The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

Tromking

I noted with interest Shakey’s glee at posting the recent poll showing Tory members nihilistic attitudes toward the Union if Brexit is denied, which goes to show for me at least that the biggest threat to the Union is not Scots voting for independence but the English. Not least because they have a real grievance and not a SNP imaginary one.
Unfortunately for the SNP I have feeling that the more the English contemplate the end of the Union the more Scots will embrace it.

westernpromise

Tromking wrote: »

I noted with interest Shakey’s glee at posting the recent poll showing Tory members nihilistic attitudes toward the Union if Brexit is denied, which goes to show for me at least that the biggest threat to the Union is not Scots voting for independence but the English. Not least because they have a real grievance and not a SNP imaginary one.
Unfortunately for the SNP I have feeling that the more the English contemplate the end of the Union the more Scots will embrace it.

Genuine question. What are the actual advantages to England of the union?

Tromking

westernpromise wrote: »

Genuine question. What are the actual advantages to England of the union?

To be honest apart from the emotional and cultural ties, I can’t think of too many.

zagubov

westernpromise wrote: »

Genuine question. What are the actual advantages to England of the union?

Bigger tax base, bigger market for goods and services, increased food and energy security, bigger territorial waters, nuclear defence site, bigger source of degree-trained workers...

loadsacash

bigger source of degree-trained workers

That's interesting - Scotland and England have roughly the same number o% of population with degrees - are you saying that there is a Brain Drain from Scotland to England? I guess those people wont be voting for Independence then!

NCC-1701

Without exception every single friend, relative and former colleague who voted No in the indyref say they will vote No again if there is an indyref2. Indeed I know two Yes voters who would now vote No. There is no great appetite in Scotland for a second vote except among the losers.

baldelectrician

NCC-1701 wrote: »

Without exception every single friend, relative and former colleague who voted No in the indyref say they will vote No again if there is an indyref2. Indeed I know two Yes voters who would now vote No. There is no great appetite in Scotland for a second vote except among the losers.

That might be your opinion (which is perfectly valid where you are and with the people you meet) but the point is that it is up to the Scottish people.

We live in a paliamentary democracy where one parliament cannot bind the next one and the Scottish Parliament has a mandate for a second indy ref.

Here is Alex Salmond explaining just that to Jemery Paxman

https://youtu.be/rDPNvaX4zCg

Shakethedisease

Tromking wrote: »

I noted with interest Shakey’s glee at posting the recent poll showing Tory members nihilistic attitudes toward the Union if Brexit is denied, which goes to show for me at least that the biggest threat to the Union is not Scots voting for independence but the English. Not least because they have a real grievance and not a SNP imaginary one.
Unfortunately for the SNP I have feeling that the more the English contemplate the end of the Union the more Scots will embrace it.

It wasn't glee.. it was outright belly laughter at the likes of Deerin, Massie, Dunt and Farquharson having meltdowns on Twitter over it. The cold hard realisation that the myths they've been slavishly and earnestly punting since 2011 are all total and utter tosh. The average Tory member would have them protesting and screaming about 'pooling and sharing' and the entirety of Scotland out the UK door in 2 seconds flat if it meant a no deal Brexit going ahead.

Hilarious watching what 50% of Scotland already know only too well, finally dawn on those who make a living from selling the UK to Scotland in national newspapers and blogs.

Shakethedisease

NCC-1701 wrote: »

Without exception every single friend, relative and former colleague who voted No in the indyref say they will vote No again if there is an indyref2. Indeed I know two Yes voters who would now vote No. There is no great appetite in Scotland for a second vote except among the losers.

You'll be getting one anyway. Appetite or not. You'll have can have your say then like everyone else and at least we'll know the answer between Brexit or independence.

We're not governed via YouGov and Survation polls just yet. Only real votes in real elections and referendums. So we'll be having one of those rather than basing democracy on the latest YouGov 'take' and newspaper spin of any old figures which match the editorials.

zagubov

loadsacash wrote: »

bigger source of degree-trained workers

That's interesting - Scotland and England have roughly the same number o% of population with degrees - are you saying that there is a Brain Drain from Scotland to England? I guess those people wont be voting for Independence then!

Not necessarily. The HE-educated population % in Scottish cities is way more than south of the Tweed. Whether they were all trained locally or came from outside is unknown (to me at least).