Universities

Pennywise

The way Unis are dealing with it differs enormously.  At my son's Uni, the only "support" provided when his flat went into isolation because one idiot partied and got covid was a pack of loo rolls!  They wanted to charge £18 per day per person for a food parcel.  He couldn't download the programs he needed from the Uni portal onto his laptop, but can't get any "face to face" IT support because the staff are all working from home or behind closed doors so he can't access some of the programs he needs (because they're not being allowed to use Uni computers in the library and other study areas!).  A lot of the "on line" resources are last year's recorded lectures.  None of his lecturers/teaching staff are even on campus.  As for complaining or asking for more support, he only ever receives generic email responses referring him to their website.  The promised cleaning of his flat's communal areas and kitchen never happened from day one "due to covid" but there's no refund for that either.  They've told them no refunds or discounts for accommodation despite being sent home pre Christmas early, and being told not to go back until end of Jan at the earliest, nor are they allowing them out of the rental contracts to vacate their accommodation and stay at home either.  Also yes, to the OP about the lies told by the unis in August about "blended learning" and face to face tuition which was on their website until the deadline to confirm places and accomm contracts had passed, then the webpages changed to "most will be online" - blatant lies to get students to commit to accommodation contracts.  

Lightning360

sammyjammy said:

My neighbours girls both did/are doing Open University courses instead of Uni, enabled them to get part-time jobs at home which supported their choice of degree/career, they still pay the tuition fees but no additional accommodation costs as both are still at home, they are both sensible and mature enough not to need the "University experience"

And? The Open University and online learning isn't for everyone. This seems like a very irrelevant comment.

Lightning360

Pennywise said:

The way Unis are dealing with it differs enormously.  At my son's Uni, the only "support" provided when his flat went into isolation because one idiot partied and got covid was a pack of loo rolls!  They wanted to charge £18 per day per person for a food parcel.  He couldn't download the programs he needed from the Uni portal onto his laptop, but can't get any "face to face" IT support because the staff are all working from home or behind closed doors so he can't access some of the programs he needs (because they're not being allowed to use Uni computers in the library and other study areas!).  A lot of the "on line" resources are last year's recorded lectures.  None of his lecturers/teaching staff are even on campus.  As for complaining or asking for more support, he only ever receives generic email responses referring him to their website.  The promised cleaning of his flat's communal areas and kitchen never happened from day one "due to covid" but there's no refund for that either.  They've told them no refunds or discounts for accommodation despite being sent home pre Christmas early, and being told not to go back until end of Jan at the earliest, nor are they allowing them out of the rental contracts to vacate their accommodation and stay at home either.  Also yes, to the OP about the lies told by the unis in August about "blended learning" and face to face tuition which was on their website until the deadline to confirm places and accomm contracts had passed, then the webpages changed to "most will be online" - blatant lies to get students to commit to accommodation contracts.  

I think this experience will be recognised by students all over the country. I don't think people realise just how poorly students have been treated. 
Someone I know is doing a biology degree with practicals online which clearly isn't the same as in-person practicals. They aren't being given the same experience and aren't being taught the same skills but are still meant to pay the same. 

Aylesbury_Duck

Lightning360 said:

sammyjammy said:

My neighbours girls both did/are doing Open University courses instead of Uni, enabled them to get part-time jobs at home which supported their choice of degree/career, they still pay the tuition fees but no additional accommodation costs as both are still at home, they are both sensible and mature enough not to need the "University experience"

And? The Open University and online learning isn't for everyone. This seems like a very irrelevant comment.

True, which is why students who don't want to do so should explore options for pausing their studies and recommencing in a future year.  I know a few students who've done just that - they finished their first or second years in June, and worked with their universities to defer the next year until September 2021 because they didn't want the online or blended education being offered in this academic year.  Students have some bargaining power here, particularly if they're at one of the less popular universities.  Whilst students are not actually paying their tuition fees (yet), the universities are receiving cash, and a student who leaves is worth n(9250) where n is the number of years of study left.  Much better for those universities to forego a year's tuition fee income but be sure of it in future years than to risk losing that student altogether, if they take their credits to another university later on.

tooldle

I don’t recognise ‘this experience ‘, nor would my daughter. I work in a University and my daughter is a student at a different University. We are most definitely delivering in person lab classes. A lab class which once ran for thirty students, is now three lab classes each for ten students. Obviously this means the space is occupied more than it would normally have been by that particular cohort. Compromises might therefore be made in terms of extending the ‘working day’ or delivering lab sessions in term 3. It might be more productive to look at the plan over the full three years rather than to reach a judgement based on only the one year. It is after all quite a juggling act to deliver for all three year groups across a range of subjects, and that is without considering the postgraduate schemes.

