Family cant afford Christmas

whitewing

The people that I know who read those kind of stories are quite often people who have experienced something horrible in their own lives and are trying to make sense of it. Or people who work with sufferers of abuse and who are attempting to gain an understanding of why it happens and what helps overcome it. I have found some helpful in the past. (My husband hates me reading them as he finds it all depressing I don't know anyone who reads them purely for titillation).

missbiggles1

mumps wrote: »

No child in the UK is being bombed, I absolutely agree. Unfortunately there will be children in the UK who will go hungry and cold and some will be physically or sexually abused on Christmas Day. I don't think it helps to play top trumps, no child in the UK needs to have as little as children in some other countries or suffering abuse on Christmas, or any other day, but unfortunately some children will. It is sometimes hard to believe what a parent can inflict on a child.

It is hard for us to imagine why someone would get pleasure from beating their child, or raping their child or letting someone else rape their child. I think our minds protect us from the reality.

Absolutely awful but not relevant to the discussion as child abuse can't be helped by well meaning strangers throwing a few quid at the problem. On the other hand, a few pounds can be crucial to someone starving or homeless.

I pay taxes (and would happily pay quite a lot more) to fund benefits, Social Services, the police etc - when I give to charity I'd rather give where the need is greater and unfunded from tax.

These are choices we all have to make and I make mine based on need.

fierystormcloud

mumps wrote: »

No child in the UK is being bombed, I absolutely agree. Unfortunately there will be children in the UK who will go hungry and cold and some will be physically or sexually abused on Christmas Day. I don't think it helps to play top trumps, no child in the UK needs to have as little as children in some other countries or suffering abuse on Christmas, or any other day, but unfortunately some children will. It is sometimes hard to believe what a parent can inflict on a child.

It is hard for us to imagine why someone would get pleasure from beating their child, or raping their child or letting someone else rape their child. I think our minds protect us from the reality.

Quizzical_Squirrel wrote: »

Joe Public finds it hard to imagine but Joe Public loves reading about it.

Put that child beating in a newspaper or write all the lurid child rape details in a book and the nation will beat a path to the author's bank account.

It's just a different type of titillation.
Hard to claim the moral high ground either way.

Speak for yourself Quizzical Squirrel. :eek:

I certainly have no desire whatsoever to 'rush to read' something like this. And I am sure many others will say the same.

Person_one

missbiggles1 wrote: »

Absolutely awful but not relevant to the discussion as child abuse can't be helped by well meaning strangers throwing a few quid at the problem.

Neglect and emotional abuse can, it doesn't solve the problem but kindness from a stranger can definitely help that child there and then and in a way that resonates into their future.

Person_one

Quizzical_Squirrel wrote: »

Joe Public finds it hard to imagine but Joe Public loves reading about it.

Put that child beating in a newspaper or write all the lurid child rape details in a book and the nation will beat a path to the author's bank account.

It's just a different type of titillation.
Hard to claim the moral high ground either way.

I'm not sure at all what you mean by 'either way' here...

Cloudydaze

Person_one wrote: »

Neglect and emotional abuse can, it doesn't solve the problem but kindness from a stranger can definitely help that child there and then and in a way that resonates into their future.

The unspeakable truth is that the child in this type of family is probably well on its way to becoming a chip off the old block. The neglect and emotional abuse will rob them of any childhood innocence from an early age.

I doubt very much that they will hold a special place in their hearts for the kind stranger who gave them a bobble hat and a selection box.

The real tradegy isn't that people aren't prepared to help these children, the tradegy is that they can't.

mumps

missbiggles1 wrote: »

Absolutely awful but not relevant to the discussion as child abuse can't be helped by well meaning strangers throwing a few quid at the problem. On the other hand, a few pounds can be crucial to someone starving or homeless.

I pay taxes (and would happily pay quite a lot more) to fund benefits, Social Services, the police etc - when I give to charity I'd rather give where the need is greater and unfunded from tax.

These are choices we all have to make and I make mine based on need.

Well we see it differently, I think the child who has nothing to eat and is cold and dirty because mum and dad are drunk or high does need help and I think someone can make a difference. I don't think it helps to tell a child in that situation that it would be worse if they were in Syria (you can use any example).

