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Bulb not seeing the light

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Comments

  • MWT
    MWT Posts: 9,487 Forumite
    1,000 Posts Fourth Anniversary Name Dropper
    D_P_Dance said:
    We seems to be in some disagreement about the switching.  The AST explicitly forbids it  without the permission of the landlord .  The landlord must not  unreasonably withhold it.  Therefore It appears that the tenant cannot switch without seeking the landlords permission.  If the tenant wishes to switch all they need do is ask the landlord.  My tenant did not do so.
    Your tenant doesn't need your permission to switch their own account and you can put what you want in the AST, it still doesn't make it enforceable...
    If you wish to control the energy account then you need to keep it in your name, if you do not do that then you cannot legally control it, but you do become subject to a deemed tariff when your tenant vacates and ends their agreement with their preferred energy supplier..



  • D_P_Dance
    D_P_Dance Posts: 11,547 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    OP do you really expect electricity consumption since the middle of December until now to be zero?.

    Of course not, estate agents will have turned the power on to allow potential buyers to view it, but it is likely to be pennies.  

    Have you considered that standing charges,if applicable are still also accruing as time progresses.

    Indeed, and I have agreed to pay them.  However I am refusing to pay for estimated use when the estimate is hugely inflated. , but I have still not received an invoice.  I am a professional landlord and cuch invoices are a sine qua non before I pay anyoneb 

    However, as I have said before, my query was how much should I consider suing them for for stress and harassment, no-one has touched on this.  
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
  • Hasbeen
    Hasbeen Posts: 4,404 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Photogenic Name Dropper
    edited 12 March 2021 at 10:04AM
    Op regards paying for an estimated use why not read the meter's and then the account holder can send them actual readings?

    Once received, estimated reading on your wife's (account holder) name will be amended to provide a true up to date energy reading for the property?

    You can not sue them if as you say the account is in your wife's name?

    But as you say: "I am a professional landlord and cuch invoices are a sine qua non before I pay anyoneb"  And as you have been successful in the past regarding suing in courts. So get the account holder to go ahead under your professional advisement.

    I would consider the figure of suing them for £500  for stress and harassment, suffered by your wife.
    The world is not ruined by the wickedness of the wicked, but by the weakness of the good. Napoleon
  • rp1974
    rp1974 Posts: 757 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 500 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    OK,then lets cut to the chase how much do you want?.
    Hope you get the result you desire.



  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 0 Newbie
    1,000 Posts Third Anniversary Name Dropper
    edited 12 March 2021 at 11:30AM
    Interesting. The Ofgem website states the following:

    Can my landlord choose my gas or electricity supplier?

    Your landlord has the right to choose your energy supplier only when they are directly responsible for paying for the gas or electricity.

    This might include situations where your landlord:

    • pays the energy supplier directly and reclaims the money from you as the tenant.
    • incorporates the cost of energy within the accommodation charges.
    • assumes responsibility for the supply between tenancies.

    Your tenancy agreement should detail if you or your landlord are responsible for paying for the gas or electricity.

    I confess that I do NOT understand the relevance of a landlord paying for energy between tenancies in respect of a tenant's (consumer's) right to choose a particular supplier.

    Ofgem's advice goes on to say:

    Smart meters in rented property

    If you directly pay your energy supplier for the gas or electricity in your rented property, you can choose to have a smart meter installed.  Although we’d recommend you tell your landlord before you get one. There may be rules in your tenancy agreement about how energy is supplied to the property, including the type of meter that can be installed. 

    So it would appear that Landlords can legally prevent tenants from requesting a smart meter.


    Edit:


    Thanks to @Gerry for pointing out my typo: twice for emphasis.

  • D_P_Dance
    D_P_Dance Posts: 11,547 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    Op regards paying for an estimated use why not read the meter's and then the account holder can send them actual readings?

