Brexit the economy and house prices part 7: Brexit Harder

Enterprise_1701C

phillw wrote: »

The problem with you is that you don't even read or understand the point I make.

I didn't say all leave voters are stupid, for a start not all leave voters made their choice on an imagined brexit dividend. There are many reasons why some people were unable to see through the lie. Making poor choices doesn't make someone stupid, but when you refuse to recognise those poor choices then you are in denial.

Your problem is that you cannot believe that some people do not believe they are poor choices.

If you find something that is worth a fortune but offer to buy it for a pittance, and the owner then sells it to someone else for it's true worth, you would probably think they made a poor choice, but that choice is the best one for them.

Your opinions are simply that, opinions. Do not try and sell them as the absolute truth.

It is rather disturbing that you think so little of the UK that you do not believe we are capable of standing without the eu, we most certainly are. I do not want to be part of an eu that wants to become one country (how else can "ever closer union" be interpreted), and it is no good saying that we have a veto, because that veto will cease to exist within the next few years if we are forced to remain.

The only way I could be persuaded that the eu is a good thing is if it went back to being the common market, but it turns out that even then they intended to become the us of e, and if the eu want something they simply change rules until they get that something.

If we do not leave now we will be stuck forever in something that does not suit us but will never let us go, a rather abusive relationship. I can imagine them changing the rules to stop countries leaving within a short while, it never occurred to them that a country might actually dare to leave their grip so that is just another rule to change to suit them. If we do not leave now we will disappear.

phillw

Enterprise_1701C wrote: »

Your problem is that you cannot believe that some people do not believe they are poor choices.

No, I understand they don't yet realise yet it was a poor choice. How else are they going to find out unless someone explains it to them?

Enterprise_1701C wrote: »

Your opinions are simply that, opinions. Do not try and sell them as the absolute truth.

It is only your opinion that it's not an absolute truth. Reese Mogg and Farage are all on board that UK will be financially worse off after brexit, how come it's taking you so long to catch up?

Enterprise_1701C

Nothing on here is an absolute truth.

It is just that the remainers are throwing the dummy out of the pram.

phillw

Enterprise_1701C wrote: »

Nothing on here is an absolute truth.

It is just that the remainers are throwing the dummy out of the pram.

I'm "crushed" by your insult. One silver lining is that at least I'm right, or you would refute what I said. All the evidence points to us being worse off financially and is believed by prominent leave voting politicians.

You may think they wouldn't have suggested you all voted to leave if it made you worse off, but that isn't how things work.

Enterprise_1701C

Actually, I would not agree with that.

Just because you are in an abusive marriage with a rich person it does not mean that you should stay in that marriage if it means you become poor.

I guess you will never realise that no-one is "right" on here, it is an ongoing process, you never know what is around the corner.

I will never stop believing in my country, and I will never allow it to be destroyed if it is within my power to prevent it. From my point of view staying within the protectionist area that is the political union of the eu is the wrong thing for my country, and would destroy it, it would become just another state.

phillw

Enterprise_1701C wrote: »

Actually, I would not agree with that.

Just because you are in an abusive marriage with a rich person it does not mean that you should stay in that marriage if it means you become poor.

That isn't a good analogy for the point I was making about the people who voted to leave the EU not because they felt abused, but purely because they thought nothing would change except we'd have £350 million a week extra in our pockets.

Enterprise_1701C wrote: »

I will never stop believing in my country, and I will never allow it to be destroyed if it is within my power to prevent it. From my point of view staying within the protectionist area that is the political union of the eu is the wrong thing for my country, and would destroy it, it would become just another state.

Making decisions based on high emotions generally have the opposite effect and end up destroying what you love. So thanks for that.

Tromking

Enterprise_1701C wrote: »

I will never stop believing in my country, and I will never allow it to be destroyed if it is within my power to prevent it. From my point of view staying within the protectionist area that is the political union of the eu is the wrong thing for my country, and would destroy it, it would become just another state.

Well said.
If and when we leave, the argument going forward will be less about the economic benefits of re-joining the EU and more about the supranational entity the EU is destined to become.

cogito

phillw wrote: »

Reese Mogg and Farage are all on board that UK will be financially worse off after brexit, how come it's taking you so long to catch up?

Better off or worse off, it isn't about the money. How come it’s taking YOU so long to catch up?

phillw

cogito wrote: »

Better off or worse off, it isn't about the money. How come it’s taking YOU so long to catch up?

Sorry what are you talking about?

Someone mentioned the four reasons why people voted to leave the EU and the fee was one of them. I pointed out that it was a poor reason.

You seem to agree with me. Don't worry, we all understand the exact reason why YOU voted to leave.

Tromking wrote: »

Well said.
If and when we leave, the argument going forward will be less about the economic benefits of re-joining the EU and more about the supranational entity the EU is destined to become.

More project fear, when will you stop? Using base tribal instincts to manipulate people is abhorrent & will ruin this country.

kabayiri

I have 2 factors for choosing Leave.

One is a belief that we will not be able to spend enough on infrastructure and housing to meet the open-ended demand that a freedom like FOM dictates. This belief is based on seeing decades of under-investment, combined with the austerity situation we are in. For me, it's a logical reaction to kill off FOM.

Second is a belief that the EU is heading for much deeper problems, linked to the Euro, and also malcontent based on flawed refugee decisions, this malcontent pushing individual states/EU parliament to the right.

I prefer a risk-mitigation approach, which is to sit outside the EU. If the EU offered almost guaranteed success, then a successful nation like Norway would have signed up.

But...here's the key point.

Both the above rely on projections. I am entitled to interpret these as I see fit, and I do not have to apologize to anybody for my resulting vote. Until as such time voting is made illegal, I will continue to make my own decision.