Outfox The Market Direct Debit changes

editor1

@camalot1971,
I'm aware anyone on FB can post anything they like, that said, given the detail of the Company Structure, OFTM being one of numerous registered businesses, information from the Leicester Mercury on the family that runs OFTM and that fact that no doubt a number of employees are somewhat alarmed at increased workload and some dubious business practices, I'd not be surprised in Leicester if somebody was leaking confidential business details, the City after all still has a load of Pubs and persons still go out - so difficult to keep a lid on some facts. Still, each to their own.

paters

Anthorn wrote: »

It is actually very easy to see exactly what OFTM is doing. To recap, OFTM customers will pay more in Winter when their bills are higher and less in summer when their bills are lower. That's prepaying energy along the lines of Powershop whose customers buy their energy in advance. Perhaps the only thing missing with OFTM is the discount Powershop customers get if they buy more energy.

It's distinct from for example EDF which uses meter readings to forecast energy usage over the next 12 months and then divides the total by 12 to calculate the monthly DD under their budget scheme. That's the scheme I'm on with the EDF Easy Online Dec 2019 fix.

You're missing the point. The reason people think OTM are in financial trouble is because of how poorly they've handled this situation. The whole thing (multiple price rises, DD changes, overstating EAC) reeks of desperation.



Think about it, if OTM were genuinely concerned about balancing customers' usage / payments, then surely they would have introduce these changes back in the summer... They would have automatically refunded excess credit balances instead of introducing dubious restrictions on refunds... They would have looked at customer's actual usage instead of an arbitrary 70/30 split...

paters

editor1 wrote: »

@camalot1971,
I'm aware anyone on FB can post anything they like, that said, given the detail of the Company Structure, OFTM being one of numerous registered businesses, information from the Leicester Mercury on the family that runs OFTM and that fact that no doubt a number of employees are somewhat alarmed at increased workload and some dubious business practices, I'd not be surprised in Leicester if somebody was leaking confidential business details, the City after all still has a load of Pubs and persons still go out - so difficult to keep a lid on some facts. Still, each to their own.

So it's not just what some random person on Facebook says. It's what some random person on Facebook says some random person down the pub says.:rotfl:

[Deleted User]

Dear Colleagues,
Just to keep you informed and in case it might help those of you with a similar problem on this forum, here is the copy of an email, which I sent off today. After not receiving any emails replying to my complaints and queries from Outfox The Market, I cancelled my Direct Debit. I received an email this morning, and, for your information, here is my reply...

---

Dear Customer Services Manager,
Outfox The Market,
Dear Sir or Madam,
Account Number:
The reason I stopped my direct debit and decided to switch to another provider, is because you arbitrarily increased my direct debit, and changed the arrangements, without consulting me, or even giving me adequate notice to complain; you didn't even bother to answer my 3 emails of complaint, and I was unable to fulfil your instructions regarding taking photos of reading my meter, due to my being 73 years of age, with poor balance, and being frightened to go up a stepladder without using my hands as I would have to hold the camera. I didn't even have the opportunity of explaining to you that I was partially deaf and that another reason for joining your company was not only the price of the energy, which was the cheapest in the market at the time I joined you in October, but because our communications would be online and by email. As I have also discovered, you have not used your secure email system via your website, to keep me informed, but you have written to me via insecure email enclosing more than enough of my bank account details, which you are supposed to keep private; and which is very much against the law and practices recommended by the Data Commissioner. I find it remarkable that as soon as you discover that my direct debit has been stopped, you contact me so quickly and in such a manner, so much for customer care.

I have today, Saturday, 8th December 2018 submitted my electricity and gas readings to your website, as per what is left of our contract. I see that they have been accepted, but just to reiterate what they are for your information, I enclose them again here.
Electricity: 7715
Gas: 19024.
I have also submitted these same readings to my new provider, so that there can be no dispute. If you wish, you are always welcome to come and read the meter and check the accuracy for yourself...as long as it is at your expense and not mine. If you require any further readings please ask, and I will gladly comply.
Regarding payment. If you give me a breakdown of my final bill via the website or by email, and which is accurate, then I will pay you immediately by debit card over the phone, if it happens that you owe me any money, then I will be willing to reinstitute the direct debit to facilitate payment, providing that you gaurantee me, in writing that you will only charge me for the amount owed. I will NOT be renewing the direct debit instruction at the present time, because I don't trust your company, and from what I have gathered from other consumers of yours, I am very concerned that you will overcharge me for the energy I have used.
Yours sincerely,

[Deleted User]

They aren't doing so well on Trustpilot now...down to 3 stars, lots of criticism. I suppose they can't keep up with the bad reviews.
Very sad. All those dreams of entrepreneurship, and using the state and consumers to minimise their risk, through limited companies, subsidies and customer protection lying in the hands of OFGEM, has come to no avail. One still needs business knowledge, marketing and selling strategies, how to deal with customers and a number of different aspects of English law if one is to be successful. Still, if they do go down the pan, it might be bad news for us lame ducks, the customers and tax payers and energy users, who have to pay for it all, through a levy on the industry; but for them...well at least they have been subsidised and mollycoddled by the Conservative government, to try and perpetuate the myth that capitalism is the best social and economic system that there is, like sliced bread.

