The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

45:55 means that 20% more people voted No than Yes.

It wasn't a trivial margin. In an Australian General Election or a US Presidential election that would be a decent victory. With only 2 names on the card there aren't many choices!

It's the 37.6% figure that I was questioning, as if those that don't go out and vote actually still count as somehow voting ? They don't, because they didn't. 45/55% 18 months ago. Yes needed another 191,968.5 votes to even the score. Not that many when you think about it in those terms.

Tromking

Thrugelmir wrote: »

What's going to change?

Well speaking personally I'm guessing not much.
There will be a mindset post-Brexit I'm sure where the UK state will be on the defensive. I cannot conceive of a situation where the separatists will be allowed to destabilise the state further. Had there not already been a chance to leave less than two years ago and the then SNP leader not declared that it was a once in generation vote then the current SNP plan might have more leverage in the event of Brexit. However it won't stop them fostering a grievance in the hope that a vote perhaps post 2030 is more winnable though.

Generali

Shakethedisease wrote: »

It's the 37.6% figure that I was questioning, as if those that don't go out and vote actually still count as somehow voting ? They don't, because they didn't. 45/55% 18 months ago. Yes needed another 191,968.5 votes to even the score. Not that many when you think about it in those terms.

A couple of hundred thousand would be very little in China or India. In Scotland though, where everyone has basically voted.....

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

Are they electioneering or acting as constitutional experts?

I note they don't state which budget a new independence vote should come from. I can't think of a devolved area of the budget which could legitimately pay for a new referendum.

The constitution rests with Westminster. The means and legislation to call another Scotland wide advisory referendum lies with the Scottish Govt. That's what Salmond was absolutely going to do last time round. I doubt Sturgeon has any differing feelings on the matter of calling a referendum if it looks like Scots want one.

Theresa and Frank don't seem to be questioning it at all. Though I only posted it to wind you up a bit. Sorry. :cool:

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

A couple of hundred thousand would be very little in China or India. In Scotland though, where everyone has basically voted.....

No, no only 37.6% of the available electorate voted Yes. Plenty of room for improvement there.

Shakethedisease

Tromking wrote: »

Well speaking personally I'm guessing not much.
There will be a mindset post-Brexit I'm sure where the UK state will be on the defensive. I cannot conceive of a situation where the separatists will be allowed to destabilise the state further. Had there not already been a chance to leave less than two years ago and the then SNP leader not declared that it was a once in generation vote then the current SNP plan might have more leverage in the event of Brexit. However it won't stop them fostering a grievance in the hope that a vote perhaps post 2030 is more winnable though.

Hmmm, you talk about it as if the Scots electorate don't have a say in any of this. Which is a little strange, and Salmond is only one man, not the electorate.

I have to say that am not quite seeing it that if the polls start moving upwards towards Scottish independence, the electorate get more and more vocal calling for one, and even Scottish Labour soften their stance... that Sturgeon will meekly turn round and say 'sorry everyone, Cameron and staunch unionist politicians say we're not allowed one... I can't imagine why, So that's that'. That's not really ever going to happen is it ?

These are all pretty big if's right now anyway. But at the end of the day it won't the the SNP's call to make. They'll have to wait to make their move only when the electorate want it.

Tromking

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Hmmm, you talk about it as if the Scots electorate don't have a say in any of this. Which is a little strange, and Salmond is only one man, not the electorate.

I have to say that am not quite seeing it that if the polls start moving upwards towards Scottish independence, the electorate get more and more vocal calling for one, and even Scottish Labour soften their stance... that Sturgeon will meekly turn round and say 'sorry everyone, Cameron and staunch unionist politicians say we're not allowed one... I can't imagine why, So that's that'. That's not really ever going to happen is it ?

These are all pretty big if's right now anyway. But at the end of the day it won't the the SNP's call to make. They'll have to wait to make their move only when the electorate want it.

The Scots and Salmond had their say just a few short months ago remember, and as usual you chose to ignore those Scots who voted to stay in the Union. For every Nationalist bemoaning the lack of a referendum, there will be a Unionist aggrieved at the thought of another one.
The Frank Field "another country" comment earlier was interesting, it says to me that Scotland is the new Ulster. Expect a binary choice in Scottish elections in the future, Nationalist and Unionist. It will probably start with Ruth Davidson becoming leader of the opposition.

Johnsmith2016

scotland would ALREADY be dead if it had been silly enough to go alone. Enough Said

Generali

Shakethedisease wrote: »

No, no only 37.6% of the available electorate voted Yes. Plenty of room for improvement there.

Well precisely....

Shakethedisease

Tromking wrote: »

The Scots and Salmond had their say just a few short months ago remember, and as usual you chose to ignore those Scots who voted to stay in the Union. For every Nationalist bemoaning the lack of a referendum, there will be a Unionist aggrieved at the thought of another one.
The Frank Field "another country" comment earlier was interesting, it says to me that Scotland is the new Ulster. Expect a binary choice in Scottish elections in the future, Nationalist and Unionist. It will probably start with Ruth Davidson becoming leader of the opposition.

No one is choosing to ignore No voters. That was my point, you only talked about the SNP and completely ignored the wishes of the electorate. Concentrating instead on the 'view' of one man who isn't even part of the Scottish Govt anymore as some sort of absolute.

Should the Scottish electorate at some point in the future, indicate that a majority now wish to leave the UK. Then those wishes should also be respected, and lo.. a second referendum. :beer:

Ruth Davidson has never won an election in her political life. She survives via media, a fun personality, trying to ignore as much as possible that she's part of the Conservative party and photo op's riding tanks and buffalo. Good luck with that.