Cameron Tax Dodger

Moby

Generali wrote: »

I pay pretty close attention to the data.

That just about sums you up Gen............ only sometimes though!:)

CLAPTON

Moby wrote: »

It's the same old story you look at who thanks Generali and you'll be tempted to think they are like minded individuals who are doing reasonably well out of the status quo. People who think like you and me wouldn't usually come on a site like this in the first place.:)

What you mean people who don't understand how the UK tax systems works but love nevertheless love to falsely accuse people about their tax affairs.
Or people who conveniently forget about the tax avoidance of the Benns.
Or that labour are refusing to support tax transparency for MPs.
Which changes are you supporting then?

Moby

mwpt wrote: »

When you say it is a political choice, you clearly mean that you believe our welfare bill is either at exactly the right levels or must go up and we should never ever under any circumstances reduce it? Ever.

Seems mad to me.

No ...it's a lot more than the welfare bill. it's about cuts upon cuts upon cuts. Its about the degrading of our NHS. its about how I feel I am treated as a public servant doing a difficult job in exacting circs. I get no sympathy on here for that.....just told my pension should be ended blah blah.. So many desk jockeys on this site....who actually don't see how people actually live and are quite distanced from reality as a result. As I said it's the age old story.....you make excuses for whatever the King does providing he's putting silver in your pocket;).

Moby

N1AK wrote: »

No you're living the 2016 Tromking experience and as depressing and unhappy as they may make you it doesn't prove that there's an issue with anything beyond you.

As a general rule when one person is referring to data and the other is referring to vague anecdotal experience it isn't the person using anecdotes that should be taken seriously.

This where arrogance pops in. WHAT DATA! The data that you think is relevant per chance. The data that confirms your beliefs/prejudices? Politicians quote data at each other day after day. There is no gold standard of data.... because if there was we wouldn't be arguing would we! Get a 100 economists together and you'll get a 100 views arguing over the data and what it means!
Too many contributors seem to be desk jockeys...working as accountants, financial services, IT etc. That is not conducive to having a more holistic world view imo. The argument over Cameron shows this. He is defended because technically he hasn't broken the law on his tax, (on the info we have anyway). Is that it....is that end of story? Only if you think like a right wing accountant!

mwpt

Moby wrote: »

No ...it's a lot more than the welfare bill. it's about cuts upon cuts upon cuts. Its about the degrading of our NHS. its about how I feel I am treated as a public servant doing a difficult job in exacting circs. I get no sympathy on here for that.....just told my pension should be ended blah blah.. So many desk jockeys on this site....who actually don't see how people actually live and are quite distanced from reality as a result. As I said it's the age old story.....you make excuses for whatever the King does providing he's putting silver in your pocket;).

I'm sorry that you are not treated well. Do you mean by people of the public looking down on you? Screw them.

If you mean in regards to pay, you might like to know that many private sector employees haven't had pay rises in years and last time I checked the median private sector pay was lower than median public sector.

I have some overlap with your views by the way. Unlike some of the more staunch free-marketers on here, I actually favour a universal basic income. I've noted why on several occasions.

CLAPTON

Moby wrote: »

No ...it's a lot more than the welfare bill. it's about cuts upon cuts upon cuts. Its about the degrading of our NHS. its about how I feel I am treated as a public servant doing a difficult job in exacting circs. I get no sympathy on here for that.....just told my pension should be ended blah blah.. So many desk jockeys on this site....who actually don't see how people actually live and are quite distanced from reality as a result. As I said it's the age old story.....you make excuses for whatever the King does providing he's putting silver in your pocket;).

give us some figures about the reduction in the benifets budget and the reduction in the NHS budgets
but think how use that that money from the Benns would have been if they hadn't 'fiddled' their taxes.

Moby

CLAPTON wrote: »

give us some figures about the reduction in the benifets budget and the reduction in the NHS budgets
but think how use that that money from the Benns would have been if they hadn't 'fiddled' their taxes.

