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Brexit the economy and house prices part 7: Brexit Harder
Comments
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I posted a question yesterday on a Facebook propaganda Remainers site. It was about the far right. None of the people who said that they voted Remain made a comment about it. All reactions came from people who had voted Leave. The people who voted Remain were too busy quoting from the Remain propaganda cult leaflet of answers. I really don't think that they had done any research into what is happening politically in the EU so basically they have voted to continue membership of a club that they know nothing about.
So you accuse Remain supporters of not answering and then answering by quoting from propaganda? They cannot do both.
What about the rise in the far right in this country? Is it any different?Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
The establishment was 110% sure that Remain would win. Hence they made no plan for Leaving.
Don't blame the public. It is our MPs who are at fault. Even EU is not at fault. EU clearly said if you don't agree you leave without a deal.
It is our MPs who want to leave and still enjoy EU facilities.
If parliament planned for No Deal from 2016, it would not have been this mess.
I agree with you. But while it would not have been a mess we would still see
- industry deserting the UK and
- found that we were incapable of negotiating a better trade deal than the EU with anyone without accepting lower standards or conditions that are not in our best interests and
- seen immigration at similar levels with non-EU immigration replacing EU immigration and
- seen living standards fall
As i predicted after the referendum before we left the EU many who voted leave would appreciate the personal consequences of their actions and learn that leaving would not be as simple as they believed. Honda workers for example.Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
Are you serious?
One comment is about individuals telling lies.
The other is about asking a question that is based on facts agreed by a group of people.The only way we have of judging truth and lies is by how many people agree with the evidence. A good way of ensuring that only the truth is being told, is to make it that leave and remain supporting mps have to agree with what is being said on both sides.
The problem with the referendum is peoples votes were guided by people who lied about what their vote would mean, which invalidates the result. I'd prosecute anyone who lied, whether it was leave or remain. There was a huge scale of campaigning done for leave in poor areas where they were told out and out lies & the targeted facebook adverts, but because it was done in private there was no opportunity to disagree with them. The leave argument seems to be "well you should have gone out and told more lies to get people to vote"
By making the vote explicit, then at least people will know what they are voting for. Easiest negotiation ever, apparently not.
I personally think we should have negotiated a trial separation and let the docks seize up. Give boris some time to go down there and waive some union jacks, as that is all he is actually capable of.
The vote was nearly 3 years ago. Don't you think that it's time to change the record.0 -
Who says I don't lie? I'm not lying here, because there is no advantage.
All humans are inherently xenophobic, it's a survival instinct that at one point was advantageous as there were no rule of law to protect you etc.
Some of us are aware of it and override it, some of us don't. If you aren't consciously doing so, then it's safe to say that you make discriminatory decisions.
Xenphobia is an essential animal trait why would you want to suppress it?
Tell me about a decision that does not discriminate, banana or lemon? gin or beer? Remain in or leave the EU? The question discriminates between the 2 options.You weigh the evidence and then if you still can't tell, just pick the side that stands for what you believe.
What factors do you weigh the evidence against, or maybe just fall back on your prejudices from the outset.If you want to share prosperity with everyone no matter what country they happen to be born in then vote remain, if you want to raise the drawbridge and poke refugees back into the sea "where they deserve" with pointy sticks then vote leave.
This is not two ends of the spectrum with nothing in-between. The fact that you see sharing prosperity as an opposite to forcing refugees into the sea probably says more about your polarised views than others, that may see this situation requiring a far more nuanced argument.Hating the EU is actually more damaging to you than anything the EU has ever done. None of the anti rhetoric makes any kind of sense if you analyse it logically, there is something more complex driving the thought processes.
Who said anything about hating the EU, again this is your use of emotive words like crashing out and poking refugees. Furthermore you have already decided based upon your beliefs or was that prejudices?As an individual it's hard to do anything with democracy, you just have to accept that one mans growing scourge is another persons mate nige. You can get together with others and protest and petition, but it doesn't always work.
So why don't those that voted remain but didn't get the result they expected get to know our mate Nige?I'm not for staying in the EU at all costs, currently it's a benefit to us being in the EU.
So what might trigger your thoughts that our staying in the Eu is no longer tolerable?
Remember our mate Nige! well unfortunately he was murdered and we are now stuck with the growing scourge and no matter how many petitions and marches we have, there is no chance of reviving him.