    Because I am 80, vulnerable, and unnecessary travel is against the Law.  Also, it is unnecessary if they apply some common sense.  
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
  • Gerry1
    Gerry1 Posts: 10,185 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    edited 24 October 2023 at 4:53PM
    @[Deleted User] The get-out clause if the landlord 'assumes responsibility for the supply between tenancies' seems to be another case of Ofgem being asleep at the wheel.  Obviously it can never be guaranteed that a new tenant will take over the moment an existing tenant moves out, so the logical conclusion would be that every landlord has the right to monetise their tenants by locking them into lucrative deals with expensive suppliers such as Spark.  Once again, Ofgem is failing to protect the consumer.  One wonders whether this absurdity would be considered to be an Unfair Contract if challenged under the Consumer Rights Act 2015?
    However, it's quite reasonable that landlords can legally prevent tenants from requesting a smart meter.  Landlords have the right to require that the property will be handed back in its original condition at the end of the tenancy, and the installation of a smart meter contrary to the landlord's wishes would represent an unauthorised change having been made to the property.  As it would be difficult or impossible for the landlord to revert to a conventional meter it's entirely reasonable to prevent tenants installing a smart meter unless it has been mandated by law.
  • Hasbeen
    Hasbeen Posts: 4,404 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Photogenic Name Dropper
    D_P_Dance said:
    Op regards paying for an estimated use why not read the meter's and then the account holder can send them actual readings?

    Because I am 80, vulnerable, and unnecessary travel is against the Law.  Also, it is unnecessary if they apply some common sense.  
    Understood, but perhaps your estate agents that are showing prospective rentees your property, could perhaps if asked do this and send you the readings?

    May I ask how far away is the property? Some travel is permitted. Also essential travel?

    "For landlords who have been following the latest guidance, the latest lockdown does not fundamentally change the obligations or restrictions they already face. House moves and viewings may continue and essential work in the property may continue provided everyone is following the latest guidance on working safely in people's homes."
    The world is not ruined by the wickedness of the wicked, but by the weakness of the good. Napoleon
  • Hasbeen
    Hasbeen Posts: 4,404 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Photogenic Name Dropper
    edited 12 March 2021 at 12:53PM
    Dolor said:
    Interesting. The Ofgem website states the following:

    Can my landlord choose my gas or electricity supplier?

    Your landlord has the right to choose your energy supplier only when they are directly responsible for paying for the gas or electricity.

    This might include situations where your landlord:

    • pays the energy supplier directly and reclaims the money from you as the tenant.
    • incorporates the cost of energy within the accommodation charges.
    • assumes responsibility for the supply between tenancies.

    Your tenancy agreement should detail if you or your landlord are responsible for paying for the gas or electricity.

    I confess that I do NOT understand the relevance of a landlord paying for energy between tenancies in respect of a tenant's (consumer's) right to choose a particular supplier.

    Ofgem's advice goes on to say:

    Smart meters in rented property

    If you directly pay your energy supplier for the gas or electricity in your rented property, you can choose to have a smart meter installed.  Although we’d recommend you tell your landlord before you get one. There may be rules in your tenancy agreement about how energy is supplied to the property, including the type of meter that can be installed. 

    So it would appear that Landlords can legally prevent tenants from requesting a smart meter.


    Edit:


    Thanks to @Gerry for pointing out my typo: twice for emphasis.

    Perhaps I have missed this, but if the property did have a smart meter installed against the Landlords agreement then there would be no problems at this time obtaining accurate readings?

    The problem is that the Landlord due to age, vulnerability, distance, Covid legislation etc is unable to provide an accurate reading? and is disputing the estimates his wife has received?

    When the tenant moves out the tenant supplies a closing reading to the provider and pays up to that reading point.

    The house is empty. The Landords responsibility is to contact the deemed provider, register and provide an opening reading if asked.
    They are then responsible for any usage, standing charges etc effective from the date the tenant moved out, until a new tenant moves in which may be a considerable time.

    Power is getting consumed, estate agents visiting, boilers on standby, security lights etc, standing charges rack up
    The world is not ruined by the wickedness of the wicked, but by the weakness of the good. Napoleon
  • Glad you are not my landlord! No AST can tie a tenant to any energy supplier, you won’t win that one in court, 
    Be happy, it's the greatest wealth :)
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