Universal Credit - Going on holiday

donnajunkie

Spoonie_Turtle said:

donnajunkie said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

donnajunkie said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Robbie64 said:

Iain Duncan-Smith, when UC was being devised, made a big thing about the rules around people on JSA being able to take a 2 week holiday. He said it was wrong and so UC has been devised that if you are required to job search for 35 hours per week then that is what you must do.

UC is flexible in that if you have extenuating circumstances (temporary illness, family emergency) the work coach has the discretion to not enforce the hours of work search for a short period of time. But yes, the overall intention is that if your circumstances are such that under the legislation you should be working, then looking for work *is* your job until you find paid employment - and comes with possible compassionate leave and sick leave, but not paid holiday.

To be perfectly honest, unless a holiday was booked and paid for before income was low enough to be eligible for UC, I have no idea how claimants might be able to afford a month's holiday abroad anyway! Unless maybe they go to stay with family and can get cheap flights, or perhaps a single person staying in a hostel. For our family even a week in the UK in the cheapest caravan we could find was a struggle, and 2 weeks within the UK is only possible now because we are all adults with income (I'm the only one claiming benefits, everyone else's income is from work) and can share the cost.

I think we need to stop assuming people would all want to go away for a month. It could just be a week or even a long weekend. And in the uk. In my view its a nonesense when someone says its your job to look for work because if it were like a job you would get allocated holidays.

Your point was that the rules contradict by saying you can be away for a month but they don't allow you to go on holiday, that's the only reason I'm talking about a month. Yes you pretty much can go on a week's holiday in the UK as long as you can fulfil your commitments, and even easier to do that with a long weekend, so I still don't see the problem.

I'm also not saying I agree that looking for a job *should* be a full-time job, I know how soul-destroying it is from a couple of long stints of unemployment some years ago and to have to do it week in and week out is just horrendous. What I'm saying is that is the intention behind the rules.

The point is why would you go away if you have to spend all day looking for work. The reason for going away is to do something else. And you may not have access to the internet while away.

You know you can do your required hours in any pattern you want? Doesn't have to be 9-5 Mon-Fri with an hour for lunch, and you don't have to have the internet to be posting spec letters and CVs if you're organised enough to take company addresses away with you. (And if you're on UC without the internet at home or on a smartphone then one wonders how you'd fulfill the requirement of frequently checking the journal anyway.)

I think I'm done here.

Ok so you can just post applications while away. I am sure most can work with that. Please keep in mind that i have no experience of uc and i am just going on what people say.
regarding not having access to the net. Well is it a condition of qualifying for uc to have access to the net? If not then surely there is something in place to deal with this. In normal circumstances people can use the library or the jobcentre computers but all of these have been unavailable lately.

calcotti

donnajunkie said:

calcotti said:

donnajunkie said: The point is why would you go away if you have to spend all day looking for work. The reason for going away is to do something else. And you may not have access to the internet while away.

You are expected to do certain things in order to maintain your entitlement, it is your choice whether or not you choose to go away. 

The point is the rules make it impossible to go away. So on one hand the rules say you can go away, on the other the rules make it impossible to go away.

It may be difficult (or impossible) for you to meet your Claimant Commitment and go away. The rules are not written just for you, they are written to encompass the wide variety of claimants on UC.

Spoonie_Turtle

calcotti said:

donnajunkie said:

calcotti said:

donnajunkie said: The point is why would you go away if you have to spend all day looking for work. The reason for going away is to do something else. And you may not have access to the internet while away.

You are expected to do certain things in order to maintain your entitlement, it is your choice whether or not you choose to go away. 

The point is the rules make it impossible to go away. So on one hand the rules say you can go away, on the other the rules make it impossible to go away.

It may be difficult (or impossible) for you to meet your Claimant Commitment and go away. The rules are not written just for you, they are written to encompass the wide variety of claimants on UC.

I'm not sure they're on UC because they referenced weekly appointments and on the other thread were asking about JSA phone calls without an online journal ... I don't know if they're even on JSA, or just bored ...

poppy12345

donnajunkie said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

donnajunkie said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

donnajunkie said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Robbie64 said:

Iain Duncan-Smith, when UC was being devised, made a big thing about the rules around people on JSA being able to take a 2 week holiday. He said it was wrong and so UC has been devised that if you are required to job search for 35 hours per week then that is what you must do.

UC is flexible in that if you have extenuating circumstances (temporary illness, family emergency) the work coach has the discretion to not enforce the hours of work search for a short period of time. But yes, the overall intention is that if your circumstances are such that under the legislation you should be working, then looking for work *is* your job until you find paid employment - and comes with possible compassionate leave and sick leave, but not paid holiday.

