If there is a second referendum ...

Herzlos

lisyloo wrote: »

I'm torn on it, but why is it not acceptable for people to change their mind?


BTW - I don't know anyone that's changed their mind. Does anyone know anyone who has?

Pennywise wrote: »

But equally, some who voted remain last time may have joined the workforce, got married, moved, etc., and may not vote to leave given more worldly experience.

Some who didn't vote last time, may not vote to leave - not all non-voters were remainers.

Indeed, it could have changed in either direction. There's only one way to find out how the public would vote in 2019...

lisyloo

Approximately 600,000 people die a year, predominantly the elderly (who were the only group to vote a majority leave). 2 years time passing means 1.2m people have died

That may be true, but many of those in nursing homes or housebound would not have voted.
We have serveral elderly in our family (one of whom did die) and none of whom went out to vote.


Obviously many elderly did vote, but I'm saying that for those closest to death were statistically less likely to vote.


Oddly enought you are still eligible to vote if you lose mental capacity.

Herzlos

Also true, but presumably some number of people are moving from voting to being too infirm to vote?

lisyloo

Herzlos wrote: »

Also true, but presumably some number of people are moving from voting to being too infirm to vote?

Yes, I accept that point.


So what were saying I think is that demographically the electorate has become more remain?

ukcarper

Herzlos wrote: »

Ukcarper mentions that he was a remainer who changed his mind after the EUs behaviour, often enough to make me suspicious.

Personally I know a few leaves who regret it, including one who admits it was a terrible idea but wouldn't change his vote because that'd be hypocritical. He's happy for the UK to revert to the stone age to get away from the EU, though.

I don't know any remainers who have changed their minds.

I have not said I've changed my mind I've said I would seek reassurances on certain conditions, my opinion of EU is certainly lower than it was before negotiations started.

lisyloo

my opinion of EU is certainly lower than it was before negotiations started

I'm a remainer and I too have become more euro-sceptic, but I haven't changed my mind that we are better off being in.


If anyone is assuming remainer love the EU then that is incorrect, it's just considering on balance what is best.

System

Herzlos wrote: »

Approximately 600,000 people die a year, predominantly the elderly (who were the only group to vote a majority leave). 2 years time passing means 1.2m people have died (something like 800,000 leavers), and in that same time a broadly similar number of 16 & 17 year olds (predominantly remainers) have become old enough to vote.

.

You are looking at the two ends of the chain, but not at all the links in between.


1.2m people have died, but 1.2m have stopped being 21 and become 23, or were 29 but are now 31. Also 1.2m people who were nearly old, but not quite Leave voters, have now shuffled into their predecessors' slippers and therefore become Leavers in their turn.


If the theory holds true that old people are Leavers and young are Remainers, then there must be a progression in between. Or do you think there is a threshold, at 45 perhaps, where everyone suddenly switches their views?

kabayiri

lisyloo wrote: »

I'm a remainer and I too have become more euro-sceptic, but I haven't changed my mind that we are better off being in.


If anyone is assuming remainer love the EU then that is incorrect, it's just considering on balance what is best.

I suspect for many of the lower income groups, the fundamentals have not changed at all.

Brexit must seem like a weird sideshow if you are struggling with agency work.

Having said that, fear is one of the biggest influences on people.

Fear of what the EU could do might just persuade people to stay within the club.

kabayiri

Clifford_Pope wrote: »

...

If the theory holds true that old people are Leavers and young are Remainers, then there must be a progression in between. Or do you think there is a threshold, at 45 perhaps, where everyone suddenly switches their views?

IMO, if you accept a referendum, then you accept the limitations it brings.

This includes voter apathy, or changing demographics.

It's a risky strategy to play on this elderly gammon concept though. I was always brought up to respect my elders, and I dislike anything which divides young/old.

Moby

A_Pandiculation wrote: »

Delivering Brexit is potentially extremely easy. We say we are going (did that bit) then we should have said something like " Okay, two years & we're off. You have two years to decide whether or not you want to carry on with mutual trade and if you do, how much in the way of obstacles you want. We are preparing for a WTO Brexit."

That would have saved us from most of the nonsense we've seen on all sides for these past two years and already the UK would know it's future with far more certainty that we do now.
Therefore it's fairly obvious that it's only the underhanded attempts to keep us in the EU that have led to uncertainty.

Complete unicorn thinking as usual. No-one with sense takes a knife to a gun fight.