Electric cars

Martyn1981

AdrianC wrote: »

US "Class 4" is what we call 7.5t.

There's at least two suppliers on the UK market already, both working off Isuzu chassis-cabs.
https://www.paneltex.co.uk/service/electric-vehicles/
https://tevva.com/tevva-e-trucks/

If you're after a large van, rather than a small truck, there's the Iveco Daily electric, going up to 5t, while Renault's Master ZE only offers 3.1t - even though the diesel versions of both go up to 7.5t on the same chassis sizes - so if it's the volume, rather than the payload (a diesel 7.5t like the Isuzu would have 4t+ payload, not 2.5t), there's another option. From the other direction, DAF's diesel LF range starts at 7.5t, but the electric is 19t.

Are any of those purpose built BEV's, or are all based off ICE chassis? I'm wondering particularly about the Tevva, which I know you said was an Isuzu chassis, but I thought they were Chinese.

But regardless, nice to see a purpose built BEV, and let's hope all the examples you give start to do some too.

AdrianC

Does it make a big difference if a truck chassis is bespoke? Trucks are big Meccano anyway. Truck frames are still fairly low-tech designs, simply because the basic concept isn't broken.

You're right - Tevva use a JAC-supplied chassis, not Isuzu. But the JAC/Qingling base is built under licence from Isuzu...

Martyn1981

AdrianC wrote: »

Does it make a big difference if a truck chassis is bespoke? Trucks are big Meccano anyway.

You're right - Tevva use a JAC-supplied chassis, not Isuzu. But the JAC/Qingling base is built under licence from Isuzu...

Cheers, so not bespoke BEV vehicles/chassis then, and presumably a higher floor, but they'll get there soon I'm sure.

AdrianC wrote: »

Truck frames are still fairly low-tech designs, simply because the basic concept isn't broken.

Absolutely, for ICE mechanicals they work fine.

AdrianC

Low floors are possible in diesel trucks - even with ICEs. Look at buses for how. They simply aren't needed, though. Given that you still need to use a taillift or forklift to get a pallet from ground level to a foot up, it might as well go four foot up.

Sure, you can redesign the chassis from ground zero for a small proportion of production - and make them much more expensive for little user benefit. Or you can get better adoption through greater commonality and lower unit costs.

Herzlos

AdrianC wrote: »

Low floors are possible in diesel trucks - even with ICEs. Look at buses for how. They simply aren't needed, though. Given that you still need to use a taillift or forklift to get a pallet from ground level to a foot up, it might as well go four foot up.

Sure, you can redesign the chassis from ground zero for a small proportion of production - and make them much more expensive for little user benefit. Or you can get better adoption through greater commonality and lower unit costs.

Much easier for stuff that's not on pallets though, and still much safer and quicker to be working at 1ft with a forklift than 4. Makes getting in and out easier too. Means lower loading bays.
Lower floor also potentially means lower roofs, so less bridge issues, lower loading bays and so on.

As someone who deals with a lot of non-palleted goods, usually on trailers, a lower floor is vastly better. 17" is brilliant.


Sure, bespoke is expensive, but we're talking about a BEV chassis here rather than a per-model chassis. Making a BEV chassis frees you from a lot of the restrictions from diesel chassis. You can put an electric motor and battery into anything but that only gives you half of the benefit.

Martyn1981

AdrianC wrote: »

Sure, you can redesign the chassis from ground zero for a small proportion of production - and make them much more expensive for little user benefit. Or you can get better adoption through greater commonality and lower unit costs.

Or build a better BEV by building a purpose built BEV, rather than one size fits nobody.

Don't want to end up with a modified ICE BEV, with a 2ton range extender, and a coal/wood cooker being towed behind ..... just for the sake of argument.

Martyn1981

AdrianC wrote: »

Low floors are possible in diesel trucks - even with ICEs. Look at buses for how. They simply aren't needed, though. Given that you still need to use a taillift or forklift to get a pallet from ground level to a foot up, it might as well go four foot up.

Some 'multi mile' deliveries may require pallets, and handforks and tailgates, but I'd suggest that's not what most people think of when talking about 'last mile' deliveries.

gfplux

gzoom wrote: »

The material cost to Tesla for making a SR versus SR+ is likely less than 4 figures, so a $2k price difference is a big margin to gain given the relative low cost of the car.

The SR+ car is not going to be cheap though when it arrives in the UK, easily over £40k with the mandated inclusion of AP.

Model 3 aside as a company Tesla's ability to introduce prompt software updates over the air is something unique in the car industry.

Unless your been living under a rock most people are now aware the recent spate of keyless entry relay thefts taking place. You can clearly disable keyless entry but as a feature its pretty useful, not having to faff with keys is a real convenience.

Some UK owners than tweeted Elon Musk about setting a 'pin to drive' option, were you still have keyless entry but need to tap in a pin code to actually drive. A few updates later and 'pin to drive' appeared as a option. However some one than noted if the key pad was always central people could guess the pin by persistent finger marks, so another software update later the key pad now appears at random positions on the touch screen.

Regardless of what you of Tesla I cannot think of another car company with this amount of flexibility interms of software design and updates in direct response to customer needs. And all Tesla's including all Model 3s get the same kind of updates .

That is extraordinarily clever and quick.
I am presently driving a petrol Jaguar E Pace. With the I Pace winning car of the year I can not imagine software upgrades of that kind coming down the pipe considering the relatively poor standard of IT available from Jaguar.
I live in Luxembourg and use an Android phone, Google at present has not bothered to release the Google Auto app for this market.

jk0

Anyone see this:


https://www.dw.com/en/ifo-study-casts-doubt-on-electric-vehicles-climate-saving-credentials/a-48460328

gfplux

AdrianC wrote: »

They did. "Plug-in hybrid".



Because all hybrids - "self-charging" and plug-in - are hybrids.
Not all hybrids are plug-in.



I suspect they were having people in the showroom looking at the non-plug-ins and asking where they plugged it in.
"Umm, you don't".
But it's a hybrid, and runs on electrickery?
"Umm, yes, but it makes it itself." <ping!>

When I discuss Electric and Hybrid cars with my wife she expresses the fear of running out of electricity and/or not finding a charging point.
By the way we live in Luxembourg where charging stations seem to be everywhere. We are also the type of household where I refuel both cars.
Inventions have to be marketed to suit the demand and to overcome prejudices . If the fear of running out of electricity can be reduced by using the term self charging hybrid then I have no problems with the term.