To be perfectly honest, unless a holiday was booked and paid for before income was low enough to be eligible for UC, I have no idea how claimants might be able to afford a month's holiday abroad anyway! Unless maybe they go to stay with family and can get cheap flights, or perhaps a single person staying in a hostel. For our family even a week in the UK in the cheapest caravan we could find was a struggle, and 2 weeks within the UK is only possible now because we are all adults with income (I'm the only one claiming benefits, everyone else's income is from work) and can share the cost.

I think we need to stop assuming people would all want to go away for a month. It could just be a week or even a long weekend. And in the uk. In my view its a nonesense when someone says its your job to look for work because if it were like a job you would get allocated holidays.

Your point was that the rules contradict by saying you can be away for a month but they don't allow you to go on holiday, that's the only reason I'm talking about a month. Yes you pretty much can go on a week's holiday in the UK as long as you can fulfil your commitments, and even easier to do that with a long weekend, so I still don't see the problem.

I'm also not saying I agree that looking for a job *should* be a full-time job, I know how soul-destroying it is from a couple of long stints of unemployment some years ago and to have to do it week in and week out is just horrendous. What I'm saying is that is the intention behind the rules.

The point is why would you go away if you have to spend all day looking for work. The reason for going away is to do something else. And you may not have access to the internet while away.

You know you can do your required hours in any pattern you want? Doesn't have to be 9-5 Mon-Fri with an hour for lunch, and you don't have to have the internet to be posting spec letters and CVs if you're organised enough to take company addresses away with you. (And if you're on UC without the internet at home or on a smartphone then one wonders how you'd fulfill the requirement of frequently checking the journal anyway.)

I think I'm done here.

  Please keep in mind that i have no experience of uc and i am just going on what people say.

Judging by this then i'm assuming there's no claim for UC here. Just bored, is my thoughts.

Spoonie_Turtle

poppy12345 said:

donnajunkie said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

donnajunkie said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

donnajunkie said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Robbie64 said:

Iain Duncan-Smith, when UC was being devised, made a big thing about the rules around people on JSA being able to take a 2 week holiday. He said it was wrong and so UC has been devised that if you are required to job search for 35 hours per week then that is what you must do.

UC is flexible in that if you have extenuating circumstances (temporary illness, family emergency) the work coach has the discretion to not enforce the hours of work search for a short period of time. But yes, the overall intention is that if your circumstances are such that under the legislation you should be working, then looking for work *is* your job until you find paid employment - and comes with possible compassionate leave and sick leave, but not paid holiday.

To be perfectly honest, unless a holiday was booked and paid for before income was low enough to be eligible for UC, I have no idea how claimants might be able to afford a month's holiday abroad anyway! Unless maybe they go to stay with family and can get cheap flights, or perhaps a single person staying in a hostel. For our family even a week in the UK in the cheapest caravan we could find was a struggle, and 2 weeks within the UK is only possible now because we are all adults with income (I'm the only one claiming benefits, everyone else's income is from work) and can share the cost.

I think we need to stop assuming people would all want to go away for a month. It could just be a week or even a long weekend. And in the uk. In my view its a nonesense when someone says its your job to look for work because if it were like a job you would get allocated holidays.

Your point was that the rules contradict by saying you can be away for a month but they don't allow you to go on holiday, that's the only reason I'm talking about a month. Yes you pretty much can go on a week's holiday in the UK as long as you can fulfil your commitments, and even easier to do that with a long weekend, so I still don't see the problem.

I'm also not saying I agree that looking for a job *should* be a full-time job, I know how soul-destroying it is from a couple of long stints of unemployment some years ago and to have to do it week in and week out is just horrendous. What I'm saying is that is the intention behind the rules.

The point is why would you go away if you have to spend all day looking for work. The reason for going away is to do something else. And you may not have access to the internet while away.

You know you can do your required hours in any pattern you want? Doesn't have to be 9-5 Mon-Fri with an hour for lunch, and you don't have to have the internet to be posting spec letters and CVs if you're organised enough to take company addresses away with you. (And if you're on UC without the internet at home or on a smartphone then one wonders how you'd fulfill the requirement of frequently checking the journal anyway.)

I think I'm done here.

  Please keep in mind that i have no experience of uc and i am just going on what people say.

Judging by this then i'm assuming there's no claim for UC here. Just bored, is my thoughts.

