Debit Card Transactions

Melindray

Hello MSE people!

Apologies if this has been asked before but if the answer is here somewhere I have totally failed to find it!

Bit long and complex, but here goes ...

Morrisons online delivery service recently changed the way they take payments*. They are now "reserving" the estimated total cost of an order, with £2.00 added to it, when an order is placed.

After this, they then calculate the actual final cost of an order and debit the customer for this when the order is delivered.

I am being told by Morrisons that the final cost of an order is "taken" from the amount that was previously "reserved" and then the change, assuming the estimate is larger than the actual cost, is returned to me.

I have placed two orders with Morrisons since this change in payment process began, and this is not how the payment process is working in my bank account. At my end of things, Morrisons are "reserving" the estimated total cost of my order and this becomes a 'pending transaction' on my account. When my order is delivered, a second transaction then appears for the final cost of my order; this isn't left as a 'pending transaction', it seems to be claimed immediately and then appears on my bank statement as having been debited. (Spoken to my bank, and as far as they can tell, this is what is happening.)

Meanwhile, I am left with a 'pending transaction' for the full estimated cost of my order which is, eventually, returned to me. For example, most recently, my estimated order cost was £84.16, Morrisons then added £2.00 to this and "reserved" £86.16 which became a 'pending transaction' ... the following day my order was delivered and the final cost of the order was £84.11, this came out of my account almost immediately ... but I didn't get my £86.16 back until a week later.

Obviously, this has given me some problems with budgeting: it means that I must have two large lumps sums of money available to cover both the estimated order cost transaction which is left pending, and the final order cost which is actually debited to my account. How am I supposed to pay other bills while I wait for the full estimated cost of a Morrisons order to be returned to me?

Morrisons are insisting that they "reserve" the estimated order cost, and then the final order cost is debited from this "reserved" amount. I am being told by Morrisons that, and I quote: "I can certainly reassure you that for the vast majority of orders through Morrisons, we do take the final amount from within that authorised amount".

Morrisons are also insisting that responsibility somehow lies with my bank for this problem ... I am being told that maybe my bank works differently to other banks by Morrisons, which just seems to be a rather pathetic excuse from them ... I don't believe responsibility does lie with my bank ... my bank can't be all that different to all the other banks, and it isn't my bank that have changed anything, it is Morrisons who have changed their payments process and that is when the problem began. I am curious to know other people's opinions on where responsibility for this problem lies, so please do comment on this if you are inclined.


TLDR version: My question is this; can a debit card transaction be edited and the amount changed after the transaction has been authorised and becomes a 'pending transaction'? If it is possible to edit a 'pending transaction' amount on a debit card payment, does the ability to do this depend upon which bank the card issuer is?


*They just-so-happened to make this change right in the middle of an offer to collect extra loyalty points too!

Nebulous2

It happens with pay at the pump card transactions. Some of them reserve £99 which drops off a few days later and then deduct the full cost of the petrol after it has been dispensed.

It isn't so much a matter of blame, as a quirk of the system. I'd say the explanation you have received from Morrison's is wrong.

The answer is to either:

Shop elsewhere which doesn't behave that way

Or have enough money or credit to cover it.

Personally I use a cash back credit card with a credit limit in the thousands. So an extra £99 being reserved doesn't matter. It never gets collected and I have the limit to cover it.

King_Of_Fools

Morrisons are telling you what should happen but in my experience it depends on a number of factors (bank, store, etc.) and varies from transaction to transaction.

There is probably nothing you can do about it and the best advise would be to get a credit card and use this to shop. As Nebulous2 said, on a credit card the available credit will reduce just like the available balance in your bank account but as it is not your money it will not affect the amount of money you have available to withdraw from you bank account.

peap

Why don't you use a credit card? Then you won't have to pay the full balance until a month later anyway.

Melindray

Thanks for the replies people, appreciated.

I cannot get a credit card.

My income is low and fixed, and my disability means that I would have difficulty keeping track of things which would then result in me getting into financial difficulties. I can't take the risk of that happening and the risk of me ending up in serious trouble. I also don't really want a credit card because I know if things go wrong and I mess up, I would not be able to cope with the stress.

I also know that if I apply for a credit card and I am turned down, this will impact my credit rating negatively. My credit rating is currently pretty good and I don't really want to risk losing that by having credit card applications turned down.

I already have a debit card, and I should be able to use this to pay. I had been using said debit card on the Morrisons site for 2 years before this without ever having any problems. It is only since Morrisons changed their payment terms that this has happened and they are now 'billing' me twice for every order.

I don't believe, strictly speaking, that this is a quirk of the debit card system; Morrisons changed their terms and the way they take payments, then the problem began. It seems to me, that Morrisons are trying to use the debit card system in a way it was never designed to be used, and this is what is causing the problem.

I am now in the position where I have been told by the customer service team not to use Morrisons online delivery service again for my next grocery delivery, because they can't guarantee that this won't happen again. So now, after qualifying for the offer they began before they changed the payment process, I have around £25 in vouchers to spend in the Morrisons online store and I can't use them ... very frustrating!

mt99

Sorry if this is a silly question but what exactly happens when the reserved payment is shown as 'pending' - does it actually reduce your current account balance? In other words, what is the impact of having a 'pending' payment apart from the annoyance of having the payment shown.


If, for example, you had £50 balance in your current account and a £50 reserved 'pending' payment came it does it mean that the account balance still shows £50 but you can't access the £50, or does the account balance just show zero?

molerat

The pending transactions will reduce the "available balance - actual balance will show £50 but available balance will show £0. It is not a major problem if you are allowed to go overdrawn as it will not be chargeable because you do not actually use it, just reserve it.

System

Morrisons are trying to shift the blame to the bank.

They are just being sloppy - it should cancel the first authorisation if they are going to make a further transaction. It will take about a week to drop off otherwise.

If using a credit card isn't an option, then complain higher up their food chain (highlighting your disability) and insist it's investigated urgently.

DCFC79

Spend less if you shop at Aldi or Lidl.

p00hsticks

DCFC79 wrote: »

Spend less if you shop at Aldi or Lidl.

But as far as I'm aware neither offer online grocery shopping with delivery so possibly not of any use to the OP

King_Of_Fools

There is obviously something going wrong. Debit cards and credit cards are designed to work in in exactly this fashion where an amount can be immediately reserved and then this would be replaced by the actual transaction of a different value. The transaction should go through with the same ID so it should match even through the amounts are different.

Tesco do the same but they only reserve £2. However, this pending amount is removed from my credit card as soon as the actual amount goes through.

So either Morrisons are putting through the actual amount with a different ID and/or the bank is not matching on ID and is just matching on amount. Morrisons are claiming it is the latter but we cannot really be sure that the store staff are following the correct procedures.

There are plenty of other threads on here where people have found pending amounts not clearing correctly so it suggests there are a number of problems and it is not isolated to Morrisons or your bank.

What Morrisons are trying to do should work and in cases like Melindray's should be beneficial as it should stop them going inadvertently overdrawn. If you had £50 in the bank and used your debit card at Tesco for a £40 shop your available balance would be £48 for a day or so. However, there would be nothing stopping you then forgetting about your order and taking £40 out of an ATM. When Tesco charged your the final bill you would be £30 overdrawn!