Barny1979

Lightning360 said:

Pennywise said:

The way Unis are dealing with it differs enormously.  At my son's Uni, the only "support" provided when his flat went into isolation because one idiot partied and got covid was a pack of loo rolls!  They wanted to charge £18 per day per person for a food parcel.  He couldn't download the programs he needed from the Uni portal onto his laptop, but can't get any "face to face" IT support because the staff are all working from home or behind closed doors so he can't access some of the programs he needs (because they're not being allowed to use Uni computers in the library and other study areas!).  A lot of the "on line" resources are last year's recorded lectures.  None of his lecturers/teaching staff are even on campus.  As for complaining or asking for more support, he only ever receives generic email responses referring him to their website.  The promised cleaning of his flat's communal areas and kitchen never happened from day one "due to covid" but there's no refund for that either.  They've told them no refunds or discounts for accommodation despite being sent home pre Christmas early, and being told not to go back until end of Jan at the earliest, nor are they allowing them out of the rental contracts to vacate their accommodation and stay at home either.  Also yes, to the OP about the lies told by the unis in August about "blended learning" and face to face tuition which was on their website until the deadline to confirm places and accomm contracts had passed, then the webpages changed to "most will be online" - blatant lies to get students to commit to accommodation contracts.  

I think this experience will be recognised by students all over the country. I don't think people realise just how poorly students have been treated. 
Someone I know is doing a biology degree with practicals online which clearly isn't the same as in-person practicals. They aren't being given the same experience and aren't being taught the same skills but are still meant to pay the same. 

So word of mouth etc? Did you go to University?

Aylesbury_Duck

Lightning360 said:

Pennywise said:

The way Unis are dealing with it differs enormously.  At my son's Uni, the only "support" provided when his flat went into isolation because one idiot partied and got covid was a pack of loo rolls!  They wanted to charge £18 per day per person for a food parcel.  He couldn't download the programs he needed from the Uni portal onto his laptop, but can't get any "face to face" IT support because the staff are all working from home or behind closed doors so he can't access some of the programs he needs (because they're not being allowed to use Uni computers in the library and other study areas!).  A lot of the "on line" resources are last year's recorded lectures.  None of his lecturers/teaching staff are even on campus.  As for complaining or asking for more support, he only ever receives generic email responses referring him to their website.  The promised cleaning of his flat's communal areas and kitchen never happened from day one "due to covid" but there's no refund for that either.  They've told them no refunds or discounts for accommodation despite being sent home pre Christmas early, and being told not to go back until end of Jan at the earliest, nor are they allowing them out of the rental contracts to vacate their accommodation and stay at home either.  Also yes, to the OP about the lies told by the unis in August about "blended learning" and face to face tuition which was on their website until the deadline to confirm places and accomm contracts had passed, then the webpages changed to "most will be online" - blatant lies to get students to commit to accommodation contracts.  

I think this experience will be recognised by students all over the country. I don't think people realise just how poorly students have been treated. 
Someone I know is doing a biology degree with practicals online which clearly isn't the same as in-person practicals. They aren't being given the same experience and aren't being taught the same skills but are still meant to pay the same. 

Again, they are not "paying" for an "experience", they will eventually pay for their education and qualification.  It's not a holiday or a package tour, why do you keep mentioning "experience"?  Again, if a student's primary objective for going to university is "the experience", they can defer and complete their studies when things return to normal. If they want a degree and the increased job prospects and earning potential that typically confers, then they are still being educated and should still attain their degree.

Perhaps you could be more specific.  Students studying which subject at which university are not "being taught the same skills"?  

Lightning360

Aylesbury_Duck said:

Lightning360 said:

Pennywise said:

The way Unis are dealing with it differs enormously.  At my son's Uni, the only "support" provided when his flat went into isolation because one idiot partied and got covid was a pack of loo rolls!  They wanted to charge £18 per day per person for a food parcel.  He couldn't download the programs he needed from the Uni portal onto his laptop, but can't get any "face to face" IT support because the staff are all working from home or behind closed doors so he can't access some of the programs he needs (because they're not being allowed to use Uni computers in the library and other study areas!).  A lot of the "on line" resources are last year's recorded lectures.  None of his lecturers/teaching staff are even on campus.  As for complaining or asking for more support, he only ever receives generic email responses referring him to their website.  The promised cleaning of his flat's communal areas and kitchen never happened from day one "due to covid" but there's no refund for that either.  They've told them no refunds or discounts for accommodation despite being sent home pre Christmas early, and being told not to go back until end of Jan at the earliest, nor are they allowing them out of the rental contracts to vacate their accommodation and stay at home either.  Also yes, to the OP about the lies told by the unis in August about "blended learning" and face to face tuition which was on their website until the deadline to confirm places and accomm contracts had passed, then the webpages changed to "most will be online" - blatant lies to get students to commit to accommodation contracts.  

