Trying to get a deposit back on a puppy

Pollycat

Puppylove1980 said:

London50 said:

I take it that you paid the deposit by bank transfer??

Yes

Oh dear.

SHOPPERS are being warned not to use bank transfers when they pay for things online as it's much harder to get their money back when something goes wrong.

The warning comes after four men who conned 100 victims out of almost £552,000 were jailed last week.

The scammers placed fake adverts for non-existent products and services online, and convinced their victims to pay them through bank transfers.

But if you pay by bank transfer and something goes wrong, you're not covered by the same protection offered to card and Paypal payments.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/money/9631181/why-not-pay-bank-transfer-scammers-shop/

waamo

hollydays said:

Puppylove1980 said:

hollydays said:

Are they a registered breeder. If you wanted to message their details I'll try to check them out. I will not post any personal details publically

Thanks, what details would you need?

Just send me whatever you have. Facebook name, home address, phone number, name breed of dog

You would also need passport, driving licence, utility bill and bank details. It's all 100% risky free. 

soolin

There’s even a Facebook group trying to trace the puppy scams and get the scammers closed down 
https://www.facebook.com/puppyfraud/

Puppylove1980

I realise most people have found this amusing, so to humour you all, I'll add a few details-
The seller has:
A genuine Facebook profile with photos of both this litter and previous litters of both this breed and another breed. Also including their 'day job' which is confirmed by a search on companies house.
An email address that is very much in the public domain, linked to her address and the family business.
A mobile number that is linked to the company.
Our initial discussions included:
Unusual for them to operate at all online- usually sell to friends, friends of friends, etc. 
Insistent on the final decision being made AFTER meeting them, the puppies, Mother dog etc
Deposit not being a commitment beyond having the choice of one of 3 dogs of a particular colour (9 puppies in total)
Bank details matching all the information we'd researched (one of us works in banking)

This wasn't us buying a dog blind from a website. This wasn't us buying a puppy; it was done, in grace, to get the next choice when we finally met the litter. 

This wasn't us making a decision on a whim- we researched the seller, spoke to them on the phone and agreed that the deposit would be returned if we changed our mind at anytime before meeting the litter or when we met them. We were in pretty constant contact with until we decided to pull out. 

I totally get that many will see this as stupid, I've already accepted the naivety of it, and I understand that regular users of this forum read so many naive pleas for help that it's easy to belittle people.
I'm kindly asking, on a very famous money related forum- renowned for it's community spirit, for any kind of guidance about the legalities of all this or a way we can encourage the seller to be more co-operative. 
If the answer is that there is absolutely nothing we can do about it then great, we take that on the chin, but if there is anyone who has any fact-based information that could help us out that would be hugely appreciated. 

suki1964

LBA and then small claims

Bradden

surely if one of you works in banking then you would have run a mile at the request to pay by bank transfer? I'm no expert in banking but that would have set alarm bells off for me.

So sorry you've been scammed.. .hopefully they will pay up!

As you know where they work it may be worth contacting them there.. it may embarrass them into refunding the deposit.

The_Rainmaker

Bradden said:

surely if one of you works in banking then you would have run a mile at the request to pay by bank transfer? I'm no expert in banking but that would have set alarm bells off for me.

How else apart from cash (or cheque at a push) are they going to pay?

I'm going to hopefully take a litter off my girl this year (will be her one and only) the litter will be from good field trial stock. all prospective buyers will be vetted to within an inch of their life to ensure they are going to be working dogs or at least rural dogs and if I agree to them having a pup they will pay a deposit by bank transfer.

DoaM

suki1964 said:

LBA and then small claims

This. But what can you evidence in writing about the return of the deposit if you cancel? As said previously, Facebook ads for the sale of animals are not allowed so the breeder shouldn't even have been making such posts. (I'm a member of a re-homing Facebook group and we're not allowed to share any adverts, from anywhere (e.g. Gumtree, Pets4Homes) within group posts).

When we got our puppy we paid nothing until we went to see the litter for the first time. At that point we selected which one we wanted (5 pups, 2 were left to select from, all were still with the mother) and gave the breeder the deposit as cash ... it was the breeder's insistence that she would not take any deposit until there was a commitment to buy a pup, and she wanted to vet any prospective owners. We paid the balance when we collected him to bring him home.

PS - we're still in touch with the breeder; she, the pup's Mum and his sister (the breeder kept one of the pups) come along to our monthly meets (we're members of a Facebook group for the breed who meet for monthly walks) so all the doggy pals can have a run around together. Well, we were having monthly meets until lockdown.

Puppylove1980

DoaM said:

suki1964 said:

LBA and then small claims

This. But what can you evidence in writing about the return of the deposit if you cancel? As said previously, Facebook ads for the sale of animals are not allowed so the breeder shouldn't even have been making such posts. (I'm a member of a re-homing Facebook group and we're not allowed to share any adverts, from anywhere (e.g. Gumtree, Pets4Homes) within group posts).

When we got our puppy we paid nothing until we went to see the litter for the first time. At that point we selected which one we wanted (5 pups, 2 were left to select from, all were still with the mother) and gave the breeder the deposit as cash ... it was the breeder's insistence that she would not take any deposit until there was a commitment to buy a pup, and she wanted to vet any prospective owners. We paid the balance when we collected him to bring him home.

PS - we're still in touch with the breeder; she, the pup's Mum and his sister (the breeder kept one of the pups) come along to our monthly meets (we're members of a Facebook group for the breed who meet for monthly walks) so all the doggy pals can have a run around together.

Thanks.
There was no ad per se, seller had mentioned they'd had a litter recently with some for sale in a post by another member asking if anybody knew of any available pups- we then messaged seller via FB and then spoke on the phone. The post was on a kind of breed fanclub page rather than any kind of marketplace....

DoaM

Did any of the FB messages mention the deposit and that it would be refundable? (If yes then this would be evidence you could use).