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Will Brexit lead to mass deportations?
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Veering off topic onto the EHCR, the UK could have its own constitution and bill orf rights that could be even more protective of rights than the EHCR (which I beleive is based to a large extent on UK laws anyway?)
The US, Canada, Australia etc all seem to manage without a consitutional crisis nor the ECHR over riding their own domestic human rights legislation.I think....0 -
Project fear
But the actual quote from the Home Office is correct. Those affected would see their legal status change but should not worry because nothing is likely to happen for some time.
I'm curious - surely UK people born here since 1973 are still EU citizens by being born in the EU? Do they lose that right under Brexit?Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
But the actual quote from the Home Office is correct. Those affected would see their legal status change but should not worry because nothing is likely to happen for some time.
I'm curious - surely UK people born here since 1973 are still EU citizens by being born in the EU? Do they lose that right under Brexit?
Interesting point.0 -
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I'm curious - surely UK people born here since 1973 are still EU citizens by being born in the EU? Do they lose that right under Brexit?
According to the interpretation in the article this will also apply to UK citizens currently residing in another EU country.
You see, this is an important point. To say: "But it will never happen" is misleading for two reasons. 1. Because it can happen at any time. 2. Because any EU country that started to strip UK citizens abroad of their rights would create a dangerous precedent.
Let's say that Brexit goes forward and all of a sudden Spain decides to get tough on British expats and demand they have certain strict criteria to remain in the country. You will say this will not happen, but pretend for a second new elections in Spain come in and a populist government decides to get tough on the Brits. What would you do?
Surely you'll want to do the same with Spanish citizens in UK. But then why only the Spaniards and not, say, the Poles or Lithuanians?
I'm sure some of Brexiters would root for that and some other Brexiters would abhor it.
The Home Office has been clear on that but vote leave have rubbished those claims.0 -
what is an EU citizen?
what are their rights?
Fair point.
Does Freedom Movement apply to citizens born in an EU country or a citizen of a country that is a member of the EU?Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
Fair point.
Does Freedom Movement apply to citizens born in an EU country or a citizen of a country that is a member of the EU?
The only "example" I can think of is Russian citizens in a former USSR republic. I guess they will hold a dual citizenship unless the host country decides that these people no longer hold a full citizenship in the same way some Russian passport holders in Latvia are not considered full citizens of Latvia, yet they reside there.
Edit: on reflection actually I think the EU will just say stuff you and you're no longer EU citizens because the country to which you are a citizen is no longer in the EU, if that makes sense.0 -
one would assume that the concept of an EU citizen (if anything) was a matter of fact
and also that of an ex EU citizen too.0 -
one would assume that the concept of an EU citizen (if anything) was a matter of fact
and also that of an ex EU citizen too.
The Treaty on the Functioning of the EU uses the term EU citizen in many places. It is defined as being a citizen of an EU member state.
So I would assume the rights of being an EU citizen lapses in the EU on leaving.
Whether the rights of EU citizens in the UK post Brexit lapse is for the UK to determine I assume.Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
The Treaty on the Functioning of the EU uses the term EU citizen in many places. It is defined as being a citizen of an EU member state.
So I would assume the rights of being an EU citizen lapses in the EU on leaving.
Whether the rights of EU citizens in the UK post Brexit lapse is for the UK to determine I assume.
well, one would expect the rights of EU citizens to be well defined : I would expect the rights of citizens that were EU citizens but their country has left, to be well defined : there is no reason to assume that they lapse
as I said it should be a matter of fact (EU law) although I don't know the facts
the UK after brexit can make their own rules0
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