You obviously banged this out so fast Clapton....you forgot to make any sense:rotfl:Pressing your buttons again am I?
By the way I thought you'd like to know I had lunch with Gerry Adams yesterday and he told me that Jezza was a dirty turncoat who had sold out on his revolutionary values by becoming Labour leader!

CLAPTON

Moby wrote: »

You obviously banged this out so fast Clapton....you forgot to make any sense:rotfl:Pressing your buttons again am I?
By the way I thought you'd like to know I had lunch with Gerry Adams yesterday and he told me that Jezza was a dirty turncoat who had sold out on his revolutionary values by becoming Labour leader!

I was civilly asking you about the size in the cuts in the benefits spending
and the cuts in the NHS spending under the tories to which you seemed to have referred:

and also offering you the opportunity to compare and contrast tax wise, the law abiding Cameron with the equally law abiding Tony Benn.
Basically the question is who fiddled the maximum money from the hard pressed people of this country.

No idea why you wish to joke about a killer but I guess that compared to Cameron, Gerry is a saint in your eyes.

chewmylegoff

Moby wrote: »

That's rich coming from someone who probably knows very little about what fairness is!

I acknowledge I don't understand tax law. I said that at the start. Perhaps you work in financial services and do have a greater grasp of it but that's not the point. We are in areas where experts themselves disagree. We are in areas of conflict between what is strictly legal against what is morally correct. The line between tax evasion and tax avoidance is murky. Rich people like Cameron employ people to give them advice on how to take advantage of this! I would say ....tax avoidance by investing in ISA's in the UK is morally acceptable and perfectly legitimate.....whereas the use of overseas havens is at the other end of the scale! What is the motive behind such vehicles? Is everyone liable for tax in the UK able to take advantage of the same opportunities? I read somewhere you had to have 50k up front to invest in Blairmore! Surely when money is invested in such places it is not liable for tax in the UK? and surely that is detrimental to the greater good?

The reason why Cameron is a lying scumbag is because he knew this and tried to hide from us what he is. He didn't want us to know about his circumstances because it doesn't fit with the public image he wants us to have of him. He is a fraud!

It seems to me that despite acknowledging that you don't understand tax that you are insistent that Cameron has avoided some despite there being no evidence that he has. It's pretty clear that you don't care whether or not he has done anything wrong.

Many funds have a minimum investment requirement - this is both because they don't want to deal with the admin involved in reporting to lots of small time investors and also because their funds can only be marketed to 'professional' investors which basically means people with lots of money who sign a disclaimer that they aren't retail clients.

In any case this is nothing to do with tax avoidance. You're right that no tax is payable on the initial investment that a person makes when they invest in an offshore fund. The same applies to an investment made into an onshore fund, investment capital is not taxed - gains are taxed when you sell the investment if they exceed you annual CGT allowance. Sorry to disappoint you but he didn't avoid any tax that he would have paid if Blairmore was onshore.

I'm not sure why you keep going on about morality either. Why is it immoral to invest money and pay tax on the investment income?

You think an ISA is ok - if he had invested in an ISA (or a precursor tax wrapper) he wouldn't have paid any tax on the investment income or gains. That is ok with you, it seems, but a fully declared offshore investment where tax is paid on the income is not for some reason.

Would you rather he had invested in an ISA and paid no tax instead? Would that have helped the greater good?

Somerset

chewmylegoff wrote: »

It seems to me that despite acknowledging that you don't understand tax that you are insistent that Cameron has avoided some despite there being no evidence that he has. It's pretty clear that you don't care whether or not he has done anything wrong.

You aren't getting the subtleties. You aren't thinking holistically.


The poster acknowledges technically (spit) he hasn't broken the law on his tax. But maybe he thought about it, or a relative thought about it, or he might in the future, or it was a tuesday. So technically he's done nothing wrong but holistically, he has. Kafkaesque.

I can't remember the last time I had a conversation with HMRC and told them whilst technically I owe the tax, holistically I didn't, so would they drop their demand.