Can I be forced to have a smart meter?

SAC2334

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81874074#Comment_81874074

YOU are not knocking on in age or not used to computers .Yes , you re nowhere near as experienced as me .I once had a 30 year old electrician losing his temper with the damn things . So you never spotted the KVAh reading on it as it scrolled round the various screens in a few seconds which meant nothing anyway and were not needed for the reading , or the hard to see decimal point after the 7 th digit or the difficult to read font .

The worst ever designed smart meter by a country mile and no one else has used that format in any of the smart meters , but you think its ok for the general public to use ?

My Daughter has a physics degree and got me round to take the two readings they are that bad .They do record the usage correctly in kwh s but thats not the point ,,is it ?

Ildhund

Oh dear. Does the fact that I don't know what 'knocking on in age' means prove that I am indeed knocking on in age? As far as not being used to computers is concerned, this was my first (EDSAC II, * 1958 † 1966):

I rarely looked at the Liberty 110. All the information I needed from it was available either on the excellent IHD (also Secure, known as the Pipit 500) or in my online account, where every half-hourly bucket and every midnight reading is recorded, nine years' worth of them since the meter was installed. I don't remember ever having had to submit manual readings; if I did, I'd probably have taken them from the IHD anyway. I was particularly sorry to see the back of the Pipit 500 - it was far superior to the pretty but pretty useless one that came with the brilliant Aclara SGM 1416-B SMETS2 meter.

SAC2334

So next time you press a button on a smart meter , expecting to get a 5 digit reading, what would you think if what you got was a 30 second scrolling screen with half a second on the first screen starting with an 8 digit IMP KWH 1234567.8 ( note the decimal point ) followed by numerous other totally unnecessary readings and info , including a KVAH 8 digit number 12345678 .

You would have to be bonkers to foist that on the general public .But many suppliers were so happy with the £40 cost of a Secure Liberty Indian Small Business meter they happilly did that showing their contempt for the end user .I had none stop complaints daily with the the things .

i can only guess that in their meetings they thought it would not matter because the supplier would always get the readings sent anyway because its smart.

Scot_39

Off topic a bit - but

Yes - I still have a secure - the earlier smets1 - 100 iirc - a 4 port with extrernal contactor for ALCS (EOns preferred solution for a while despite a 5 port being avaialble).

I'd need to open the meter cabinet outside to check the 100 - but sure that right - which unlike the meter it replaced - that one only lasted around 2 years (digital, not smart) - has functioned since day 1- and although was always accessible by more than just EOn (Octopus support it for instance but not my E10 tariff) - I believe it now works via DCC.

However like others - it is a bit of a pain for multirate.

You even need to use a different button (9 vs 6 iirc) to get the individual register scroll working on the tiny keyboard (too small) - and it has no way of splitting day / night on the IHD - AFAIK. I asked fitter at install time - and in a follow up e-mail - so if it had it EOn couldn't or just didn't tell me how.

So I use a spreadsheet and total costs and total units used and the known rates to work out my daily / weekly night splits - although I must admit - I havent updated it - for a long time - although have paper notes.

I just log the data off my monthly statements - and periodically check the total kWh on the IHD.

Note sure of the brand of IHD or if it has a name like the Pippet by Secure mentioned above - mines has EOn on the back - and an EOn sticker - model no SEDv3 and dated 2016 - on the label (hidden under the stand / bracket) - this looks like the manual

https://www.eonenergy.com/content/dam/eon-energy-com/Files/smart/JGB49272%20D6955_08_18%20SED%20Generic%20Guide.pdf

so if anyone knows a way of getting register 1 and 2 etc on the display itself ?

dansparky

After years of Harrasment from EDF i sent this email after receiving recently lots of text messages stating that RTS signal for my smart meter will run out on the 2nd of march.

