Land Registry questions

SallyCinnamon

Hi Land Registry, 

We are purchasing a property that has two entries with the LR, one is called "address of property" and the other is called "Land associated with address of property". I've downloaded both plans and registers and they are identical. They both have the same reference number (which I suppose accounts for them being the same  ). I'm not sure what to make of this.

The title plan is the land we expected to see, but the previous owner had put her physical boundary (fence) inside the area which is covered by the title, and we understand that a third party may have undertaken some maintenance on the land between the physical boundary and the public pavement so I want to be clear about ownership. I'm concerned that maybe the papers under "Land associated with address of property" have been incorrectly uploaded and there should actually be another title number and owner shown for some of the land - either through a sale or claim of adverse possession. I have mentioned to our solicitor who will raise with the sellers solicitors, but I wanted to check if you had any thoughts on the dual title entries? It's a probate sale, so entirely possible that the sellers won't be able to offer much information.

Many thanks

Land_Registry

SallyCinnamon said:

Hi Land Registry, 

We are purchasing a property that has two entries with the LR, one is called "address of property" and the other is called "Land associated with address of property". I've downloaded both plans and registers and they are identical. They both have the same reference number (which I suppose accounts for them being the same  ). I'm not sure what to make of this.

The title plan is the land we expected to see, but the previous owner had put her physical boundary (fence) inside the area which is covered by the title, and we understand that a third party may have undertaken some maintenance on the land between the physical boundary and the public pavement so I want to be clear about ownership. I'm concerned that maybe the papers under "Land associated with address of property" have been incorrectly uploaded and there should actually be another title number and owner shown for some of the land - either through a sale or claim of adverse possession. I have mentioned to our solicitor who will raise with the sellers solicitors, but I wanted to check if you had any thoughts on the dual title entries? It's a probate sale, so entirely possible that the sellers won't be able to offer much information.

Many thanks

Not really other than for whatever reason the 2 descriptions exist but there’s only a single title.
What the land/property is called is less important here than what’s actually included in the registered title  

Nothing untoward providing you are buying what’s within the red outline and any issues should be raised with the seller, as you have done. 

SallyCinnamon

Land_Registry said:

SallyCinnamon said:

Hi Land Registry, 

We are purchasing a property that has two entries with the LR, one is called "address of property" and the other is called "Land associated with address of property". I've downloaded both plans and registers and they are identical. They both have the same reference number (which I suppose accounts for them being the same  ). I'm not sure what to make of this.

The title plan is the land we expected to see, but the previous owner had put her physical boundary (fence) inside the area which is covered by the title, and we understand that a third party may have undertaken some maintenance on the land between the physical boundary and the public pavement so I want to be clear about ownership. I'm concerned that maybe the papers under "Land associated with address of property" have been incorrectly uploaded and there should actually be another title number and owner shown for some of the land - either through a sale or claim of adverse possession. I have mentioned to our solicitor who will raise with the sellers solicitors, but I wanted to check if you had any thoughts on the dual title entries? It's a probate sale, so entirely possible that the sellers won't be able to offer much information.

Many thanks

Not really other than for whatever reason the 2 descriptions exist but there’s only a single title.
What the land/property is called is less important here than what’s actually included in the registered title  

Nothing untoward providing you are buying what’s within the red outline and any issues should be raised with the seller, as you have done. 

Thank you, that makes me feel better. Hopefully the solicitors can clarify it all. The red outline does cover the totality of what we were expecting to be included. Many thanks!

Jenbrowne

Land_Registry said:

Jenbrowne said:

Hi
Is it possible to have an update on expected timescales for our case?  Part of the property boundary is incorrect, I understand our case was expediated due to impending sale.  An Ordnance Survey surveyor visited the property yesterday - however no one is able to tell us how long this is expected to take.
HM Land Registry Reference : XA3BC1C
Title Number : LAN244764
Many thanks. 

The simple answer is that it will be processed ASAP but I’d expect a few weeks wait yet, at least. Why? Well your example is a quite common one re urgency/speed as it’s an application to register for the first time re a claimed ownership of unregistered land. 

There are 3 key stages re such applications 
1. Consideration if the statement of truth and supporting evidence - is that enough to satisfy the registration/legal requirements. 
2. Site visit/survey - only happens if stage 1 passed. OS do the survey - 2 weeks wait but can be sooner. They then report back on findings. 

3. Wider checks - if the survey report backs up the claim we will invariably contact adjoining land/property owners to see if any object/consent. Those checks take time to complete normally, minimum 3/4 weeks. 

So IF the survey was done yesterday I’d say you are looking at a minimum of 4/5 weeks still. But it could be longer depending on report/checks. So too soon to be definitive other than it’s not going to be 1/2 weeks wait still. 

The application has been expedited, so there’s an urgency involved, but expedition simply reduces the wait time at the very start from receipt to wait time. It does help re wait times between report in and checks started too but it doesn’t hurry up OS and/or anyone we contact re wider checks 
A conveyancer familiar with such applications/claims should have a feel for the above but most I suspect would not commit to any defined timescales until at least stage 3 when they’d have a better idea as Stages 1 and 2 have been reached 

Hi, thanks for your earlier. We are currently at stage 3 of the process now and our solicitor confirmed that the notice period ends today 14th April. This is the only outstanding item on our sale now. How long do you think it will take now the notice period is over?