Thanks, I didn't register that - either I missed it or had given up by then!

donnajunkie

calcotti said:

donnajunkie said:

calcotti said:

donnajunkie said: The point is why would you go away if you have to spend all day looking for work. The reason for going away is to do something else. And you may not have access to the internet while away.

You are expected to do certain things in order to maintain your entitlement, it is your choice whether or not you choose to go away. 

The point is the rules make it impossible to go away. So on one hand the rules say you can go away, on the other the rules make it impossible to go away.

It may be difficult (or impossible) for you to meet your Claimant Commitment and go away. The rules are not written just for you, they are written to encompass the wide variety of claimants on UC.

Nobody is going to spend 5+ hours per day jobseeking while on holiday or away doing something else. The requirement makes it impossible to do what you are away for therefore making going away pointless.

donnajunkie

poppy12345 said:

donnajunkie said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

donnajunkie said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

donnajunkie said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Robbie64 said:

Iain Duncan-Smith, when UC was being devised, made a big thing about the rules around people on JSA being able to take a 2 week holiday. He said it was wrong and so UC has been devised that if you are required to job search for 35 hours per week then that is what you must do.

UC is flexible in that if you have extenuating circumstances (temporary illness, family emergency) the work coach has the discretion to not enforce the hours of work search for a short period of time. But yes, the overall intention is that if your circumstances are such that under the legislation you should be working, then looking for work *is* your job until you find paid employment - and comes with possible compassionate leave and sick leave, but not paid holiday.

To be perfectly honest, unless a holiday was booked and paid for before income was low enough to be eligible for UC, I have no idea how claimants might be able to afford a month's holiday abroad anyway! Unless maybe they go to stay with family and can get cheap flights, or perhaps a single person staying in a hostel. For our family even a week in the UK in the cheapest caravan we could find was a struggle, and 2 weeks within the UK is only possible now because we are all adults with income (I'm the only one claiming benefits, everyone else's income is from work) and can share the cost.

I think we need to stop assuming people would all want to go away for a month. It could just be a week or even a long weekend. And in the uk. In my view its a nonesense when someone says its your job to look for work because if it were like a job you would get allocated holidays.

Your point was that the rules contradict by saying you can be away for a month but they don't allow you to go on holiday, that's the only reason I'm talking about a month. Yes you pretty much can go on a week's holiday in the UK as long as you can fulfil your commitments, and even easier to do that with a long weekend, so I still don't see the problem.

I'm also not saying I agree that looking for a job *should* be a full-time job, I know how soul-destroying it is from a couple of long stints of unemployment some years ago and to have to do it week in and week out is just horrendous. What I'm saying is that is the intention behind the rules.

The point is why would you go away if you have to spend all day looking for work. The reason for going away is to do something else. And you may not have access to the internet while away.

You know you can do your required hours in any pattern you want? Doesn't have to be 9-5 Mon-Fri with an hour for lunch, and you don't have to have the internet to be posting spec letters and CVs if you're organised enough to take company addresses away with you. (And if you're on UC without the internet at home or on a smartphone then one wonders how you'd fulfill the requirement of frequently checking the journal anyway.)

I think I'm done here.

  Please keep in mind that i have no experience of uc and i am just going on what people say.

Judging by this then i'm assuming there's no claim for UC here. Just bored, is my thoughts.

It is an area of interest and should be for most people unless they are one of the fortunate people who can feel confident they are employed for life.

poppy12345

Back for more i see..

calcotti

donnajunkie said:

calcotti said:

donnajunkie said:

calcotti said:

donnajunkie said: The point is why would you go away if you have to spend all day looking for work. The reason for going away is to do something else. And you may not have access to the internet while away.

You are expected to do certain things in order to maintain your entitlement, it is your choice whether or not you choose to go away. 

The point is the rules make it impossible to go away. So on one hand the rules say you can go away, on the other the rules make it impossible to go away.

It may be difficult (or impossible) for you to meet your Claimant Commitment and go away. The rules are not written just for you, they are written to encompass the wide variety of claimants on UC.

Nobody is going to spend 5+ hours per day jobseeking while on holiday or away doing something else. The requirement makes it impossible to do what you are away for therefore making going away pointless.

You are repeatedly missing the point - there is no concept of a holiday for people with full job search requirements, as has been explained several times. The rule says about absences allow other people to be been treated without jeopardising their claim. If someone chose to take a holiday but continue job searching while away they would be allowed to do this - I agree with you however that that seems rather pointless.

sheramber

It is not impossible to go away. You just won't get paid UC while you are away.