Before agreeing to any meter replacement, I require written clarification on the following points:1.    Whether my current meter is definitely an RTS‑dependent meter.2.    Whether the '2 March' date you mentioned is an EDF internal deadline or a national RTS shutdown date.3.    What specific technical issue will occur on my meter on that date if no replacement is carried out.4.    Written confirmation that my energy usage cannot be remotely altered or adjusted by EDF under any circumstances.5.    If a replacement is genuinely required, I request that the new meter is set to non‑communicating mode, and that I will continue submitting manual readings.  I am perfectly capable of submitting manual readings and wish to continue doing. 6.    Please confirm that EDF will not remotely activate communication functions or attempt remote readings without my explicit consent, as this would be contrary to Ofgem rules and the Smart Metering Installation Code of Practice.7.    I do not give consent for any remote activation or remote mode changes now or in the future.
Thank you.

I was told that

Hello

Thank you for your message and for raising your concerns.

To clarify your points:

1. Your current meter is indeed an RTS-dependent meter.
2. The 2nd March 2026 date is the deadline for your meter, which means we will need to attend to exchange it by then. The exact shutdown date can vary depending on the specific meter, but this is the date by which action is required.
3. If the meter is not replaced by this date, there is a risk of losing functionality, particularly for your off-peak usage, which could affect your billing and energy management.
4. Please be assured that your energy usage cannot be remotely altered or adjusted by EDF under any circumstances.
5. Since a replacement is necessary, we would install an Economy 7 meter to ensure you continue to benefit from your off-peak rates. You will have the option to choose whether you want this meter to operate in smart mode or non-communicating mode, allowing you to continue submitting manual readings if you prefer.
6. EDF will not remotely activate communication functions or attempt remote readings without your explicit consent, in line with Ofgem rules and the Smart Metering Installation Code of Practice.
7. We acknowledge your decision not to give consent for any remote activation or remote mode changes now or in the future.

If you would like to proceed with the meter replacement or have any further questions, please let us know your preference for the meter mode and any other concerns you may have.

Best Wishes,

I also recieved an email from the chief legal officer stating

…

This is because your meter is connected to a device called a Radio Teleswitch (known as RTS).

 

The Radio TeleSwitch receives radio signals currently broadcast by the BBC, that drive the RTS device to switch certain electricity loads on and off in your house. The meter is then able to record these loads, which occur at different times, so that the usage can then be billed at the correct peak or off peak rates.

 

This configuration was particularly common in houses with electrical heating, where the power to the storage heating was managed through a different electrical circuit to the power for the rest of the property. This enabled the power for the heating to be measured separately, and to be switched off and on remotely through the RTS device to ensure it only consumed power through cheaper off peak periods.

 

Unfortunately, energy suppliers like EDF do not control the transmission of the signal, which is controlled by the BBC. Nor do we control the BBC or their decision to stop broadcasting the signal in March – which is what they have decided.

 

This is the impact we have been writing to you about.  When the BBC stop broadcasting the signal in March it will mean the RTS device connected to your meter will no longer be able to work as originally intended. Unfortunately, we don’t fully understand what the impact will be, but it is possible (likely) that when the signal stops being broadcast that parts of your home circuits are no longer switched on or off at all or at the expected times.

 

The consequences could be some or all of your appliances and or heating not receiving power, or start receiving power at more expensive times.

 

The way to correct this is through having your RTS device and meter replaced with a smart meter, as the smart meter can then manage the switching of your circuits without being dependant on any signal from the BBC. However, to do so it must be in communicating mode, so that it can receive the appropriate signals to switch your circuits as needed.

 

Please note Ofgem rules do not prohibit us from obtaining remote readings monthly, they only prohibit us from obtaining readings on a half hourly basis if we have your consent.

 

So if you do not wish us to collect readings for every half hourly period of the day then please let me know and I will make sure we keep your data collection frequency to just monthly in line with Ofgem rules.

 

I have also had text messages stating that don't risk losing heating and hot water and also upgrde to keep it working.

powerful_Rogue

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81893079#Comment_81893079

Long and short of it - It's not your meter.