Thanks!

Land_Registry

Jenbrowne said:

Hi, thanks for your earlier. We are currently at stage 3 of the process now and our solicitor confirmed that the notice period ends today 14th April. This is the only outstanding item on our sale now. How long do you think it will take now the notice period is over?

Thanks!

Hopefully not too long but it can’t be reconsidered until tomorrow at the very earliest. But based on current timescales I’d say at least a few days providing of course no replies received and nothing else to consider  

Dru84

Hi LR, I am trying to remortgage and do a transfer of equity (to my partner) of my home but we’re having trouble with a restriction on the deeds (BM295178).

My neighbour who was running the residents company had the LTD company dissolved 29 Dec 2020 (to which we agreed - not understanding this implication), since then the houses on the development have been paying for the gardener/upkeep of the shared area directly.

Said neighbour signed a “certificate of compliance” to say that these were the new arrangements and I was up to date with payments, but my solicitor’s “technical team” has said this was not acceptable. The solicitors say they approached the developer too with no luck.

Is there any way to get the transaction through under these circumstances?

If not, what would the quickest approach be? Resurrect the residents company, then to re-issue a Cert of Compliance, or to apply to cancel/remove (not sure correct terminology) the restriction itself?

We’ve been stuck on the lenders higher rate of circa 4% for some time so looking for whatever gets us across the line soonest.

Many thanks, Dru

Land_Registry

Dru84 said:

Hi LR, I am trying to remortgage and do a transfer of equity (to my partner) of my home but we’re having trouble with a restriction on the deeds (BM295178).

Is there any way to get the transaction through under these circumstances?

If not, what would the quickest approach be? Resurrect the residents company, then to re-issue a Cert of Compliance, or to apply to cancel/remove (not sure correct terminology) the restriction itself?

We’ve been stuck on the lenders higher rate of circa 4% for some time so looking for whatever gets us across the line soonest.

Many thanks, Dru

Have a read of PG 35 section 7.7 first 
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/corporate-insolvency/practice-guide-35-corporate-insolvency#restrictions-favour-dissolved
Resurrecting the company is an option to be considered especially if you/you all want to cancel the restriction on each title. Without the company cancellation/withdrawal is unlikely 
Cancel is where some9 e other than the restrictioner applies to remove it. Withdrawal is where they do. 

MgComp

Hi LR!

We have rceently moved into a property, which we purchased. At the back of the garden, there is a parcel of land which we were told is unregistered, and each house along our street mantains their section in this strip of land themselves. We have a small fence around this section and we understand it has been maintained by our past property owners for at least 30+ years.

I understand that we could apply for adverse posession, and gain a posessory title. However, we really wanted to try and buy it if possible. I have phoned land registry and they have absolutely no record of the original owner, as it's unregistered land.

Is there any way at all we can go about buying it? If I could find the original paper title deeds in archives etc, how would we then go about buying it from there (since the original owner of the land is hugely likely to be deceased at this stage).

Thanks in advance!

Land_Registry

MgComp said:

Hi LR!

We have rceently moved into a property, which we purchased. At the back of the garden, there is a parcel of land which we were told is unregistered, and each house along our street mantains their section in this strip of land themselves. We have a small fence around this section and we understand it has been maintained by our past property owners for at least 30+ years.

I understand that we could apply for adverse posession, and gain a posessory title. However, we really wanted to try and buy it if possible. I have phoned land registry and they have absolutely no record of the original owner, as it's unregistered land.

Is there any way at all we can go about buying it? If I could find the original paper title deeds in archives etc, how would we then go about buying it from there (since the original owner of the land is hugely likely to be deceased at this stage).

Thanks in advance!

If you are able to identify who the legal owner is and they have died intestate then you would contact the Treasury solicitor re buying it. The land passes to the crown in such cases so research the term ‘bona vacantia’ 

harib0uk

Hi LR,

I'm trying to track down old deeds and old conveyances to my property, It's registered electronically, and the title deeds have some information about when the land was sold but not when the house was built and first sold.

I've read on the gov website that If the register refers to deeds being filed, you should have copies. - I have the Title regster which states:

Title Number : HP183677
This title is dealt with by HM Land Registry, Weymouth Office.
The following extract contains information taken from the register of the above title
number. A full copy of the register accompanies this document and you should read that
in order to be sure that these brief details are complete.
Neither this extract nor the full copy is an 'Official Copy' of the register. An
official copy of the register is admissible in evidence in a court to the same extent
as the original. A person is entitled to be indemnified by the registrar if he or she
suffers loss by reason of a mistake in an official copy.

I'd like to fill out an OC2 to request details and pay the appropriate fee, but I can't just request 'all'  So how do I find out what details LR hold (other than those reffered to in the title dead) in order to request them? I have contected LR via the website but unhelpfully its just come back to fill out the OC2 form.

thank you