Employer (Ford Motor Company) Didn't Pay National Insurance - State Pension Diminished

RedditchResident

I am approaching retirement age and checked my state pension.  I learned that in 1990 my then employer Ford Motor Company, Brentwood, Essex made no National Insurance Contributions for me.  Consequently I lose out on state pension for want of qualifying years.  I joined Ford as a graduate in 1987 and stayed ten years.  I crossed the NI threshold in month one of 1990.  I wrote to the MD of Ford last summer and for six months heard nothing other than 'we're looking into it' emails, only in response to chasing.  Finally in exasperation I wrote a 'letter ahead of action'.  In short order I heard back from Lewis Silken, a city law firm, telling me that I am time barred from raising the matter.  I gather six years is the time limit on legal cases.  This all seems very unfair.  Was wondering if anyone on the forum might be able to suggest a course of action.   

El_Torro

It's possible that your employer (Ford) didn't actually do anything wrong. You might have been opted out of the state pension scheme. Essentially your employer gave you a more generous pension in return for you getting a reduced state pension.

This may or may not be the case for you. However I'd be surprised if Ford has swindled you in this case. 

Marcon

RedditchResident said:

I am approaching retirement age and checked my state pension.  I learned that in 1990 my then employer Ford Motor Company, Brentwood, Essex made no National Insurance Contributions for me.  Consequently I lose out on state pension for want of qualifying years.  I joined Ford as a graduate in 1987 and stayed ten years.  I crossed the NI threshold in month one of 1990.  I wrote to the MD of Ford last summer and for six months heard nothing other than 'we're looking into it' emails, only in response to chasing.  Finally in exasperation I wrote a 'letter ahead of action'.  In short order I heard back from Lewis Silken, a city law firm, telling me that I am time barred from raising the matter.  I gather six years is the time limit on legal cases.  This all seems very unfair.  Was wondering if anyone on the forum might be able to suggest a course of action.   

Could be an error on NICO's part. What exactly does your state pension forecast show, especially in relation to the whole period of service with Ford?

xylophone

You might have been opted out of the state pension scheme. 

"Contracted Out" of SERPS - but even for those contracted out, NI payments still needed to be made by both employer and employee, just at a different rate.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_Earnings-Related_Pension_Scheme

Silvertabby

El_Torro said:

It's possible that your employer (Ford) didn't actually do anything wrong. You might have been opted out of the state pension scheme. Essentially your employer gave you a more generous pension in return for you getting a reduced state pension.

This may or may not be the case for you. However I'd be surprised if Ford has swindled you in this case. 

Contracted out (of SERPS/SP2) not opted out.  Huge difference.

OP - do you mean that you paid reduced NI when you worked at Ford?  If so, that would be correct - the additional State pension that you didn't pay for will be accounted for in your Ford pension.

Or are you really saying that you didn't pay a penny in NI during the 10 years you worked there?

xylophone

Consequently I lose out on state pension for want of qualifying years.  

What exactly does your State Pension Forecast say?

https://www.gov.uk/check-state-pension

Is a COPE shown?

How many NI years did you have at 6/4/16?

tacpot12

Unfortunately, I think the the law firm is correct; your action for breach of contract has to start within six years of the breach occurring, even if you were unaware of the breach until now. If you have home insurance, and have legal expenses cover as part of this, you can call the legal helpline to get a professional legal view as to whether the time limitation suggested by the law firm applies to your case. 

If it does, I would suggest that you write back to the law firm and advise them that you accept the fact that you have no legal case, but want to ask if their client will consider an ex-gratia payment to you in the light of this being a mistake that they made? I think Lewis Silken could be a strong advocate for you if you propose a fair settlement. I would suggest that the amount of the payment be the sum of the NI payments that we not made at the time. This will leave you footing the bill for the difference in what the missing years will cost to replace now, vs. what they would have cost Ford in 1990-2000. However, this is going to be easier for Ford to pay, so may be a compromise that they will agree to. An you are an ex-employee, it seems the least they could do. 

Terron

Whilst there is a time limit on breach of contract I don't think there is for HMRC collecting NI. I don't know if that would help your pension but it might be worth investigating.

molerat

What exactly does your SP forecast and NI history show ?  I find it quite strange that a large employer like Ford would fail to pay NI.

Marcon

tacpot12 said:

Unfortunately, I think the the law firm is correct; your action for breach of contract has to start within six years of the breach occurring, even if you were unaware of the breach until now. If you have home insurance, and have legal expenses cover as part of this, you can call the legal helpline to get a professional legal view as to whether the time limitation suggested by the law firm applies to your case. 

If it does, I would suggest that you write back to the law firm and advise them that you accept the fact that you have no legal case, but want to ask if their client will consider an ex-gratia payment to you in the light of this being a mistake that they made? I think Lewis Silken could be a strong advocate for you if you propose a fair settlement. I would suggest that the amount of the payment be the sum of the NI payments that we not made at the time. This will leave you footing the bill for the difference in what the missing years will cost to replace now, vs. what they would have cost Ford in 1990-2000. However, this is going to be easier for Ford to pay, so may be a compromise that they will agree to. An you are an ex-employee, it seems the least they could do. 

Why on earth would Ford's lawyers be a 'strong advocate' for a case which is out of time? 

In any case, this isn't years of NI - OP was employed by Ford from 1987 to 1997 and has said ' I learned that in 1990 my then employer Ford Motor Company, Brentwood, Essex made no National Insurance Contributions for me'.   

Any pay records will be long gone, but if OP's state pension forecast shows they were contracted out of SERPS during 1990 (which will be the case if they were in what was then the 'main' Ford pension scheme), they must by definition have an NI record for that year - in which case it sounds like an error at NICO's end.

RedditchResident

Marcon said:

RedditchResident said:

I am approaching retirement age and checked my state pension.  I learned that in 1990 my then employer Ford Motor Company, Brentwood, Essex made no National Insurance Contributions for me.  Consequently I lose out on state pension for want of qualifying years.  I joined Ford as a graduate in 1987 and stayed ten years.  I crossed the NI threshold in month one of 1990.  I wrote to the MD of Ford last summer and for six months heard nothing other than 'we're looking into it' emails, only in response to chasing.  Finally in exasperation I wrote a 'letter ahead of action'.  In short order I heard back from Lewis Silken, a city law firm, telling me that I am time barred from raising the matter.  I gather six years is the time limit on legal cases.  This all seems very unfair.  Was wondering if anyone on the forum might be able to suggest a course of action.   

Could be an error on NICO's part. What exactly does your state pension forecast show, especially in relation to the whole period of service with Ford?

All of my years with Ford are qualifying years except the year in question.