're very diversified within one asset class then. 

lozzy1965

Type_45 said:

lozzy1965 said:

Type_45 said:

GSP said:

Type_45 said:

Since I bought VANECK UCITS ETFS VANECK VECTORS JNR GOLD MIN  (GJGB) on 19 April its lost 27.85% of it's value.  An absolute horror show.  Haemorrhages money pretty much every day.

I should have made the decision to have a certain stop on it and sold it before now.  I don't feel I can do that anymore.

It currently represents 13.40% of my portfolio, so it's not hurting too much.  It's just annoying.

Of course, it pales into insignificance compared to my crypto losses.

Well as long as you can still afford enough baked beans to keep you going between 3 months and what is it 24 months now of ‘rough times ahead’.
And also enough around you to protect your ‘wealth’ what’s left of it in a world where ‘currency’ has a new meaning and trades are done on a daily basis to stay alive.
Thinking something as bad as Zombie fleasheaters the impression you give how bad things will be.

incidentally, if you say nearly 15% of your portfolio is a horrow show, but this pales into insignificance of your cryto losses, just how well are you doing?

What % is your portfolio down from its highest point?

Just to show off a bit, mine's about 6% down from it's highest recent point.  Heavily FTSE100 and FTSE250 weighted individual shares across a wide range of industries and companies.

You're very diversified within one asset class then. 

My view is that most 'proper' investments all tend to follow the same trend.  If one is into enough wide ranging companies then you get global reach and industry diversification.  The knock on effect of asset classes is encompassed by actual companies.

GazzaBloom

I'm no visionary but am about 7% down year to date including contributions into 100% equities index funds. We hold 3 funds, one each for my pension, wife's pension and S&S ISA.

No fannying around or piddling about with asset allocation here, just rising above the noise and buying in monthly regardless.

The only thing I have done in significantly increase my salary sacrifice from March to buy more.

coastline

lozzy1965 said:

Type_45 said:

lozzy1965 said:

Type_45 said:

GSP said:

Type_45 said:

Since I bought VANECK UCITS ETFS VANECK VECTORS JNR GOLD MIN  (GJGB) on 19 April its lost 27.85% of it's value.  An absolute horror show.  Haemorrhages money pretty much every day.

I should have made the decision to have a certain stop on it and sold it before now.  I don't feel I can do that anymore.

It currently represents 13.40% of my portfolio, so it's not hurting too much.  It's just annoying.

Of course, it pales into insignificance compared to my crypto losses.

Well as long as you can still afford enough baked beans to keep you going between 3 months and what is it 24 months now of ‘rough times ahead’.
And also enough around you to protect your ‘wealth’ what’s left of it in a world where ‘currency’ has a new meaning and trades are done on a daily basis to stay alive.
Thinking something as bad as Zombie fleasheaters the impression you give how bad things will be.

incidentally, if you say nearly 15% of your portfolio is a horrow show, but this pales into insignificance of your cryto losses, just how well are you doing?

What % is your portfolio down from its highest point?

Just to show off a bit, mine's about 6% down from it's highest recent point.  Heavily FTSE100 and FTSE250 weighted individual shares across a wide range of industries and companies.

You're very diversified within one asset class then. 

My view is that most 'proper' investments all tend to follow the same trend.  If one is into enough wide ranging companies then you get global reach and industry diversification.  The knock on effect of asset classes is encompassed by actual companies.

One of my bookmarks is the Market Summary link below. Select any Sector, Index, etc and you can see the general trend. If you want to go back further simply use the Sharp Chart symbol under the chart itself on the far left.

Market Summary | StockCharts.com

For example a UK banking stock compared to the $BNK index in the US.

Barclays PLC, UK:BARC Advanced Chart - (LON) UK:BARC, Barclays PLC Stock Price - BigCharts.com (marketwatch.com)

There's always differences as individual stocks have their own make up but generally trends are in the same direction. Sometimes you can think there's something wrong but it could well be the sector is just out of favour.

Lloyds Banking Group PLC, UK:LLOY Advanced Chart - (LON) UK:LLOY, Lloyds Banking Group PLC Stock Price - BigCharts.com (marketwatch.com)

Still positive..

S&P 500 Could Be 30% Higher In The Next 12 Months (ibtimes.com)

lozzy1965

coastline said:

lozzy1965 said:

Type_45 said:

lozzy1965 said:

Type_45 said:

GSP said:

Type_45 said:

Since I bought VANECK UCITS ETFS VANECK VECTORS JNR GOLD MIN  (GJGB) on 19 April its lost 27.85% of it's value.  An absolute horror show.  Haemorrhages money pretty much every day.

I should have made the decision to have a certain stop on it and sold it before now.  I don't feel I can do that anymore.

It currently represents 13.40% of my portfolio, so it's not hurting too much.  It's just annoying.

Of course, it pales into insignificance compared to my crypto losses.

Well as long as you can still afford enough baked beans to keep you going between 3 months and what is it 24 months now of ‘rough times ahead’.
And also enough around you to protect your ‘wealth’ what’s left of it in a world where ‘currency’ has a new meaning and trades are done on a daily basis to stay alive.
Thinking something as bad as Zombie fleasheaters the impression you give how bad things will be.

incidentally, if you say nearly 15% of your portfolio is a horrow show, but this pales into insignificance of your cryto losses, just how well are you doing?

What % is your portfolio down from its highest point?

Just to show off a bit, mine's about 6% down from it's highest recent point.  Heavily FTSE100 and FTSE250 weighted individual shares across a wide range of industries and companies.

You're very diversified within one asset class then. 

My view is that most 'proper' investments all tend to follow the same trend.  If one is into enough wide ranging companies then you get global reach and industry diversification.  The knock on effect of asset classes is encompassed by actual companies.

One of my bookmarks is the Market Summary link below. Select any Sector, Index, etc and you can see the general trend. If you want to go back further simply use the Sharp Chart symbol under the chart itself on the far left.

Market Summary | StockCharts.com

For example a UK banking stock compared to the $BNK index in the US.

Barclays PLC, UK:BARC Advanced Chart - (LON) UK:BARC, Barclays PLC Stock Price - BigCharts.com (marketwatch.com)

There's always differences as individual stocks have their own make up but generally trends are in the same direction. Sometimes you can think there's something wrong but it could well be the sector is just out of favour.

Lloyds Banking Group PLC, UK:LLOY Advanced Chart - (LON) UK:LLOY, Lloyds Banking Group PLC Stock Price - BigCharts.com (marketwatch.com)

Still positive..

S&P 500 Could Be 30% Higher In The Next 12 Months (ibtimes.com)

I'm a bit slow, so I'm not entirely sure what you are telling me
I noticed that I was not very clear in my original post too though!  I guess I meant that generally speaking, if the economy is down then ones investments (as a whole) are likely to be down, and vice versa.  Notwithstanding hedge investments - which to my mind push more towards the gambling side of investing.
One can get diversification across sectors as well as asset classes by investing purely in individual companies.  Obviously not as much diversification.
I do have gut feeling thoughts that I can't always put into intelligible words which may of course be utter nonsense anyway!
At least this thread is a good place for that though eh!