I generally give to Save the Children but am increasingly giving to MSF because I met someone who works for them and was very impressed. I still like to help kids in the UK, I don't think it has to be either or. Children in the UK do suffer malnutrition and some starve.

Person_one

Cloudydaze wrote: »

The unspeakable truth is that the child in this type of family is probably well on its way to becoming a chip off the old block. The neglect and emotional abuse will rob them of any childhood innocence from an early age.

I doubt very much that they will hold a special place in their hearts for the kind stranger who gave them a bobble hat and a selection box.

The real tradegy isn't that people aren't prepared to help these children, the tradegy is that they can't.

You'll just have to trust me, kindness and help from outsiders can and does make a difference to children growing up neglected by their dysfunctional parents.

I don't wish to make it sound like I think everybody should be out looking for waifs and strays to take under their wing. In an ideal world every parent would love their children and treat them well, and in a slightly less ideal world the people who run the country would fund things like social work, and health visiting, and pastoral care in schools, and parenting support, and SureStart centres and the like properly so that no unloved or neglected or abused children slip through the cracks and that they are still valued as members of our society.

However, in a less than perfect world, while nobody can go around solving all the social problems of the entire country, its just not true to say there's no point demonstrating kindness to children with crap parents. If you find yourself in that sort of situation then there is a point, you may have a positive impact that they remember all their life.

enthusiasticsaver

Poor_Single_lady wrote: »

But if you haven't gone without money then you're not in a position to judge whether love is enough.

If your kids have plenty you are very lucky. Poor kids know they are poor and I imagine that rich kids know they are rich. Not being one I can't judge.

Imagine children going to school knowing that they are poor. Then on Christmas morning no presents. Then they go to school and everyone is talking about what they got.
Imagine being a parent and not being able to provide. Imagine how gut wrenching that would be.

It must be lovely to have so much but please understand choosing not to spoil your children is completely separate from being in a position where your kids have very little and you can not afford to provide them with basic Christmas gifts.

I think you are projecting a bit here. Children who come from less well off families know that as they will have seen their parents struggle all the time not just xmas. It is not cruel to teach them that some people are richer than others. Comparing xmas gifts is the tip of the iceberg. School trips, birthday parties, holidays are all ways kids can compare their situations.

I don't think kids weigh up the cost of their Christmas gifts against others or certainly mine didn't. They received presents we could afford and had budgeted for throughout the year when we had a very limited income. Now adults they recall family games, all getting together etc and not the material gifts which I think is the real point of Christmas.

I think the crux of the matter is should you buy expensive gifts for children when you can't afford it so they are not unhappy comparing their lot with kids with better off parents. Keeping up with the Joneses is something we actively discouraged as it just sets kids up for a lifetime of disappointment. There will always be people in a better position. That is real life.

enthusiasticsaver

Lunar_Eclipse wrote: »

I am well aware how fortunate I am and realise there is a huge difference between having and not having a choice. BUT I also know that loving parents who genuinely care are the most valuable thing you can give children by a mile; nothing else comes close, despite how poor or rich one is. Children will rarely realise this at a young age, so yes, there may be comparative playground politics (they exist regardless of wealth!) but it's a rare adult who doesn't appreciate their solid foundation once they get there.

Apart from the mega wealthy, everyone makes choices which are capped financially. And kids rarely have an idea about family finances - eg those raised on benefits asking for a TV or games console, my own children thinking an iPhone 7 would send us into debt. We are the adults; it's important for us to act responsibly and install values in our kids, which is why we buy pjs from Primark etc. I know this is different from them not having a single pair of cheap shoes that fit or a winter coat, but I'm always amazed by how many on this website alone buy their children expensive gifts at Christmas whilst working a minimum wage job - I have no idea how they can actually afford it.

I totally agree. The best life lesson we can give our kids is to spend within income. I cannot believe the number of people already in debt or who will go into debt who continue to spend regardless of cost on xmas presents. It is the parents job to teach kids money does not grow on trees and things have to be earned.