VCS Ltd PCN 'Fines' / BW Legal

rvp1983

Hi,

I'm sorry for starting up a new thread on this, but the keeper in question is panicking. The keeper received 4 PCNs last year (between July and December) from Vehicle Control Services Ltd (member of IPC) for parking in a private car park without paying & displaying. The 'fine' for each one was £100, but a friend of the keeper who is 'in the know' about these things told the driver to ignore them, as the driver is not at liberty to pay them. So the keeper has been ignoring all correspondence from VCS Ltd. since then, until this morning, when the driver received a letter from them again stating that the case has been passed on to BW Legal to recover the outstanding debt. There is an actual letter from BW Legal too attached, which states that the driver is to pay the full balance within 16 days or be faced with County Court proceedings.

The keeper read through the newbies' sticky, but still wasn't sure how to proceed with this.

Please can someone advise?

Thanks.

Dan

beamerguy

rvp1983 wrote: »

Hi,

I'm sorry for starting up a new thread on this, but I'm panicking here. I received 4 PCNs last year (between July and December) from Vehicle Control Services Ltd (member of IPC) for parking in a private car park without paying & displaying. The 'fine' for each one was £100, but a friend of mine who is 'in the know' about these things told me to ignore them, as I'm not at liberty to pay them. So I have been ignoring all correspondence from VCS Ltd. since then, until this morning, where I received a letter from them again stating that the case has been passed on to BW Legal to recover the outstanding debt. There is an actual letter from BW Legal too attached, which states that I am to pay the full balance within 16 days or be faced with County Court proceedings.

I read through the newbies' sticky, but still wasn't sure how to proceed with this.

Please can someone advise?

Thanks.

Dan

Hey, that's a laugh "your friend is the know"
Thanks to their very bad advice, you are in this position today

BWLegal will take you to court but they often fail through
incompetence

Why did you not pay in the car park

Read this thread ....

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5672664

rvp1983

Thanks for getting back to me. The keeper didn't pay the fines initially, because the keeper's friend told the keeper they're not actually fines 'cos they're from a private company, and that they're merely invoices for payment. So he told the driver to ignore them.

Does the keeper need to write back to BW Legal to appeal it?

Umkomaas

Please can someone advise?

What does your friend 'in the know' have to say?

Were there reasons why the P&D tickets weren't purchased?

VCS are litigious and with £400 worth of tickets, there's a greater chance that this will go to the small claims court (SCC). There's nothing to 'panic' about, the SCC is not a criminal court, no wigs, gowns or criminal sentences. It is merely you and them (or their rep) sitting down around a table with a judge in civvies, discussing who owes who what (or not).

This needs to be dealt with with a clear head, methodically and without panic.

Is the BWL letter headed 'Letter Before Claim' (or similar)?

To whom is the letter asking you to pay the charges?

Is the letter concerning all four PCNs, or just one?

beamerguy

rvp1983 wrote: »

Thanks for getting back to me. I didn't pay the fines initially, because my friend told me they're not actually fines 'cos they're from a private company, and that they're merely invoices for payment. So he told me to ignore them. :-(

Do I need to write back to BW Legal to appeal it?

The question is ... why did you not pay in the car park, not about
paying the tickets. What did the signs say, were they clear
as to what you had to do ?

Your friend is right, these are not fines, the parking company
cannot issue fines and they are only invoices

The more information you can give this forum the easier
it will be to help you.

Best tell your friend he is wrong before he lumbers others
with this problem

rvp1983

It's addressed to the keeper, but says 'dear sir/madam' in the letter itself. The title at the top just says 'your account has been passed to our legal team'. And yes, it's concerning all 4 PCNs.

The letter states:

Dear Sir/Madam. As you have failed to make arrangements to pay your account balance, it has now been sent to BW Legal, who are our approved legal service provider. They will contact you regarding payment of the outstanding balance and associated costs of £120.00. All future contact and correspondence relating to this debt should now be referred to them with immediate effect. You must call them on 0113 323 4485 - they'll be able to help you.

As for the keeper's friend, he used to be an ex-colleague, and the keeper is no longer in touch with him! The P&D was not paid for upon taking his advice (he said there's no point paying the P&D) - foolish of the keeper really. On each occasion the car park was used, the car was there for no longer than 10/15 minutes.

Umkomaas

Who are they asking you to pay? Please answer all questions - it saves having to repeat them. We don't ask for no reason!

rvp1983

Please see my post edited above. I assume they're asking the driver to pay, considering the letter is addressed to the driver.

rvp1983

beamerguy wrote: »

The question is ... why did you not pay in the car park, not about
paying the tickets. What did the signs say, were they clear
as to what you had to do ?

The signs simply said that a P&D ticket must be purchased in order to park here, and the signage was displayed adequately at the pay terminal according to the driver (though the driver is not sure if there was any other signage across the car park though).

Umkomaas

This looks to be at a debt collecting stage rather than a formal Letter Before County Court Claim (LBCCC). Unless or until it becomes a formal LBCCC there's nothing much you can do with it to change the course of events - other than to pay them (which no one here would recommend).

It's more than likely that this will become a small claim at the county court, so as and when (or if) you get a formal LBCCC (or real court papers) come back for more advice, as this can be defended. But in the meantime don't just put your head in the sand and hope nothing will happen, please do the following:

1. Urgently go and take photos of the signage on site, especially at the entrance (even if no sign at the entrance, take photos), also if signs are obscured by trees, the general positioning of signs around the car park, some photos which clearly show the wording of what the signs say, as well as what's said on the actual P&D machine.

Sketch out a rough 'map' of the car park and mark where signs and P&D machines are located. Keep that for reference.

You will likely draw heavily on the map and signage and what it says in any defence of a court claim.

2. Read the NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #4 about dealing with debt collectors - the stage you seem to be at currently.

3. Read the NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #2 which details how to deal with a small claims court claim - the more you are prepared for this in advance, the better you will handle it and the more likely you are to succeed.

I'm afraid your friend 'in the know' has caused you considerable work and anxiety; he may well have caused you significant costs - you won't be able to avoid the former, but we will try to help you with the latter.

rvp1983

Umkomaas wrote: »

Sketch out a rough 'map' of the car park and mark where signs and P&D machines are located. Keep that for reference.

You will likely draw heavily on the map and signage and what it says in any defence of a court claim.

The keeper has already got a map of the car park, which was found online. There are three pay terminals in the car park, each with clear signage stating that a P&D ticket must be purchased in order to park there. The is a sign at the entrance saying that it is a private P&D car park.

On what grounds (if any) could the keeper appeal if/when the LBCCC comes through?

Thanks!