RIP Nige
RIP Brexit0 -
"Not all lies are equal", that's like telling a 4 year old "it's our little secret". Utter drivel:(Not all lies are equal. Some people have morals, whilst I wouldn't trust Boris Johnson to tell the time.
Which documents and what peer review, sexed up dossier for WMD? Scientific study linking MMR to autism.The facts can often be determined by looking at the evidence, science or the actual documents in question.
Flat Earthers? - Through a flat-earther's eyes:
"First, a brief tour of the worldview of a flat-earther: While writing off buckets of concrete evidence that Earth is spherical, they readily accept a laundry list of propositions that some would call ludicrous. The leading flat-earther theory holds that Earth is a disc with the Arctic Circle in the center and Antarctica, a 150-foot-tall wall of ice, around the rim. NASA employees, they say, guard this ice wall to prevent people from climbing over and falling off the disc."
:rotfl::rotfl:
Remainers
"Leaving the Eu will lead to a cliff edge".
Just like the flat earth ice wall? :rotfl::rotfl:0 -
What about the rise in the far right in this country? Is it any different?
Nationalism appears to be a growing trend across Europe. The EU was meant to bring over 200 years of wars to an end. Yet now appears to be creating more division than reconciliation. Reopening many of the scars of the past.
Montenegro is currently negotiating to join the EU. Events last night showed how far we all are from being a "European" superstate.0 -
divisions can be reconciled, wars less likely so, so surely we're still better off?
though i do concede and admit that some would like nothing better than to have another war, squashing the dirty europeans. not that they would participate in such a war anyway, i don't expect that much dedication from them.0 -
Thrugelmir wrote: »The vote was nearly 3 years ago. Don't you think that it's time to change the record.
Sure, this brexit thing is a load of rubbish, lets just change the record and remain.
Are you still going on about it 3 years later? Move on, get over it.Thrugelmir wrote: »Events last night showed how far we all are from being a "European" superstate.
A very very long way away. I prefer the drivel about the EU army, to the drivel about a super state.."Leaving the Eu will lead to a cliff edge".
Just like the flat earth ice wall? :rotfl::rotfl:
Wow, you make stuff up and then laugh about it. You must be able to entertain yourself for hours.Xenphobia is an essential animal trait why would you want to suppress it?
Because civilised people suppress their animal instincts, I thought we were a civilised country but you're proving that we aren't.Tell me about a decision that does not discriminate, banana or lemon? gin or beer? Remain in or leave the EU? The question discriminates between the 2 options.
You don't understand discrimination obviously, or you're trolling. I don't know which.What factors do you weigh the evidence against, or maybe just fall back on your prejudices from the outset.
Clearly you do the later. The factors I used were down to whether we'd have money to pay the benefits of the people who are desperate to leave the EU, if we remain we do. If we leave we don't. Jobs aren't magically coming back no matter what unicorn you voted for.This is not two ends of the spectrum with nothing in-between. The fact that you see sharing prosperity as an opposite to forcing refugees into the sea probably says more about your polarised views than others, that may see this situation requiring a far more nuanced argument.
I was exaggerating because you seem unable to understand a nuanced position and I thought it might shock you into seeing the ridiculousness of your own viewpoint.Who said anything about hating the EU, again this is your use of emotive words like crashing out and poking refugees.
Lots of leave voters have said it, on this thread, twitter, facebook etc. If you have been paying so little attention to that, how do you expect to have any kind of meaningful discussion?Furthermore you have already decided based upon your beliefs or was that prejudices?
I've built up my view based on leave voters own words, I am constantly updating and adjusting.So why don't those that voted remain but didn't get the result they expected get to know our mate Nige?
I hear he spends most time hangs out with rich people who bought the election result that was good for them and rubbish for the rest of us.So what might trigger your thoughts that our staying in the Eu is no longer tolerable?
If they started acting in bad faith and took advantage of us, I can't give any specifics as it hasn't happened yet.Remember our mate Nige! well unfortunately he was murdered and we are now stuck with the growing scourge and no matter how many petitions and marches we have, there is no chance of reviving him.
RIP Nige
RIP Brexit
He was never your mate, he just peddled his lies so his friends could get rich off your back. Didn't you know?0 -
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Thrugelmir wrote: »The vote was nearly 3 years ago. Don't you think that it's time to change the record.
You're right.
3 years is a long time.
It's old news.
Time to change the record.
And focus on today.
Don't blame me, I voted Remain.0
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