I always thought that Adam Smith was about the advantages of free enterprise, of competition and opportunity, and wise decision making and not about subsidising and granting money to ill educated capitalists, who only know one thing, how to avoid risk by putting it on others shoulders. Give me proper capitalism any time, red in tooth and claw....:beer:

ATB
Dougie.

RS2OOO

Your email isn't dissimilar to my final email which reads:

Dear Sir / Madam,

Further to my email below, as no response has been forthcoming within the 3.5 Weeks since making a written complaint and no acknowledgement being received within the specified timeframe outlined in the email below, I hereby give notice that I am changing my gas and electricity supply to an alternative supplier and will be cancelling the Direct Debit Mandate you recently set up in my name under the Direct Debit Guarantee.

As your live chat is no longer available, your phone lines constantly engaged and your failure to respond to emails, I request that you contact me within 5 days of any outstanding balance being due from me following my switch to a new provider for which I will make full payment by Debit Card over the phone or via a single lump sum Direct Debit or Standing Order.

Kind regards,

System

DouglasRankine wrote: »

Dear Colleagues,
Just to keep you informed and in case it might help those of you with a similar problem on this forum, here is the copy of an email, which I sent off today. After not receiving any emails replying to my complaints and queries from Outfox The Market, I cancelled my Direct Debit. I received an email this morning, and, for your information, here is my reply...

---

Dear Customer Services Manager,
Outfox The Market,
Dear Sir or Madam,
Account Number:
The reason I stopped my direct debit and decided to switch to another provider, is because you arbitrarily increased my direct debit, and changed the arrangements, without consulting me, or even giving me adequate notice to complain; you didn't even bother to answer my 3 emails of complaint, and I was unable to fulfil your instructions regarding taking photos of reading my meter, due to my being 73 years of age, with poor balance, and being frightened to go up a stepladder without using my hands as I would have to hold the camera. I didn't even have the opportunity of explaining to you that I was partially deaf and that another reason for joining your company was not only the price of the energy, which was the cheapest in the market at the time I joined you in October, but because our communications would be online and by email. As I have also discovered, you have not used your secure email system via your website, to keep me informed, but you have written to me via insecure email enclosing more than enough of my bank account details, which you are supposed to keep private; and which is very much against the law and practices recommended by the Data Commissioner. I find it remarkable that as soon as you discover that my direct debit has been stopped, you contact me so quickly and in such a manner, so much for customer care.

I have today, Saturday, 8th December 2018 submitted my electricity and gas readings to your website, as per what is left of our contract. I see that they have been accepted, but just to reiterate what they are for your information, I enclose them again here.
Electricity: 7715
Gas: 19024.
I have also submitted these same readings to my new provider, so that there can be no dispute. If you wish, you are always welcome to come and read the meter and check the accuracy for yourself...as long as it is at your expense and not mine. If you require any further readings please ask, and I will gladly comply.
Regarding payment. If you give me a breakdown of my final bill via the website or by email, and which is accurate, then I will pay you immediately by debit card over the phone, if it happens that you owe me any money, then I will be willing to reinstitute the direct debit to facilitate payment, providing that you gaurantee me, in writing that you will only charge me for the amount owed. I will NOT be renewing the direct debit instruction at the present time, because I don't trust your company, and from what I have gathered from other consumers of yours, I am very concerned that you will overcharge me for the energy I have used.
Yours sincerely,

OFTM is required to ignore any meter readings that you have provided for final billing. Your new supplier will pass them industry-verified meter readings to close your account with OFTM. Both suppliers are required to use these readings which may be different from the ones that you provided.

https://octopus.energy/blog/secret-life-opening-meter-reading/

[Deleted User]

Dear RS2000,
Yes...I learned from your contribution and adapted it to fit my own circumstances...For which I credit you and thank you very much....Isn't it nice how we can learn from each others experiences on this forum, and help the individual to face up to the "Big Yins" in society, who know little but methods for conning people out of their hard earned money and pensions:beer:
ATB
Dougie.

bye_bye_band_G

Hengus wrote: »

OFTM is required to ignore any meter readings that you have provided for final billing. Your new supplier will pass them industry-verified meter readings to close your account with OFTM. Both suppliers are required to use these readings which may be different from the ones that you provided.

https://octopus.energy/blog/secret-life-opening-meter-reading/

This is an interesting read. When I moved to OTM, my previous supplier (Solarplicity) charged me for 2cubic metres of gas BEYOND the opening reading OTM used on their first bill. So I did pay for the same energy twice.
It's about £1. I choose which battles to fight and this wasn't one of them. But how can it happen? I've heard of other cases where it's happened too, from family members.
Why isn't there a watertight system to stop this double charging?

VoucherMan

Hengus wrote: »

OFTM is required to ignore any meter readings that you have provided for final billing. Your new supplier will pass them industry-verified meter readings to close your account with OFTM. Both suppliers are required to use these readings which may be different from the ones that you provided.

https://octopus.energy/blog/secret-life-opening-meter-reading/

Interesting, and a refreshing change to see it described in a way the average user can (hopefully) understand instead of the usual 'industry speak'.

Hopefully OFTM have at least been honest with the figures they've been submitting.