What's your actual concern, as what you posted seems very 'tin foil hat brigade'.

GingerTim

And as we know, 'non communication mode', aka 'dumb mode' means nothing.

EssexHebridean

@dansparky if you are thinking that the denial of consent for mode changes means that if you don’t pay the bills they can’t switch you to prepay mode then you’re incorrect I’m afraid - that is done by warrant which overrides your own personal desires in the matter. It’s essentially the same process as now but with far less disruption to the account holder. What your statement might mean though is that should you wish to change tariff in the future - to a cheaper one or even a smart specific one to really save money, the supplier could demand a written retraction of your previous refusal. That in turn could lead to you missing out on a good tariff which is only available for a short time.

I’d agree that explaining what your fears are is probably a good start - there is a huge amount of malicious misinformation around smart meters which is purely put out there by those who get their kicks by attemping to scare the vulnerable and has little or no basis in fact. If you explain to us what you have heard that has made you scared to accept a smart meters which then we can probably give you the facts around it which should help set your mind at rest. The main thing to remember if you are on a multi rate tariff is to ensure that the supplier and the fitter are fully aware of this and that they are intending to fit the correct kit to suit your needs.

Ultimately what is being proposed is a change from a now obsolete meter to an updated one using the current technology. Think of it this way - if your computer needed replacement, you wouldn’t go out and try to buy a Spectrum ZX or a Commodore C64 would you - so why are you reluctant to apply the same thinking to another device?

born_again

Perhaps the situation could be easily solved.

Meter reached expiry date. Company simply comes out & changes. If householder does not allow, then they get warrant to remove their property & leave without replacement. Sure that they would soon change their minds.

Scot_39

The situation could have been solved politically - by mandatory fitment - as it has now in other countries like Germany - or with additional charges - like in France when you pay an explicit premium on standard tariff rates - for not having one.

But it is difficult to mandate using something - that still today - has what many would surely consider too high failure rates in the UK system.

Even if arguably Ofgems End of Life smart replacement guidance to suppliers is a form of defacto mandation, it's not exactly clear messaging from govt. The Germans relaunched there domestic smart meter roll out by a vote in parliament on it - c2023 to start 2025 iirc)

And when we still have articles like this one by MSE last summer - reporting more than 10% of smart meters fail to communicate - and others suggesting around 20% have a fault of some description or other.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/2025/08/fixing-broken-smart-meters/

For a technology being pushed so hard for big potential savings - the £40 fine is not overly convincing a remedy to the literally millions of customers who cannot benefit.

I've had my smets1 for 8-9 years - its communicated since day 1 - is now DCC integrated (but was supported by my supplier EOn and some others - large and small when I had it fitted - even prior to that (yes I checked before chose it over another digital) - even if my tariff (E10) wasn't.

But I can well understand others often genuine reluctance - and sympathize with the 10%+ who having switched cannot benefit (some sadly having made changes / big purchases say on heating / EV's etc on basis they would benefit fully prior to upgrading meters) - but still bear the costs.

That 10% even arguably more shocking a failure - given the fact we are now 15 years from the initial roll out of smets1 meters on a trial basis (2011) - 11+ years from the start of initial planned main phase (2014 - 2019 - yes so now 6-7 years from initial intended "end" - % install target ? ) - and a full 7 years into the roll out of smets2 meters. The latest phase aiming for was it revised to a lower ? c75% only by 2025 - did we even achieve that ?

(Germany's now mandatory roll out target - far higher 95% by 2030 - in just c5/6 years)

That MSE comms 10%+ failure rate - far less easy for the govt and the regulator - to merely dismiss - to dodge their responsibility for - and IMO they are being far far too slow to resolve.

And yet another self inflicted bonus to the smart refuseniks of this world they are so clearly still struggling to convince some here - and others across the nation - of their merits.