I think this experience will be recognised by students all over the country. I don't think people realise just how poorly students have been treated. 
Someone I know is doing a biology degree with practicals online which clearly isn't the same as in-person practicals. They aren't being given the same experience and aren't being taught the same skills but are still meant to pay the same. 

Again, they are not "paying" for an "experience", they will eventually pay for their education and qualification.  It's not a holiday or a package tour, why do you keep mentioning "experience"?  Again, if a student's primary objective for going to university is "the experience", they can defer and complete their studies when things return to normal. If they want a degree and the increased job prospects and earning potential that typically confers, then they are still being educated and should still attain their degree.

Perhaps you could be more specific.  Students studying which subject at which university are not "being taught the same skills"?  

By experience, I meant the things that students normally get to help with their degrees, such as library access, or other things which normally are part of degrees, such as practicals. Access to facilities has been severely reduced.

I doubt any practical subjects are being taught the same skills they normally would be if their in-person teaching time has been reduced.

Also, some universities have made it harder to defer.

Morrigan_2020

I'm in the middle of a postgrad course, online part term alongside working full time.  The lecturers have really tried their best and worked hard to make it the best it can be but there is no comparison between a seminar or lecture over Zoom and a face to face one.  The energy is drained, and the interactions are unnatural and awkward.  There's nothing the uni staff can do about that but nobody should really be claiming that the courses are running at the same standard of quality. 

Barny1979

Lightning360 said:

Aylesbury_Duck said:

Lightning360 said:

Pennywise said:

The way Unis are dealing with it differs enormously.  At my son's Uni, the only "support" provided when his flat went into isolation because one idiot partied and got covid was a pack of loo rolls!  They wanted to charge £18 per day per person for a food parcel.  He couldn't download the programs he needed from the Uni portal onto his laptop, but can't get any "face to face" IT support because the staff are all working from home or behind closed doors so he can't access some of the programs he needs (because they're not being allowed to use Uni computers in the library and other study areas!).  A lot of the "on line" resources are last year's recorded lectures.  None of his lecturers/teaching staff are even on campus.  As for complaining or asking for more support, he only ever receives generic email responses referring him to their website.  The promised cleaning of his flat's communal areas and kitchen never happened from day one "due to covid" but there's no refund for that either.  They've told them no refunds or discounts for accommodation despite being sent home pre Christmas early, and being told not to go back until end of Jan at the earliest, nor are they allowing them out of the rental contracts to vacate their accommodation and stay at home either.  Also yes, to the OP about the lies told by the unis in August about "blended learning" and face to face tuition which was on their website until the deadline to confirm places and accomm contracts had passed, then the webpages changed to "most will be online" - blatant lies to get students to commit to accommodation contracts.  

I think this experience will be recognised by students all over the country. I don't think people realise just how poorly students have been treated. 
Someone I know is doing a biology degree with practicals online which clearly isn't the same as in-person practicals. They aren't being given the same experience and aren't being taught the same skills but are still meant to pay the same. 

Again, they are not "paying" for an "experience", they will eventually pay for their education and qualification.  It's not a holiday or a package tour, why do you keep mentioning "experience"?  Again, if a student's primary objective for going to university is "the experience", they can defer and complete their studies when things return to normal. If they want a degree and the increased job prospects and earning potential that typically confers, then they are still being educated and should still attain their degree.

Perhaps you could be more specific.  Students studying which subject at which university are not "being taught the same skills"?  

By experience, I meant the things that students normally get to help with their degrees, such as library access, or other things which normally are part of degrees, such as practicals. Access to facilities has been severely reduced.

I doubt any practical subjects are being taught the same skills they normally would be if their in-person teaching time has been reduced.

Also, some universities have made it harder to defer.

It's almost like this Pandemic was unplanned, everyone has missed out in the last 9/10 months, unfortunately students have to adapt, like we all have had to.